Elegance Coral theory

[znut Reefer]

Ok, I will give it an Seachems iodine dip. There's nothing to loose at this point. I'll post the results either way. Thanks for the help. Hopefully it will help this poor elegance.

Yes it does look pretty bad, wished I had known I would have already tried the dip.

[elegance coral]

Originally posted by znut Reefer
Ok, I will give it an Seachems iodine dip. There's nothing to loose at this point. I'll post the results either way. Thanks for the help. Hopefully it will help this poor elegance.

Yes it does look pretty bad, wished I had known I would have already tried the dip.

Are you able to post a pic of the Elegance?

[znut Reefer]

Yes I can, I would need to upload it to photobucket first. Whats you email and I will send you a pic of it. And then post it later if you want me to. PM your email.

Thanks

[jman77]

here's the pic of mine...got it for 15 bucks at a LFS cause it was almost 100% in coral heaven, now it's grown 2 more mouths and has killed one snail that fell on it ...lol

[znut Reefer]

I don't have a pic of what it looks like now. I will get it and post it after my lights come on later. But here is a pic of it the day after I got it. It looks alot worse now, and all sunken in. I would say it's close to 100% in coral heaven the way it looks now.

[elegance coral]

Originally posted by jman77
here's the pic of mine...got it for 15 bucks at a LFS cause it was almost 100% in coral heaven, now it's grown 2 more mouths and has killed one snail that fell on it ...lol

WOW! There is absolutely nothing wrong with that coral! I wish more people would believe that these corals will survive and be healthy if they were just kept in a lower light environment. I buy sick Elegance corals from my LFS and bring them back from deaths door and the owner will still not change the way he does things. He gets Elegance corals in and cooks them by putting them in the tank with all the other corals like sps's. I guess he still believes that killer protozoans are to blame. Sometimes I think this quest of mine to get the truth about what these corals are going through out to the hobbyists is more than a simple hobbyist can do. I fear that until one of the reef gods come out and tell people that this is the problem, not much will change. People will continue to put these corals in bright light and when they die they will just blame some unknown killer protozoans.

[jman77]

yes .... i'm with you on this elegance coral,

When I got the coral home in went straight into the sump, which is lit by 2 x 65w 9700k that are over 3 years old. I can't imagine that the par they are putting out is much at all, and yet the coral bounced back and is growing. Like you said these corals are deep water, and LPS on top of that. They don't need or can handle being put under these intense lights we use now in the hobby. People have to look back to when Elegance corals were considered easy and hard to kill,,, they use RO florescent bulbs and air driven skimmers( if that)

[elegance coral]

Originally posted by znut Reefer
I don't have a pic of what it looks like now. I will get it and post it after my lights come on later. But here is a pic of it the day after I got it. It looks alot worse now, and all sunken in. I would say it's close to 100% in coral heaven the way it looks now.

I wish you would have found this thread before you got the coral. We would have had a much better chance of saving it. Don't give up though. I have seen them pull through some nasty stuff. Keep it out of bright lights what ever you do. After bright lights infection is the big enemy at this point. I'll check to see if you were able to post the pic in the morning.

[znut Reefer]

Ok, I know wished I had seen this thread sooner too. And I do wish I had not bought the elegance on line. I trusted the vendor when he said it had been doing great for 2 months. Well here is what the elegance looks now. I'll be dipping it in a few mins. I will put it under the PC lighting and see how does. I'll keep up the hope it will pull through.

[elegance coral]

It's hard to tell from the pic but it looks like an infection may have already set in. When you dipped it, did tissue come off the coral? It looked like there may be some viable tissue on the far end of the coral. If so you could try fragging the coral to discard the dead and decomposing tissue. I'm sorry, but from the pic it really doesn't look good.

[leggy]

I recently bought a elegance coral from my LFS for £60 (US$120) as it was near deaths door - looked like znut Reefer first pic ...very sad coral. I normally only go for healthy corals but with elegance in UK, the ban has been lifted for only a few months on these beautiful corals and to see one in such a state was heartbreaking (yes elegance are my favourite coral).
Got her home and placed her in my nano QT for 2 weeks feeding fortified cyclopeze and tiny bits of shrimp and clams. After 2 weeks I placed her in my 50 gal tank 10k T5 lighting - feeding her on fortified mysis, 5mm cut shrimps and razor clams.
She is I believe on the road to recovery - she comes out around 3-4 cm now and seems to have bonded with her skeleton .. really thought she may do a bail out when I saw her in the LFS.
Her green colour is comming back - before she had lost all green colour apart from her tenticles.
She has company at least now with three other elegance - one which had all its pink tips nibbled off by a maroon clown who decided to host her - they are now nearly all back but it was really hard to feed her when she couldnt grab the food as her tips were missing.
They will be all moved to my 200 gal aquarium in the next several months and face the halides - but it will be a very slow proceedure .. but woth it in the end

[John Kelly]

Originally posted by elegance coral
I picked up 3 very sick Elegance corals from my LFS just over a week ago. I picked them up for $25 each because they were on deaths door. Here are pics of the day after placing them in my tank and at one week.

