120 Gallon Help.. Fish Dying!!!

[DarthSimon]

Guys, Sorry for long post... I am at the point of total frustration!!!
I currently have a 120 Gallon tank setup... It's a 48x24x24... Running a mixed Reef.... Lighting is 300 Watts of Metal Halide.... 8 hours a day timer... Filtration is a 36 gallon Oceanic Sump under the tank... Running a 9 Watt UV Sterilizer... Remora Protein Skimmer, and bags of good Carbon... Also running a PhosBan Reactor. All in sump....

Tank has been setup for 12 weeks... I transfered from a 55 Gallon tank.. Brought over 70 LBS live rock, fish and corals...

All Corals are looking good.... All of my existing fish are good.... I also added 50 LBS of Live rock to the tank... So I have a total of 120....

Here was my fish list that moved over....

Kole Tang 4 Inches
Lineatus Wrasse Super Male 5 Inches
2 Pecula Clowns
Mystery Wrasse 3.5 Inches
One Neon Goby
One Healthy Fat Scooter Blenny Started 1 Inch. Now 3 Inches
CopperBand ButterFly 3 Inches
4 Green Chromis


I waited approx 7 weeks... Never saw the tank cycle or recycle... We also used 40 LBS of new Live Sand (crushed Coral) and 20 Lbs of my old tank to seed...


Water Parms over that 7 weeks have stayed super stable..
Temps 79-80
Salinity 1.024
Ph 8.2
Calcium 420
Trates and Tries 0....
Ammonia 0
Phosphates 0

I'm using liquid test kits for all... No strips..... Have done water changes.. Buying pre Mixed Salt Water from LFS.. There water is RODI first... I also buy my topoff water there... RODI.....


Around the 8 week mark, I decided to add some fish... Water Parms looked good to me....I drip acclimate all my fish for 1.5 hours..I first started with a Bellus Angel and Dejardini Sailfin tang.... Both fish seemed to be ok after 2-3 days... Spots and whitish look gone... Eating well... Tang ate Nori after 30 seconds and everything else.... After around 1 week I noticed some Velvet on both of the fish... The tang shook it off after 3 days... The Bellus did as well... But the Bellus never really ate well though. He would only eat red tetra pellets.... Would not touch the meaty preparations the other fish ate... Bellus Angel after about a week started breathing heavy and was dead within ten days...

I then tried a Blue Jaw Trigger... Same fate... Did well for 2-3 days .. By the 5th day, saw some signs of Velvet... Dead breathing heavy under rocks by approx. day 5-6....

Then my CopperBand Butterfly gets one of his eyes punctured, and never recovered... Dead within 3 days of the injury infection I pressume...

So after this. I let my tank sit for 21 days.... Let things calm down...
I put a 2.5 inch Regal Angel into the tank Monday of this week... He was eating mysis at the store, so I thought I had a shot at a good fish... After a little harassing from my 2 tangs, and a slight tail bite, he was doing fine... He did stay in a small area on the right side of the tank... swimming normal, and looked healthy.. He did swim up and down from the bottom to the top of the tank alot.. Up near my Korila Power Head.. Feeding time, I would spot feed him some Mysis and he would eat a few...

This morning, he is 1 hour away from his death... Bottom under a rock, breathing heavy, Back fins curled up.... He was gone 1 hour later....

Guys...
What the heck am I doing wrong?? My parms are all good...
My Kole does give all new arrivials a hard time, but all my older fish always got past the day or 2 barrage... Settled in, and were fine....

NOw. All of my other fish are eating, healthy, good color, and show 0 signs of disease....

Besides my Sump's pump which is 1100 Gallons per Hour, I'm running 2 Korila #3's and 2 #2's... So I have good movement... I clocked it in at Almost 4,000 total Gallons per Hour...

What gives...
Thx for help in advance!!

[DarthSimon]

Anyone have any thought??

[moses13]

Quarantine???

[dcombs44]

Agreed. Do you not quarantine any of your fish?

IMO you've set yourself up for disaster by not QTing your livestock.

Each fish should get 3 weeks alone in QT with close observation for any signs of disease or infection before even considering entering the display.

If your last fish don't make it, I'd leave the tank fish free for 6-8 weeks, and set up a Quarantine tank for any new arrivals.

