Pointless (but cool) possible DIY

Mastermind · #1 11/20/2007, 08:56 PM

So, a couple weeks ago I put a new 10k bulb into my NO fixture on my FOWLR 6.6g tank at work. For some reason or another, the bulb did not want to stay on, and was flickering completely on and off randomly for a couple minutes. The look and feel of the inhabitants of the tank reminded me of what happens in a thunderstorm on a reef. (Yes, I've unfortunately gotten stuck in the water in a nasty storm with 6-10ft swells). Anyway, like I said, the fish responses to the flickering was very lifelike and kind of amazed me. I didn't really think anything of it until tonight.

On my normal 30 miles commute home from work tonight, an idea popped into my head. I'm going to (on my next tank) make a DIY Simulated Thunderstorm... maker.

The concept is simple. Thunderstorms offer fresh water to the reef, right? So, why not use an ATO setup to simulate the same thing.

Here's the way it'll work. There will be a float switch in the sump for water level. When the switch trips, the MH lights will flip off one at a time, keeping just the 50/50 CF/VHO's on - Cloud cover. When the lights go off, another powerhead in the tank will come on, simulating the choppiness of the water on the reef during a storm. A short timer circuit will trip (maybe a minute), then the "rain" will start. I'm going to use fuel injectors mounted to the back glass of the tank, plumbed to a small pressure rated pump feeding from the RO/DI bucket. The injectors will spray out, agitating the surface, and introducing fresh water to the reef. Obviously, while the injectors are spraying, the water level in the sump will be rising, until the float switch is again in it's off position. This will trip another timer circuit, leaving the MH's off, and the extra powerhead on for another 4-5 minutes.

While all this is happening, I will have one of those cheapo automotive halogen strobe kits mounted in the MH reflector on random strobe setting, simulating lighting.

Like I said, absolutely pointless, but it's something to occupy my brain/time... and will add to the authenticity of my piece of the ocean.

Lets hear your thoughts!

2t2_crash · #2 11/20/2007, 09:14 PM

Interesting.

bristle · #3 11/20/2007, 09:58 PM

Great stuff. I wonder if the mating cycle of any species we keep is triggered by the addition of freshwater and lightning?

Mastermind · #4 11/20/2007, 10:11 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by bristle
Great stuff. I wonder if the mating cycle of any species we keep is triggered by the addition of freshwater and lightning?

That's what I'm inclined to figure out.

I figure with this setup, I'm going to have extra maintenance with my lights. Spray from the injectors on the glass shield will leave salt deposits etc. I'm going to also make sure I employ a full time salinity monitor to make sure nothing goes out of whack...

*Edited for spelling*

RONCGIZMO · #5 11/20/2007, 10:18 PM

the metal they make the injectors out of..is it reef safe?

Drag Racer · #6 11/20/2007, 10:51 PM

For the spray use a windshield washer spray nozzle. there made of plastic and offer a nice spray patter, use the ones that mount on a hood of a car. This was you dont need to have an electriclly controled injector all you need is a low pressure pump to spray the water. The ones on a car dont have all that much pressure. Just a thought. But very cool idea non the less

Mastermind · #7 11/20/2007, 10:54 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Drag Racer
For the spray use a windshield washer spray nozzle. there made of plastic and offer a nice spray patter, use the ones that mount on a hood of a car. This was you dont need to have an electriclly controled injector all you need is a low pressure pump to spray the water. The ones on a car dont have all that much pressure. Just a thought. But very cool idea non the less

Cool... being in the same field as you I'm kinda kicking myself for not thinking of that in the first place haha. I have a tendency to automatically think of the most complicated ways to do things...

Drag Racer · #8 11/20/2007, 11:02 PM

Yeah me too most of the time too. If you get it done you have to post a video of this. The more I think about that idea the cooler i think the idea is. lol

ckprax · #9 11/21/2007, 03:35 AM

Wouldn't you want the "thunderstorm" to only happen once a day and maybe only once a week or so. I could see a thunderstorm happening quite a few times a day when the ato kicks in? or am i totally off, i still top off the old fashion way so i am definitely no expert on this, just curious.

hahnmeister · #10 11/21/2007, 03:36 AM

You may have one misconception here though... the 'rain' in nature is freshwater, but since its going into an almost infinite amount of saltwater, it hardly does a thing to the reef as far as salinity goes. The rain isnt 'offering freshwater' as you say.

If you simulate rain with freshwater, your salinity will drop like mad in comparison... not the way to do it.