Day one

week one

Day one

Week one

Week one


They still have a long way to go, but as long as they are improving I'm happy.

Earlier in the thread, I was trying to point to the possibility of a "bleaching" stage that could occur if these corals were being placed under lighting that was too intense. It appears that two of the three that you bought are bleached or at least lacking a good deal of zooxanthellae. The one that still contains some zooxanthellae was probably on it's way to being bleached. Luckily, it looks like the amount of light that they were previously under wasn't enough to quickly damage them. Depending on the intensity of light that the corals are initially placed under, oxidative stress due to way too much light can cause quick damage and an internal sunburn, which would kill the coral a lot faster and also have the potential to cause internal infection, OR if the lighting was still too intense, but not intense enough to quickly fry the coral, the light can cause slow damage which will eventually kill the coral over a longer period of time. With a slower form of oxidative stress, there is usually a bleaching stage where the coral loses it's zooxanthellae first before it forever remains retracted and dies. Less intense lighting and manual feeding of the corals becomes critical when they are bleached.

As your research moves forward, try to see if there is a slight difference in the coloration of the fluorescent proteins between Elegance that are more sensitive to light and less sensitive. The more sensitive corals may contain a little more of a yellowish-green colored protein where the less sensitive corals may have a little more of a blueish-green colored protein. It would be nice if a subtle but visible difference could be established between shallow and deep water Elegance (ie. purple tips vs. pink tips).

[John Kelly]

Originally posted by elegance coral
I fear that until one of the reef gods come out and tell people that this is the problem, not much will change.

That's not going to happen for a long time. They have to prove it to themselves first, and even then they won't give credit or link to any of your threads. Calfo will eventually incorporate it into the advise he gives out when asked about Elegance. He's good about gathering correct information, adding it to his collective, and dispensing it around the world.

EDIT: Write an article and submit it to ReefKeeping mag and Advanced Aquarist's mag. Also, if you put enough info together, you could give a presentation at IMAC or MACNA.

[elegance coral]

Originally posted by John Kelly
That's not going to happen for a long time. They have to prove it to themselves first, and even then they won't give credit or link to any of your threads. Calfo will eventually incorporate it into the advise he gives out when asked about Elegance. He's good about gathering the correct information, adding it to his collective, and dispensing it around the world.

I know that none of the reef gods would say that I had anything to do with them changing their minds. I doubt that any of them will publicly change their position on this at all. I'm not doing this for some pat on the back. Most people don't even know my real name. This is my coral, and I honestly just want people to be able to keep them alive. If it means that some reef god takes all the credit for the research I have done than so be it. They are in a much better position to get the truth out to the hobby than I am. It would be nice to be recognized for the work I have done, but I agree with you. That's not going to happen. After going all over the web telling people that the gods made a mistake, they aren't going to be telling people that I was right. I hope your right about Mr. Calfo but I have my doubts. I don't know him personally so I can't speak of what he will or will not do. I find it hard to believe that any of the gods want to be the first to say that they were all wrong on this. There is a lot of politics involved. It wouldn't be a good Carrier move to go against the other gods no matter who you are. I think they must know about this thread, but I haven't seen any of them take part. So, I guess I'll just keep saving a few corals here and there and find a way to be content with knowing I'm doing all I can. If I can come up with the money I will start a sight similar to yours WWW.goniopora.ORG (plug ). Then I should be able to reach more people.

[tangwang]

Darrell, you have pm..

[Serioussnaps]

Originally posted by znut Reefer
Ok, I know wished I had seen this thread sooner too. And I do wish I had not bought the elegance on line. I trusted the vendor when he said it had been doing great for 2 months. Well here is what the elegance looks now. I'll be dipping it in a few mins. I will put it under the PC lighting and see how does. I'll keep up the hope it will pull through.

Never trust online vendors! I always hear "oh hes a great guy." Makes me sick...I dont care what vendor it is...it is a business. Sorry for the rant..I just get sick of the onine touters on here sometimes

[znut Reefer]

I did dip the elegance last night. And have put it under PC lighting to see if it may recover. No when I dipped it no tissue came off. Just some slime. That was Elegance poop or something. But did not look like tissue when it was dipped.

