can I see some pics of bare bottom tanks? - Page 3

smoknreefrs · #51 07/31/2005, 03:56 PM

i went BB about 2 months ago....i did it b/c i have been reading threads on both DSB and BB and when i made the decision to finally go BB it was b/c threads like bombers just pushed me over the edge...it seemed to me that logic won b/c it does make a lot of sense to just not have dirt/ditritus/crap/rotten food or whatever you wanna call it....like i said BB is new to me but my corals never looked better, and the water looks like the fish and corals are suspended in mid air, and my water parameters couldnt be any better...so for me, BB was the way to go...

boxfishpooalot · #52 07/31/2005, 03:58 PM

good job

boxfishpooalot · #53 07/31/2005, 04:01 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Bomber
Nope, the argument is "how do you know that it's not going to stop working tomorrow"?

They work great for a while, depending on how fast you fill them up.

BTW where do people that have never run barebottom systems come up with all this vacuuming and siphoning?? I have a little pile, about 1/8 cup, that forms in the middle of this 10ft tank. I siphon it out about once a month or two.

Set up right you don't have the sand bed competing with the filter feeding animals - and a substrate does do that, it has to -

So then you are saying its better to just use rocks wich dont trap as much ditritus for our solution?

smoknreefrs · #54 07/31/2005, 04:02 PM

soon as i get the time to read the threads on posting pictures in the gallery and in the threads, theres no stopping me.....

Bomber · #55 07/31/2005, 04:04 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by GregM779
If it becomes a trap,

It has to become a trap. It won't work if it didn't.

Supposedly

demineralization takes place - it doesn't. That's a slow process that would not be able to keep up with the demands of a aquarium.

But then that doesn't make phosphorus compounds disappear. It will store them and like you mentioned, Miracle Mud (throw it away when it's full), Anthony's sand bed in a bucket (throw it away when it's full, etc etc

Why fool with something that you have no way of knowing if it's working right or not - until you start seeing problems with very expensive animals?

When you can set the tank up from the get go to not store (nitrogen, phosphorus, etc compounds), but remove those compounds and not try to process/store them in the system and hope they stay benign.

You can fix those problems to a certain extent. Look at the market for chemical based phosphate removers - but they don't just remove phosphate - they also add things (Al, Fe) to the system that can also cause big problems.

or you can just set the system up to remove those things from the get go

Weatherman · #56 07/31/2005, 04:07 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Bomber
Weatherman's

The above picture was taken over four months ago (thank you, Bomber).

The one, below, was taken last Friday, July 29th (in celebration of completing its six month in operation).

Bomber · #57 07/31/2005, 04:09 PM

That reminds me! I have this red encrusting/plating thing that you need a piece of real bad.

It might be jinxed or something though. I gave Minh a piece and he disappeared!

GregM779 · #58 07/31/2005, 04:10 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Bomber
Nope, the argument is "how do you know that it's not going to stop working tomorrow"?

They work great for a while, depending on how fast you fill them up.

BTW where do people that have never run barebottom systems come up with all this vacuuming and siphoning?? I have a little pile, about 1/8 cup, that forms in the middle of this 10ft tank. I siphon it out about once a month or two.

Set up right you don't have the sand bed competing with the filter feeding animals - and a substrate does do that, it has to -

If it stops working aren't you on the same level as not having one? Wouldn't the other filtration help, LR, refugium, etc..?
I know a few people running BB tanks, I hear that they siphon more than that and if it's only 1/8th of a cup a month your actually removing wouldn't it also be the same 1/8th cup being broken down by your sandbed?
I've never noticed anything suffering as far as filter feeders, actually anything that I can directly relate to my sand.

smoknreefrs · #59 07/31/2005, 04:10 PM

keep the pics coming....very inspirational

boxfishpooalot · #60 07/31/2005, 04:10 PM

Do you got any fish in there weatherman?

phenom5 · #61 07/31/2005, 04:11 PM

now, now kids...play nice.

There's probably a couple hundred more, I got lazy.

jeez bomber...your really getting lazy these days...i mean you only posted like 25 different BB tanks. man your lazy, the least you could do is post a couple of hundred BB tanks.

i was going to post my BB nano, but after seeing all those, its not ready yet. maybe next year.

as far as the whole BB vs DSB vs SSB vs whatever type of setup. based on what i know about them, the idea behind BB's just seems to make sense, so i figured i'd give it a shot. beyond anything, it has made my tank easier to keep "clean" so i like it. once i saw how much crap was collecting on the bottom of my tank, i don't see myself running a tank with a sandbed in the future, but who knows. 5 years from now we might all be laughing at the idea of running BB tanks...or DSB tanks for that matter

DeeZeal · #62 07/31/2005, 04:13 PM

Starboard is HDPE, isn't it?

boxfishpooalot · #63 07/31/2005, 04:16 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by DeeZeal
Starboard is HDPE, isn't it?