Scuba_Steve · #11 11/21/2007, 07:54 AM

He said it will only continue until the sump refills to its proper level. The only problem I see is that to have a signifigant amount of "rainwater", you will have to allow the sump to evap alot of water before it kicks on, and that may cause bad salinity swings. I can see it working on a large system, where 5g or so of evap wouldnt change salinity very much.

BeanAnimal · #12 11/21/2007, 08:33 AM

I just don't get it

If a birds nest blows out of a tree the birds act in a predictable manner. Shall the local aviary blow birds nests out of their trees to simulate nature?

The fish act in a predictable manner, that is one of stress.

I suppose you could make the arguement that the stress helps to strengthen the fish, but then again our tanks have their own stressors as compared to the natural ocean (as well as missing some).

It is a 'neat' idea, but as you have already pointed out, likely useless. I woudl also agree that your "freswater" observations are simply not correct.

Just my .02

MSU Fan · #13 11/21/2007, 09:59 AM

Oh, I am bookmarking this for my future turtle tank upgrade!!! Add a misting system as well to simulate clouds - awesome!

Besides any misconceptions involved with this, wouldn't a wavemaker with a couple of powerheads work better for creating choppiness?

BeanAnimal · #14 11/21/2007, 10:22 AM

Misting system for turtle tank...

I would use a solenoid and a timer

samtheman · #15 11/21/2007, 11:08 AM

Why not thrash the surface of the tank with a stick to simulate a hurricane?

Donw · #16 11/21/2007, 11:37 AM

I wont comment on the useless part. The fuel injectors are not a good idea. They need a pulse, constant power to the coil is going to burn out the coil. Another issue with EFI injectors is the need for lots of pressure to get a spray pattern. Pretty much anything that makes a spray patter is going to need pressure. Plain old irrigation drip system spray nozzels will work fine but will need either line pressure or a pretty stong pump.

Don

LooklikeME · #17 11/21/2007, 12:38 PM

This is what I plan to do with my Profilux unit.All the nessecary items they have all ready.Check out there Led flash stick
http://archive.reefcentral.com/forum...readid=1249744

ctreefer · #18 11/21/2007, 12:50 PM

Interesting. It got me wondering. What happens to corals that are exposed during low tide when a heavy rain comes down? Does the top die off? IDK

speedo2wet · #19 11/21/2007, 12:54 PM

Have you thought about this being the make up water, that way the salinity will not get out of wack. You can position the float valve so you just have enough left in the sump then it goes on creating the rain storm filling the tank to the proper level of water. That way say it only happens every two or three days depending on the amount of water evaporation takes place.
Instread of the float valve filling the tank everyday it only triggers on every few days then cycles off a few days.

When you do figure it out, a video of this would be swesome to see and know how you plumbed the whole thing.

Im interested.

chrissreef · #20 11/21/2007, 12:58 PM

Like others have said... I wouldn't bother with the rainwater idea... it barely drops the salinity - if at all.

Mastermind · #21 11/21/2007, 04:40 PM

I think some of you guys are missing half the point of this system. The "rainwater" is just going to be another means of delivering fresh RO/DI topoff water to the system.

This ENTIRE system will only turn on when the ATO float switch trips. In other words, it will rain when the system needs to be topped off, not before, not after.

BeanAnimal · #22 11/21/2007, 05:26 PM

I think you may be missing the point some of us are trying to make.

1) It is pointless to implement such a system with regard to "rainwater" the effect on a small captive reef is not the same as it is in the ocean AND there is no apparent benefit whatsoever and arguably plenty of negative aspects.

2) Lightning is natural but being natural and being beneficial are not at all related. Lightning can easily be shown to be a stressor. It would be MUCH harder to show that the stress on the fish causes ANY benefit.

This whole thread begs the questions "WHY" and to "WHAT BENEFIT". They only answer I can come up with is "Because I can" or "I thought it would be cool".

Rosseau · #23 11/21/2007, 05:27 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by samtheman
Why not thrash the surface of the tank with a stick to simulate a hurricane?

heh heh.... I'm following along.

Atarax · #24 11/21/2007, 05:38 PM

me and a couple guys at the LFS had actually joked about this doing the same thing with a wavemaker and the fresh top off. we thought it would be great and very neat to see natural behaviors in an unnatural setting. i love the idea but it seems to be a ton of money for a top off.

BeanAnimal · #25 11/21/2007, 05:40 PM

Throwing firecrackers into a hen house causes natural behaviors as well...

Honestly... does a lightning strike that shakes the house, cuasing the dog to pee on the floor, do ANYTHING beneficial for the dog? It scares him and makes him shake.... He would do the same things in the woods as well. What is the point?