It does look very bad. Maybe I can beat the infection?? I'll keep you updated.

[jman77]

znut,

if it were me , i would leave it alone in the sump and wouldn't dip it again. I think dipping will do more harm than good at this point

[znut Reefer]

Hi jman,

Ok, I only dipped it last night for the first time. I won't dip it again and see how it fairs. Thanks for the advice.

[Serioussnaps]

Originally posted by znut Reefer
Hi jman,

Ok, I only dipped it last night for the first time. I won't dip it again and see how it fairs. Thanks for the advice.

Good luck Fonda

[znut Reefer]

Thanks Serioussnaps. Sure looks like I'm going to need it. I don't have much hope for it at this point.

[elegance coral]

Originally posted by leggy
I recently bought a elegance coral from my LFS for £60 (US$120) as it was near deaths door - looked like znut Reefer first pic ...very sad coral. I normally only go for healthy corals but with elegance in UK, the ban has been lifted for only a few months on these beautiful corals and to see one in such a state was heartbreaking (yes elegance are my favourite coral).
Got her home and placed her in my nano QT for 2 weeks feeding fortified cyclopeze and tiny bits of shrimp and clams. After 2 weeks I placed her in my 50 gal tank 10k T5 lighting - feeding her on fortified mysis, 5mm cut shrimps and razor clams.
She is I believe on the road to recovery - she comes out around 3-4 cm now and seems to have bonded with her skeleton .. really thought she may do a bail out when I saw her in the LFS.
Her green colour is comming back - before she had lost all green colour apart from her tenticles.
She has company at least now with three other elegance - one which had all its pink tips nibbled off by a maroon clown who decided to host her - they are now nearly all back but it was really hard to feed her when she couldnt grab the food as her tips were missing.
They will be all moved to my 200 gal aquarium in the next several months and face the halides - but it will be a very slow proceedure .. but woth it in the end

I recently posted a thread in the Uk Aquarium Fish Forum. I was a little shocked to learn that there was a ban on Elegance corals over there. I'm glad to hear that you were able to rescue one of these corals. It sounds like you already know this, but be very careful when increasing the lighting on your new coral. She will be very sensitive to increases in light.

[elegance coral]

Originally posted by Serioussnaps
Never trust online vendors! I always hear "oh hes a great guy." Makes me sick...I dont care what vendor it is...it is a business. Sorry for the rant..I just get sick of the onine touters on here sometimes

I agree with you on this. I have been all over the web and some of the claims these online vendor are making is sickening. Selling sick Elegance corals and giving them a different scientific name in an attempt to explain why the coral looks different than others. Showing sick corals and saying "Its a healthy coral, just a little ticked off in the pic". This ticks me off to no end! I have however recently met an online dealer in person. This one dealer doesn't sell Indo Elegance corals because of the poor survivability of these corals. He does sell Aussie Elegance corals, but if they are frags he holds them until they have completely healed from being fragged. I have seen his stock and he takes very good care of his animals. From what I can see it seems like in this one case he is a hobbyist that has decided to turn his passion into a business. I don't think I am allowed to plug a business here in the forums, but if someone is looking for a reputable online vendor, I would have no problem referring people to this one sight through PM. The other sights, I wouldn't give them a dime of my money.

[gsellers1245]

i think you are talking about matt right? in bartow. Matt is great and does get all aussie stuff now and his stuff is top notch. He has a guy in NY and he shipped him the blue tips elegance and did extremely well. He also fed it every night when he closed up shop. I would recomend everyone to go through matt.

[Serioussnaps]

Originally posted by elegance coral
I agree with you on this. I have been all over the web and some of the claims these online vendor are making is sickening. Selling sick Elegance corals and giving them a different scientific name in an attempt to explain why the coral looks different than others. Showing sick corals and saying "Its a healthy coral, just a little ticked off in the pic". This ticks me off to no end! I have however recently met an online dealer in person. This one dealer doesn't sell Indo Elegance corals because of the poor survivability of these corals. He does sell Aussie Elegance corals, but if they are frags he holds them until they have completely healed from being fragged. I have seen his stock and he takes very good care of his animals. From what I can see it seems like in this one case he is a hobbyist that has decided to turn his passion into a business. I don't think I am allowed to plug a business here in the forums, but if someone is looking for a reputable online vendor, I would have no problem referring people to this one sight through PM. The other sights, I wouldn't give them a dime of my money.

I am glad to see someone agrees with me. This is just one thing among many that sickens me. As long as there are ignorant hobbyists there will be opportunists waiting in the wings.....I will refrain from shouting out names.