Yea I think so. But you could use any safe plastic, even acrylic. Or even just put rocks on the glass.

smoknreefrs · #64 07/31/2005, 04:16 PM

PHENOM5....that avatar was made for this thread....

phenom5 · #65 07/31/2005, 04:21 PM

PHENOM5....that avatar was made for this thread.....

LOL...ironic isn't it. for the record, that's not taken from my tank, i just like that pic.

Bomber · #66 07/31/2005, 04:23 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by GregM779
If it stops working aren't you on the same level as not having one?

Well no.

The highest demand placed on the entire system is the DSB. Uses the most O2, produces the most CO2, produces the most acids, and consumes the most carbon/buffer, etc etc
It's a big living thing.

When you set a tank up to run BB, you set it up with enough flow to get the crud to the overflow - to the skimmer - and get it out of the system.
If you had sand with that much flow you would have that ever popular suspended sand look.

If a DSB stops working, it changes the dynamics of the sediment. It leaks phosphate, it wicks phosphate up and into any rocks, etc etc chemically, organically, etc bound

and you have to wait for it to change to a water soluble form in order to be taken up with water borne bacteria and phyto, in order for it to be skimmed out. (think - I have severe hair algae problems but my water tests 0 for P)

boxfishpooalot · #67 07/31/2005, 04:26 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Bomber
Well no.

The highest demand placed on the entire system in the DSB. Used the most O2, produces the most CO2, produces the most acids, and consumes the most carbon/buffer, etc etc
It's a big living thing.

When you set a tank up to run BB, you set it up with enough flow to get the crud to the overflow - to the skimmer - and get it out of the system.
If you had sand with that much flow you would have that ever popular suspended sand look.

If a DSB stops working, it changes the dynamics of the sediment. It leaks phosphate, it wicks phosphate up and into any rocks, etc etc chemically, organically, etc bound

and you have to wait for it to change to a water soluble form in order to be taken up with water borne bacteria and phyto, in order for it to be skimmed out. (think - I have severe hair algae problems but my water tests 0 for P)

Good point Bomber! If theres less nutrients theres less algae.

Dam, got to go out for a bit, you guys continue on with the thread.

Weatherman · #68 07/31/2005, 04:28 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by boxfishpooalot
Do you got any fish in there weatherman?

Not yet. I am, however, open to suggestions.

In the meantime, I have these two characters to keep me busy (they are in my other bare-bottom tank).

Bomber · #69 07/31/2005, 04:29 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by phenom5
5 years from now we might all be laughing at the idea of running BB tanks...

That fish is the one reason I might set up a small tank again with sand.

I dount that you'll be laughing at BB tanks. Only the hobby got sidetracked with DSB's.
But then BB will probably never be that popular with the pet industry side of the hobby. I mean think about it, there's nothing they have to keep selling you to make it work. There's no reason for a BB tank to ever crash or go bad. No re-charge critters. No phosphate removers. No algae filters. etc Nada

reefrubble · #70 07/31/2005, 04:46 PM

Weatherman,are both your eductors running at the same time?

K9 · #71 07/31/2005, 04:56 PM

Wow, as usual Bomber blows us away with more scientific (and photographic

) ammunition for going BB.

Let me pose a question though Bomber:

All of these BB tanks I'm seeing are large, gigantic, and just downright huge! What about a BB nano, say.....my 10g setup I just started? Are the rules still the same? Tons of flow and good protein skimming?

I just paid over $20 for sand for my tank, but if you were to tell me that it can work, I'll bag it back up and return it just to save my tank from future hassle and clean-up. And if it'll be just the same as in a much larger tank, how much flow IS enough? Thanks!

willjeff · #72 07/31/2005, 04:58 PM

How much flow would be enough flow for a 90 gallon tank?

Bomber · #73 07/31/2005, 05:02 PM

LOL don't tell anyone but I don't know a lot about a lot of different things, just a whole lot about a very few things.

The whole idea is to either keep the tank clean and don't keep that crud in there, or

Use some sediment to sink it.

A 10gal tank is a no brainer. I mean let's face it, you don't exactly need a backhoe to remove the sand bed if you need to.

phenom5 · #74 07/31/2005, 05:06 PM

K9,
IMO a 10g is perfect for BB b/c its too small to get the benefits of a sandbed, and there's no way you can get crazy flow in a small tank with sand.

i just recently switched my 10g, and i'm still getting my DIY skimmer dialed in, but i love it.

Weatherman · #75 07/31/2005, 05:08 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by reefrubble
Weatherman,are both your eductors running at the same time?

Both pipes, leading to the eductors, have ball valves, which I adjust to somewhere between 50% and 100% open. When the picture was taken, the one on the left was running at 100%, while the one on the right was running at around 80%. Both eductors are driven by a single Iwaki 55.

I have a Tunze, in the middle, which pulses at 30% to 80% every six seconds.

Needless to say, there's a lot of flow in this tank.