Eco-Aqualizer (may fama article)

[ExtremeReef]

Hey, this is Paul... extremereef is my fault :-)

I won't post them here, but I've got some more gems if anyone is interested. Let's just say I've gotten some very ambiguous answers (like the one above). I originally hoped those threads would spur some discussion on the topic, but you can see what that's turned into. There's a much better (honest) dicussion on it here.

[Mr_Quality]

Well maybe I should run some plumbing from the 180 gallon at work to the 1.5 Tesla MRI scanner. Heck, I could turn on the scanner and bomb the water with RF pulses and time varying gradient fields too. I could then market NMR scanners for the aquarium industry and get rich. I shall call it the Aqua-Alchemizer.

Mark,

A home MRI scanner would have to win as THE most expensive reef accessory!

If the MRI is too costly for people, you could just sell them the irradiated water.

[3_high_low]

Originally posted by ExtremeReef
Hey, this is Paul... extremereef is my fault :-)

I won't post them here, but I've got some more gems if anyone is interested. Let's just say I've gotten some very ambiguous answers (like the one above). I originally hoped those threads would spur some discussion on the topic, but you can see what that's turned into. There's a much better (honest) dicussion on it here.

Paul, I'm sory for my sarcastic post. Do you have some information to share? I don't honestly understand your message.

[ExtremeReef]

No problem, I should have just kept my mouth shut :-) Since I didn't, I should have been clearer. I've asked a number of questions about the device (as well as passed along the questions you see above from some of the users on the website) and you can see the answers that I got back (for better or worse). At the point we were having the discussion, those were the questions that were generated and those were the answers that Carl sent back. I think they mostly came from Sam Gamble, but I could be wrong. My original intent was to just have an open, unbiased discussion about it (good or bad), but it never evolved into that. I kind of gave up after a while, until I found this open discussion going on here. Does it work, perhaps... but then again so might the Twinkie. ;-) I haven't seen a controlled study on this thing yet and everything I've seen thus far has been purely anecdotal. Personally, I think the answers were kind of fluffy, but hey what do I know. Have you guys seen this: Eco-Aqualizer Review on 3reef.com

[SPC]

I looked at the link you provided ExtremeReef and noticed the following:
Temp -- 79F
Ammo -- 0
Nitrite -- 0
Nitrate -- 25ppm
pH -- 8.3
Ca -- 480
Mg -- 1250
Alk -- no test

IMO if this guy dosen't know enough to test for Alk, then he is not someone I would trust to tell me whether the water molecules are lining up .
Steve

[Mr_Quality]

Sorry about the fluffy responses. If you read between the lines, some of us are trying to be funny because we don’t have much confidence in the efficacy of this device. So to provide you with a straight answer, I personally don’t believe the claims made by Eco-Aqualizer.

Mike

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

I'm confused. If anyone thinks that there are legitimate questions that we should address in a serious manner, I'm happy to do so. Just lay out the questions and we'll go at them.

[ExtremeReef]

Mike,

I apologize for the confusion... I wasn't saying your (or any) of the comments here were fluffy, I was referring to the answers that I got back from Carl and posted at extremereef.com (the one's that were referenced here). I think the questions were valid but, like you, I'm not sure about the answers. I think people had honest questions about this thing and rightfully so. Randy, in regards to your last post, I'd say comment on the answers that Carl gave. As a chemist, what are your thoughts on those responses? I've heard from a few chemist on these answers and they all seem to think its garbage.

[SPC]

Originally posted by Randy Holmes-Farley
I'm confused. If anyone thinks that there are legitimate questions that we should address in a serious manner, I'm happy to do so. Just lay out the questions and we'll go at them.

I have a question Randy. If this magnetization of water worked like the manufactures postulate, wouldn't it have already been used in the medical field (purifying blood for example) where big money could be made?
Steve

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

I've heard from a few chemist on these answers and they all seem to think its garbage.

I agree. I'll go over them in more detail in the next few days a post a more lengthy set of comments.

I have a question Randy. If this magnetization of water worked like the manufactures postulate, wouldn't it have already been used in the medical field (purifying blood for example) where big money could be made?

Sure, it would have all kinds of accepted uses making big money, not just aquarium stuff. Nearly all of the publications that I could find on the positive benefits of far infrared were Japanese patents (some decades old). Do people think that scientists the world over have simply chosen to ignore this "great new field?"

It is rather like some of the people that claim to be able to predict the future, or who can make things happen by telekinesis (or whatever the appropriate hyperbabbel word is). Why don't these folks control the world? Maybe just because none of them want to?

