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  #1  
Old 01/08/2008, 10:20 PM
frazier frazier is offline
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starting 2 part and have a ????

I'm starting at .5ml per gallon I have about 180 total water vol. ALK is at 3.0 right now and CA. is at 450. is that right so around 90ml per day of each?????
  #2  
Old 01/08/2008, 10:55 PM
bertoni bertoni is offline
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90 ml sounds reasonable to me as a starting point. A few days of alkalinity testing should help pin down the tank's consumption rate a bit, but a few weeks might be needed to get an accurate trend line.
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  #3  
Old 01/08/2008, 11:57 PM
capn_hylinur capn_hylinur is offline
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every tank is different on its consumption of of calcium and carbonates but I have a total volume of 180 also
I use 90 ml of Bionics two part daily to maintain a alkalinity of 10.8 dKh and calcium at 430. I haven't had to change that amount in a month now.
You should test your mag level before starting--it should be at 1300 ppm
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  #4  
Old 01/09/2008, 01:02 AM
frazier frazier is offline
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mag is low, it tested about 1100 ppm last time I tested it. Should I start the epsom salt 2 part at the same dose?
  #5  
Old 01/09/2008, 01:13 AM
bertoni bertoni is offline
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It's generally safe to dose up to 100 ppm per day of magnesium. This calculator might help:

http://home.comcast.net/~jdieck1/chem_calc3.html

It requires a guess as to the water volume, so I might target 50 ppm for the first dose, and check what actually happens. It'll take a lot of supplement.
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  #6  
Old 01/09/2008, 01:14 AM
frazier frazier is offline
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I see two kinds of 2-part for mag one with epsom and mag flake and one with just epson. I don't have magflake so will it be ok to use the epsom only??
  #7  
Old 01/09/2008, 01:24 AM
bertoni bertoni is offline
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I bought some bulk magnesium chloride, personally, but using only epsom salts might be fine. People have done it successfully.
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  #8  
Old 01/09/2008, 06:10 AM
Randy Holmes-Farley Randy Holmes-Farley is offline
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Using Epsom salts alone is better in the case where you are using the DIY two part than in other cases (like folks using limewater), since the chloride from the Dowflake helps to partly offset the excessive sulfate in the Epsom salts.
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  #9  
Old 01/09/2008, 01:29 PM
capn_hylinur capn_hylinur is offline
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Re: starting 2 part and have a ????

Quote:
Originally posted by frazier
I'm starting at .5ml per gallon I have about 180 total water vol. ALK is at 3.0 right now and CA. is at 450. is that right so around 90ml per day of each?????
if you are not sure of what you are doing--here is a suggested plan ----

measure your calcium and alkalinity, and mag which you have done
See how far off you are from 400ppm calcium and 9.00 alkalinity

Use the chemistry calculator that Bertoni suggested

Use Kent turbo calcium to bring up your calcium level to 400
Use Kent supper dKh to bring up you alkalinity level

Now start the90 mL of two part for one week--and remeasure the levels.
If you are very close to the starting measurements continue with no adjustment
Second week repeat but this time if it has dropped off alot that you need to dose then start with a little more two part and continue for one more week
repeat the above--over a month it will graaaadully stablize out and you won't experience the seesaw dosing that alot of reefers get into

again this worked for me so it is just an anecdotal suggestions
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  #10  
Old 01/09/2008, 03:02 PM
Nanz Nanz is offline
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Re: Re: starting 2 part and have a ????

Quote:
Originally posted by capn_hylinur
Use the chemistry calculator that Bertoni suggested

Use Kent turbo calcium to bring up your calcium level to 400
Use Kent supper dKh to bring up you alkalinity level

Sorry to jump in this thread but I planned to use that exact scheme to setup my Ca and Alk but the calculator does not have an option in the drop down list for Kent supper dKh.
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S.G. = 1.025
Temp = 78.0
pH = 8.10
Ca = 420
Alk = 9
Mg = 1350
NO2, NH3 = 0
NO3 = 0
  #11  
Old 01/09/2008, 03:44 PM
Randy Holmes-Farley Randy Holmes-Farley is offline
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Any solid alkalinity supplement is not far off of baking soda for our purposes when using that calculator.

