Trying to designing a QUEIT plumbing system

lessthanlights · #1 09/16/2006, 05:43 PM

I need about 400-600 gph through my sump. The sump calculator says I need a minimum of 1 inch for the drain. But I wanted to bounce few questions around before I commit to drilling. Being quiet is my main concern at the moment and the overflow is a calfo.

Does one larger drain vs two smaller ones make for a quieter system? Say 1.5 or 2 inches?

Will I need a durso if the drain bulkhead is not completely submerged? Or is it better to have a durso and the drain submerged?

Will two 3/4 returns with 3.5ft of head powered by a Mag 9.5 be sufficient?

vishboy · #2 09/16/2006, 07:20 PM

Here's a head-loss calculator. Just plug in your numbers and your pump, and it will tell you how much flow you lose.

http://www.reefcentral.com/calc/hlc2.php

hahnmeister · #3 09/17/2006, 01:04 AM

Yeah, you should still use a durso or some other method to muzzle the standpipe. One larger drain vs. two smaller makes no diff for noise... it depends on the overall area of the pipe cross-section. Two 1" pipes are about the same internal area as one 1.5" pipe. So a 2" pipe would still be more... and yes, this can help with noise.

more than enough. if you really want to cut out noise, try the 'low flow' method. A pump that gives you 150-250 gph would be enough to run the overflow/sump with. It will also cut out alot of wasted wattage and heat. Then you just provide in tank flow with powerheads/closed loop/etc. Otherwise your overflow might sound like a toilet even with the durso. If you lower the throughput, it helps greatly.

There are a few other methods as well if you really want to know, but thats a start.

jamesBS · #4 09/17/2006, 07:30 AM

i think two are better then one because if something happens to one

Flobajob · #5 09/17/2006, 09:24 AM

You might want to check out Herbie's method:

http://archive.reefcentral.com/forum...hreadid=344892

lessthanlights · #6 09/17/2006, 11:46 AM

Thanks flobajob thats the info is was looking for.

Flobajob · #7 09/17/2006, 12:05 PM

Glad I could be of help

hahnmeister · #8 09/17/2006, 03:01 PM

I wouldnt do that 'Herbie' method. Its too easy to end up with an overflow.

Flobajob · #9 09/17/2006, 03:54 PM

Isn't that why you have 2 drains?? One main one that is restricted, and one emergency one that normally is not in use.

hahnmeister · #10 09/17/2006, 04:08 PM

Thats true. But what Herbie did is very hard to replicate, and can be impossible for many. The pipe diameter, distance dropped, and throughput all heve to be just right, or the system will constantly surge, or clog with air, etc.

Its just not very reliable to try to get valves to do this. Sure, there is a backup pipe... but whats is the point? In most of these cases, if the pipe diameter is too large, it will end up sucking in air as well and defeating the whole system. DNA uses a similar system on his 300+g overflow, but hes only running 100gph through his overflow, so its much easier to control.

I suppose, Im just trying to say, its just too hard to do and get right most of the time.

Flobajob · #11 09/17/2006, 04:22 PM

I was under the impression that although it required some tweaking, the method was fairly reliable - I have yet to hear any disaster stories from anyone using it (maybe I just wasn't paying enough attention though). Plus isn't the method "self balancing" in so much as when the water level starts to rise, the pressure increases and more water flows through the drain, and vice versa when the level drops too low.

Also, I spoke to the owner of my LFS (who seems to really know his stuff) and he recommended essentially the same method, even though he hadn't heard of reef central, and he had all his tanks plumbed like that.

AndyL · #12 09/17/2006, 05:13 PM

I've been running the herbie on various tanks for over a year now - never had a single problem. In fact the Durso's and Stockmans I've used in the past have been more headaches.

Basically you've got one primary overflow, add a valve (ball/gate) throttle it back so that the water level remains constant. The emergency is just that - in case a snail / caulerpa gets in and blocks the primary. Quiet as anything - only noise I hear is from the pumps.

ctreefer · #13 09/18/2006, 09:48 AM

I agree with Andy, I've had one running for close to 1 year with no problems and quiet as can be. I think the few people that had problems were running very high volumes on large tanks i.e. over 180 gallons. It will be my method of choice from now on. Also, even if the water level gets a little high in your overflow, the excess will drain down into the emergency overflow at such a slow rate that you don't even hear that.

Pbrown3701 · #14 09/18/2006, 10:11 AM

me 3. No problems. EASY!