[DarthSimon]

Guys,
I just don't have room for a quarantine tank... And I do understand what you guys are saying.... Why is it that all my other 12-13 fish are healthy and eating?? You would say all these fish i'm bringing in are doomed to start, If they have all died?? All my fish are from the same store... When I was running my 55, I never had problems like this adding new fish...

[dcombs44]

It will eventually bite you even if you've always had good "luck". Luck being key word.

Your other fish may be healthy and strong enough to fight off infection, but I wouldn't continue to chance it. I don't have the room either, but I still use a 10 gallon tank to QT my fish.

[DarthSimon]

Let's say I did setup a 10 Gallon QT, could I lets say, put a Blue Jaw trigger in there for 4-6 weeks??I could do a ten, somehow....

[jjakes24]

Another reason for your problems may be that all your fish have established territories and just won;t put up with new arrivals. If you aren't going to QT, then at least turn the lights off the tank for a day when you first introduce a new fish and see if that helps them get a little more established with the other livestock. I think your new additions may be getting bullied around which is leading to their death.

[dcombs44]

That's the difference between you and I. I have a 55 gallon display, so I don't have many large fish, so a 10 works for me. In your situation, you would need a larger qt.

I just keep my tank stored away, and when I need it, I get it out and set it up on the floor. Not the safest bet, but it's my only option in my apartment.

[kilmca]

It might be you already have the maximum number of fish your tank can support. It sounds like there is just not enough space for new fish.

2 Tangs in a 120 is about max IMO. You also have those 2 wrasses that aren't small. Tangs need space to grow.

You might be able to add some fish that are small and stay small, 2" or less in length. Maybe a Clown goby for expample, some people say they eat SPS polyps so be careful.

I have 16 fish in my 200 gallon tank and 6 of those fish only get up to 2" in length. But the 3 tangs I have (clown, blue & saifin) will get very large.

[DarthSimon]

My Kole does give any new entry a hard time... He is a real pain in the rear end... He did go after my latest regal that died... It did calm down a tad by the 2nd day, but I guess it was to late....

Would another wrasse be a more viable option?? If i wanted to add anything further??

[James983]

Darth, your also trying difficult fish in the Copperbanded and Juv. Regal.

[DarthSimon]

The Copperband I had was 1 year old, from my 55..... He was healthy and eating any meaty foods... Mysid, Bloodworms, and Krill.....

[Tommy3492]

ok so let me get this straight, your fish has got a velvelt susbstance on it?? ( white ?) and breaths heavely and swmins eraticlly?, is this is true i would presume a internal parasite infection, ive noticed from the past that those are common behaviors of fish with parasite, what are the exact symptoms? and may be your LFS...

[DarthSimon]

All of these fish have been from the same store... Which has a good rep... Also all of these fish that died, were from a 1 month period....

All the other fish in my tank were from same store, but were bought over 1 year ago....

The tank system they have is all running off the same water....

[Craig Lambert]

Originally posted by kilmca
It might be you already have the maximum number of fish your tank can support. It sounds like there is just not enough space for new fish.

2 Tangs in a 120 is about max IMO. You also have those 2 wrasses that aren't small. Tangs need space to grow.

You might be able to add some fish that are small and stay small, 2" or less in length. Maybe a Clown goby for expample, some people say they eat SPS polyps so be careful.

I have 16 fish in my 200 gallon tank and 6 of those fish only get up to 2" in length. But the 3 tangs I have (clown, blue & saifin) will get very large.

I agree with this. By my count you had 12 fish in the 120 and then added 3 more at the 8 week mark. Many of these fish are quite sizeable. I think you're overstocked. I also think that an Aqua-C Remora isn't much of a skimmer for a 120G tank. (I run an EV-180 on a 75G). I'm suspect of your test kits. I think you have ammonia in the tank and an ongoing cycle. Just my 2 cents worth..

[DarthSimon]

Yes, I do know I need a new skimmer...

I'm using Liquid test kits for all..

[tinmanny]

I also believe that inches of fish is another way to count tankmembers and you have definately got enough fish
also tangs are not very friendly to new entries
Your good reputalbe fish store may have picked up something sence last year
I have two damsels and they beat a a smaller newcomer to death even though I had the lights off and chased them away from him.
and last but not least a quarentine tank is small and it is the best investment you now have a largertank and that gets expensive when things go wrong
Good luck
Manny