"Green" reef planning

[scottras]

Just put the waste water into the washing machine. Therefore there is no waste.

[rickyfins]

Do not use RODI. Go with a Kati Ani system, no waste and water is just as good if not better coming out of the other end. Plus the unit is rechargable and no refill cartridges to buy EVER!

[nrstype]

I love the idea of using natural sunlight for coral / reef system, if it could be applied, amplified, adjusted etc....

There is a coral 'farm' here, smack dab in central Ohio, the guy uses the free sunlight to grow his aquacultured corals, clams, etc..... They are in a small greenhouse, next to his house, on his property. He grows out coral under the sun, literally. I don't know the specifics of his system, I've only been out there a couple of times, but it is just awesome, and it sure can be done.

[scarletknight06]

rickyfins:
so is a kati ani system just a DI system? no RO?

[rickyfins]

Correct but on a large scale so you get much more water before a recharge is neccessary. It also employs higher grade resins than that of other aquarium and home DI units therefore giving you cleaner water. The gentleman who is involved with Kati Ani is actually a member in the club I belong to which is why I know a little about it. If not I probably wouldn't know what one is.

I plan on switching over to a kati ani shortly. I am just waiting for my RO cartridges to need replacement.

[Foosinho]

Originally posted by nrstype
I love the idea of using natural sunlight for coral / reef system, if it could be applied, amplified, adjusted etc....

There is a coral 'farm' here, smack dab in central Ohio, the guy uses the free sunlight to grow his aquacultured corals, clams, etc..... They are in a small greenhouse, next to his house, on his property. He grows out coral under the sun, literally. I don't know the specifics of his system, I've only been out there a couple of times, but it is just awesome, and it sure can be done.

That place isn't far from me, but since I don't have a tank right now I haven't been out to see it. I certainly want to check it out when I get closer to building my house (and preparing for my big tank).

[Wolverine]

Originally posted by nrstype
There is a coral 'farm' here, smack dab in central Ohio, the guy uses the free sunlight to grow his aquacultured corals, clams, etc..... They are in a small greenhouse, next to his house, on his property. He grows out coral under the sun, literally. I don't know the specifics of his system, I've only been out there a couple of times, but it is just awesome, and it sure can be done.

Are you talking about the one in Akron, or a different one?

While it's true that you can recharge the Kati-Ani systems, unless they've changed the system, you have to use relatively harsh chemicals to do so, and end up putting much more waste into the system than you would if you're using the RO in the washing machine as mentioned above.

Dave

[nrstype]

I was talking about the one in New Albany, Ohio. Reef systems farm.

[scarletknight06]

Wolverine,
I dont understand. can you elaborate?

[Wolverine]

Originally posted by scarletknight06
Wolverine,
I dont understand. can you elaborate?

The kati-ani system is just a larger DI system with the cation and anion chambers separated; most DI cartridges just deal with both together, which is more space efficient, and fine after RO, but you have to have them separate to be able to recharge them. Basically you chemically treat them to wash out whatever they've removed from the water, and you're able to reuse the resins. I don't remember the details off the top of my head, because it's been 5 or 6 years since I was looking into these systems (that's why I made the qualifier about whether or not it's changed). The recharging and washing process used some fairly hazardous chemicals that you had to be sure to handle properly to avoid little things like injury to yourself, and it was also a relatively labor intensive process.

Dave

[scarletknight06]

Thank you

[ambrose]

yes, thanks

[god910]

I've been watching this thread and reading due to a project for research paper for my comp. class, on reefkeepers impact on coral reefs, and what we can do to lessen that impact, etc. etc, and figured I'd throw this your way, a section of an article written by Randy Holmes-Farley:

Recharging DI Resins

When DI resins are present as mixed bed filters, they are essentially one-time use devices that must be thrown away when depleted. These are the types supplied with many commercial RO/DI systems, and are what I use. Separate bed DI resins have certain advantages, however. In particular, if they are kept in different cartridges, they can be recharged.

The recharging process is essentially the reverse of the deionizing process (Figures 6-8). A strong acid (usually hydrochloric acid, HCl) is used to swap H+ for all of the positively charged ions on the cation-binding resin (Na+, K+, Ca++, Mg++, etc.). Likewise, a strong base (usually sodium hydroxide, NaOH) is used to swap OH- for all of the negatively charged ions on the anion binding resin. Both hydrochloric acid and sodium hydroxide are readily available and inexpensive. They are, however, potentially dangerous to work with. The detailed procedures and safety precautions are beyond the scope of this article, but can be found elsewhere online.

Here's the link to his whole article on RO/DI systems.

http://www.reefkeeping.com/issues/2005-05/rhf/index.php

HTH.

[samtheman]

Originally posted by scarletknight06
If you'd like to debate this point please go to this thread http://archive.reefcentral.com/forum...readid=1085208
or other similar ones. Please keep this thread on topic.

I did visit the suggested thread. There are no measurable impacts listed. Why did you lie, just to avoid the question?

[god910]

Why don't YOU respect the o/p's wishes and stay out of this thread? MKAY? KTHNX.