[SPC]

Originally posted by Randy Holmes-Farley
Why don't these folks control the world? Maybe just because none of them want to?

The answer I have always heard them give is that they don't want to abuse the gift they have been given .
Steve

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

Thankfully they are all so ethical.

[Tadashi]

Originally posted by Trickman2
A good example is airplanes aren't really suppose to be able to fly. at least according to math but they do.

This is a really bad analogy. My first degree was in Aeronautical engineering and yes planes are able and suppose to fly by design and math. To simplify the explanation the design of the air flow over the air foil causes a pressure gradient which lifts the aircraft off the ground. If designed properly and you have enough speed you can lift what ever you want off the ground. If it did not make sense in math then how would planes be developed? Planes follow the laws of thermodynamics, fluid dynamics, physics, etc.

[SPC]

Tadashi, if man were meant to fly, he would have been given wings .
Steve

[saltshop]

Originally posted by Tadashi
If it did not make sense in math then how would planes be developed?

If memory serves me, the bicycle shop owners used a lot of trial and error originally. I am pretty sure the current multi-million dollar planes now use a much more logical math and physics basis though. Lift? Aren't planes actually pushed upwards? Since the higher pressure is below the wings and lower pressure above caused by the air moving faster over the top of the foil than beneath it. Which brings me to the idea of my new product called Aquawings(tm)...a revolutionary water flow device that makes your reef "take off" ...literally.

[Tadashi]

Originally posted by SPC
Tadashi, if man were meant to fly, he would have been given wings .
Steve

You know I was thinking a similiar thing during airborne school. What person in their right mind would jump out of a perfectly good airplane.

Saltshop - yeah you are right the plane is actually pushed up.

How can people get away with selling this crap if their claims defy laws of nature/physics/whatever? Don't they have to turn in documentation of their experiments to get a patent?

[WaterKeeper]

Man you guys don't know cow dung. Planes fly by using the Eco-Gravitizer. Mounted in a plane, it repels gravitons using powerful magnets and enables effortless flight. The wings are merely to make the plane look cool.

[Tadashi]

ROTFLMAO

[Brad A.]

Aquarium (especially reef) product snake oil really upsets me. For, example, the other day I over heard my LFS tell a customer he could get rid of hair algae by dosing Marc Weiss's "Blackpowder". I was so #$$$ed off I felt the need to educate the customer when he was away from the LFS owner.

Sorry, I'm really mad. Snake oil reef products are not nearly as bad as health product snake oil. There are 10,000's of people who don't get proper health care for serious medical conditions because they think the magnet, herbs, and reflexology will cure their heart failure (or whatever, pick a disease).

Bob Goemans is a sneaky salesman. I met him in Salt Lake City about 2 years ago and listened to his "scientific" explaination of why a plenum is superior to all other forms of filtration. Total BS (but he did have all his books for sale on the table next to him). I have no respect for him (and I don't like his NOSE JOB, he really needs to sell more Eco-Aqualizers so he can afford a better plastic surgeon). Sorry for the childish remark, I don't like his nose job? Does that make me a bad person?

[Palooka]

Someone asked what medical spin offs there might be.....purifying blood maybe.

I went to a talk by a research psychiatrist about 16 months ago. He was enthusing about the use of magnets to treat depression. Claimed that placing magnets over the brain in a similar manner to ECT probes was effective in severe depression.

Ah yes....now I remember why I am quitting psych for internal med.

[Brad A.]

I'll bet that psychiatrist was selling the "magnet" machine or held some patent for it.

Yeah, I'm also going into internal med. Psychiatry is all about trying out 5 different meds to see which one works. They get paid well and are 9-5. But wait, I want to see results.

[barnacle bill]

Is that picture you? your a pornstar?

[Brad A.]

Yeah dude, I do midget porn!

No, it was a joke from a previous thread. Read the latest GARF thread in reef discussion.

I got the pic from www.mulletsgalore.com

[Palooka]

Brad

No he wasnt selling anything. Fancy equiptment wouldnt make enough to pay the bills for a week in the UK. Over here psych are not payed a lot, indeed they fare badly compared to other specialties. There isnt much private work outside of London. The system groans under paperwork and rules.

The one positive is that it remains a pure clinical subject, with diagnosis being made by history and examination - tests come a poor third.

[WaterKeeper]

Hi Palooka
[welcome]
Being a professional psychic my magnetic persona told me you were new here.