FWIW, I'd prefer baking soda to Kent super buffer, as the buffer has borate in it which you do not need routinely. For a one shot, it is fine, however.
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  #12  
Old 01/09/2008, 11:25 PM
capn_hylinur capn_hylinur is offline
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Quote:
Originally posted by Randy Holmes-Farley
Any solid alkalinity supplement is not far off of baking soda for our purposes when using that calculator.

FWIW, I'd prefer baking soda to Kent super buffer, as the buffer has borate in it which you do not need routinely. For a one shot, it is fine, however.
Randy, I asked Bertoni and Boomer a while ago about that and they said it didn't contain borate like alot of the other commercial buffers
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  #13  
Old 01/10/2008, 01:24 AM
bertoni bertoni is offline
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I don't know what's in it. Boomer might have said something.
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  #14  
Old 01/10/2008, 07:05 AM
Randy Holmes-Farley Randy Holmes-Farley is offline
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The Kent site lists this as the ingredients:

http://www.kentmarine.com/saltwater/...buffer-dkh.htm

"Contents:
carbonate, bicarbonate and borate salts of sodium, magnesium, and potassium."

FWIW, I do not know how much of any of the ingredients it contains.
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  #15  
Old 01/10/2008, 07:17 AM
Nanz Nanz is offline
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Quote:
Originally posted by Randy Holmes-Farley
Any solid alkalinity supplement is not far off of baking soda for our purposes when using that calculator.

FWIW, I'd prefer baking soda to Kent super buffer, as the buffer has borate in it which you do not need routinely. For a one shot, it is fine, however.
Thanks for the reply

I only used it once and in the future I will use baking soda instead.
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S.G. = 1.025
Temp = 78.0
pH = 8.10
Ca = 420
Alk = 9
Mg = 1350
NO2, NH3 = 0
NO3 = 0
  #16  
Old 01/10/2008, 07:22 AM
Randy Holmes-Farley Randy Holmes-Farley is offline
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Sounds good. I'd probably use it until its gone, then switch to something else.

Happy Reefing.
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  #17  
Old 01/10/2008, 07:32 AM
Chrisrush Chrisrush is offline
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Randy,
I have a question regarding the Reef Chem calculator and Mg supplementation.

For my water changes, I will need to add some Mg supplements to the Reef Crystals Salt that I use. I have Magflake and Epsom Salt already mixed. Can I use this to boost the Mg levels in my water change? What category would this fall under? The Randy's Recipe 1 and 2 versions A & B?

Same question applies to my display tank. If I need to boost my Mg levels in the tank, what category does this fall under?
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Thanks,
Chris
  #18  
Old 01/10/2008, 07:39 AM
Randy Holmes-Farley Randy Holmes-Farley is offline
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Yes, that is a good supplement to use.

If you made a liquid supplement according to my recipe, then use the Randy's DIY entry. The other entries for MAG flake and Epsom are only if you measure them out dry (FWIW, I add dry Dowflake and MAG flake to my new salt water)..
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  #19  
Old 01/10/2008, 07:41 AM
Chrisrush Chrisrush is offline
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Gotcha. Thanks for the help.
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Thanks,
Chris
  #20  
Old 01/10/2008, 07:42 AM
Randy Holmes-Farley Randy Holmes-Farley is offline
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You're welcome.

Happy Reefing.
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  #21  
Old 01/10/2008, 12:31 PM
jennmac415 jennmac415 is offline
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Jonathan... where did you get your bulk magnesium chloride?

thanks!
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  #22  
Old 01/10/2008, 10:56 PM
capn_hylinur capn_hylinur is offline
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Quote:
Originally posted by Randy Holmes-Farley
Sounds good. I'd probably use it until its gone, then switch to something else.

Happy Reefing.
is this plain ordinary baking soda--that is better to use the Kent super dKh
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  #23  
Old 01/11/2008, 02:19 AM
bertoni bertoni is offline
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I got mine online from harveysalt.com, but there are other vendors, and they might be more convenient.
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Jonathan Bertoni
  #24  
Old 01/11/2008, 12:38 PM
jennmac415 jennmac415 is offline
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Thanks, Jonathan, I checked them out but no prices...

Besides the TWOPART site what other sites sell this stuff? Is shipping really high for this?
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  #25  
Old 01/11/2008, 02:13 PM
Randy Holmes-Farley Randy Holmes-Farley is offline
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is this plain ordinary baking soda--that is better to use the Kent super dKh

Yes. At least it is not worse. Bake it first if you want it to raise pH as well as alkalinity.
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