[Moofia]

assuming you use Sunlight as your (free) light source..

while i won't say its impossible..
i highly doubt a very sizable reef tank is possible...
without either a HUGE investment in a Natural thermodynamic cooling process(and sometimes even this is NOT possible depending on your geographical location and/or seasonal changes IMO)
or a HUGE investment in solar/wind/hydro to compensate for serious electric consumption..

must be nice to be rich if cost is no object to this "green" reef setup..
cause it will cost ALOT.. and would hope to be as Simple as it is "green"..
cause we all know Complexity is a precursor to Mr. Murphy

[samtheman]

Originally posted by god910
Why don't YOU respect the o/p's wishes and stay out of this thread? MKAY? KTHNX.

So, do you have to be invited to post? How does one get started then?

[god910]

First what you'll want to do is read the original post. Then after that... read it again. Then have someone else read it to you, because you obviously can't read. Once you've gotten the idea that he doesn't want to talk about, nor debate the impact of this hobby on the environment, feel free to talk about how to better make a setup more green.

[rickyfins]

Lets play nice! Our impact on the environment as reefkeeping hobbyists is essential for understanding and conversing on making a tank "GREEN". While considering going green one must also outway the impact the "green" products has on the environment i.e. chemicals used in making said "Green" equipment or the process to which it takes to melt plastics and fabricate solar panels. Which is better, going green, or just paying the electric bill?

This is something to consider. Some purchases to help to decrease our impact are great, but purchasing big items that take more from the environment than they give in the long run is not. Cutting down on water usage, getting the most energy efficient pumps, and supplimenting lighting with light tubes or windows above a tank are better than some of those "Green" purchases.

[samtheman]

Originally posted by god910
First what you'll want to do is read the original post. Then after that... read it again. Then have someone else read it to you, because you obviously can't read. Once you've gotten the idea that he doesn't want to talk about, nor debate the impact of this hobby on the environment, feel free to talk about how to better make a setup more green.

Lets read part of it together...
"During my hiatus, I've come to realize the measureable impact our hobby has on the oceans/reefs of the world (please let's not debate this here, its been covered in other threads), and have become increasingly uncomfortable to the point where I question whether I can participate in such a hobby in the future."

What measurable impacts? He sounds knowledgeable until you question his statement. What Measurable impact? Just BS to make him sound knowledgeable, but still BS. I really do not like BS like this, especially to justify his “higher” moral position.

[chrissreef]

BS or not - it's an "inconvenient truth" (haha, still haven't seen it) that removing anything from its natural environment impacts the environment in some way... just like adding something to an environment that does not belong does.

I highly respect anyone that supports aquacultured/captive bred animals - just as I do those that try to be as energy efficient as they can in this hobby. I think we impact the environment - and some of us removing ourselves might help - but I think most of the impact to reefs is from other industries

[drawman]

I just skimmed this article, but I didn't see anyone mention the use of timers. Obvious to many but should still be considered.

Also, does anyone have plans on setting up an RO wastewater reservoir for laundry use? I think a link would be good to add here.

Third, I think a lot of reefers are used to dumping chemicals in the trash or down the drain. Any chemists have a realistic alternative for the everyday hobbyist.

It seems to me that a lot of the green alternatives are available at a price. IMO, the biggest thing we can do is educate our fellow hobbyists and think of alternatives for the everyday hobbyist.

[god910]

I actually have a 55 gal. plastic drum that I'm going to lift above my softener and fill it with my second RO unit. I have one that works constantly that is plumbed into the house on a 20g pressure vessle. I've run a 100ft. 3/8 line off of it that runs through the basement and up into a closet. This line is long enough to reach all 4 of my tanks. This whole setup, regretable is plumbed into the drain for the waste water. The other unit (a coralife 48 gpd unit) will fill the 55g drum. I'm going to have a hose running off it for my washing machine, and another with a regular hose fitting for watering flower beds etc. I'll probably be running the waste line out of the drain and into the 55g drum from the other unit, as we use it alot more often than the secondary unit.

[Turf]

I'll throw my 2cents in on going skimmerless. It's not needed and really water changes are not really either. There is an amazing tank I've seen w/no skimmer (just algae in fuge) and hasn't done a water change in over 8 years. That being said... they do put minor additives into it from time to time because they have a few SPS. Looking at it you'd never know and assume they're one of the few that do weekly/montly changes and have a massive oversized skimmer on it.

[god910]

I guess I could add to that. I've got a ER 5-2 on my 75 and it's sitting on a shelf. I am running a 29g sump absolutely packed full of caulerpa, bubble, and chaeto. It's running a 6" bed, half and half CC and LS. I haven't done a water change in probably a year. I'm running an AC Jr. and monitor my ph more often than my temp. I dose with Reef Complete as needed as I have a rather large birds nest and a sizeable galaxia, along with some poc frags from a previous parent.

I slipped on it about 8 months ago and lost a huge birds nest and huge poc. Never will I let that mistake happen again. I'm the guy that won't change his water unless something shows up bad in it. I've overcome alot, and if you catch it early, you'll do yourself alot of good. HTH.