Why does reef crystals only have 320 Ca? - Page 2

Mike O'Brien · #26 12/13/2007, 05:04 PM

Mine is from Foster and Smith as well.

Test kits are not the problem here. Or does everyone have a bad kit ? The problem is with the salt, not the user.

sjm817 · #27 12/13/2007, 05:43 PM

Always buy mine from Dr F&S. My Ca measurements are always ~ 420. I used to get a reading of 360 when my refractometer was not properly calibrated.

Mike O'Brien · #28 12/13/2007, 05:49 PM

Oh yeah, we all have a badly calibrated refractometer too...

Sorry, but we're not all clueless on testing matters.

sjm817 · #29 12/13/2007, 05:56 PM

I didn't say anyone else had a bad refractometer calibration. Just stating my exp. Why are you being so defensive?

Maybe there are bad batches, who knows. I've never got one in the 3 years I've been using RC.

minireef30 · #30 12/13/2007, 05:58 PM

I've had this problem too. But my alk was at only 8dkh and Ca at 360. I'm going to try a different brand of salt. The two buckets I bought were from Dr.F&S too.

Mike O'Brien · #31 12/13/2007, 06:28 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by sjm817
I didn't say anyone else had a bad refractometer calibration. Just stating my exp. Why are you being so defensive?

Maybe there are bad batches, who knows. I've never got one in the 3 years I've been using RC.

Sorry. The fact is that there are many that clim to have low Calcium, and few that claim to have high levels with RC. Why is it only the low guys that are repeatedly told that their test kits are bad or their refractometer is not calibrated ? Could not the same be said for those few that claim to have 420 ppm.

Mike O'Brien · #32 12/13/2007, 06:41 PM

Maybe the fact that Rayovac doesn't want to spend money on their pet product companies has something to do with the decline in quality of their products.

StrategicReef · #33 12/13/2007, 06:58 PM

OK I ordered 800G of turbo calcium should be a easy fix, since the alk is already high, just add calcium..

I just wanted to make sure I wasn't crazy with my test kit and I have 2 test kits

jdieck · #34 12/13/2007, 07:22 PM

In the last batch of 6 buckets I got three of the buckets had the lids slightly loose on arrival and noticed those buckets had slightly lower levels. Salt mixes are very hygroscopic and moisture can quickly degrade the quality of the buffers in the salt.

Other times I noticed that salt settles in the bucket and I get different readings from the same bucket.

The best generic recommendation I can have and this not new and apply to any salt we use is to keep the buckets or bags properly sealed at all times and re-seal it as soon as possible after each batch is taken.

Also always test (and smell) your mixed water after 24 hours of mixing and before use, you never know when you may get a bad batch and of course if something seems odd double check.

BTW different salts have a distinct odor, RC salt smells different than others, it seems as if it has certain vitamin or chemical that others don't. In addition I get a bit more dirt (or clay?) from it than some others this is very noticeably if you heavily aerate the water and the skimming effects brings up that dirt.

StrategicReef · #35 12/13/2007, 07:27 PM

Thanks, RC is on the clean side and I have used red sea coral prop which is refined from NSW in another country and it's got all sorts of sand, metal flakes I have seen at the bottom of the bucket, so I stopped using it because the RC was a bit cheaper too.

jnfallon · #36 12/13/2007, 07:48 PM

I havent tested in a while, but back when I was switching salts regularly I noticed RC was low in CA as well.

I now use exclusively & mix a scoop of Dowflake in with each batch.

BTW, its on sale at DRSFostersmith now. 31.99 160g

Pretty cheap with cheap shipping too.

jdieck · #37 12/13/2007, 07:59 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by StrategicReef
Thanks, RC is on the clean side and I have used red sea coral prop which is refined from NSW in another country and it's got all sorts of sand, metal flakes I have seen at the bottom of the bucket, so I stopped using it because the RC was a bit cheaper too.

Yes I noticed that also on the Red Sea although I saw a lot less dirt I noticed sand and metal "flakes". They got to have some kind of machinery probably mixing or milling drums that erode with use.

sjm817 · #38 12/13/2007, 09:32 PM

Is there any sort of date or batch code on the buckets?

I just opened a new bucket and am mixing up 1G. I'll measure ca/alk/mg and will post back what I get.

Wingsfan1477 · #39 12/13/2007, 11:23 PM

I to am having an issue with the RC salt. My Ca. is mixing at around 320-360 and the Alk is over 5.08 This is being tested with 3 different test kits and one from my LFS in town.

sjm817 · #40 12/13/2007, 11:46 PM

Ok, mixed up ~ 1G from a new bucket @ 1.026 and Ca is ~ 340! I can see one of two possibilities.

1) There are bad batches, which I also have one

2) It hasn't mixed long enough. This only mixed for 1 hr or so. I usually mix for 24hr before I use it. I'll test again in the morning.

3) I screwed up the test. I dont think so, and dont want to run another test till the morning.

jdieck · #41 12/14/2007, 01:26 AM

sjm:

Is the salt in a bag or a bucket and how old is it? Can you also test it's alkalinity and Magnesium?
Is the new water turbid or can you see any white particles in the newly mixed water?

sjm817 · #42 12/14/2007, 09:58 AM

Here is an update. When I mixed it last night, I way overshot the SG. I usually make SW 40G at a time. I dumped out some and added more RO to get it right.

I retested this am and got ~ the same ~ 340 for the ca reading. Because of the way I had mixed it, I wanted to be sure that wasn't the problem. I made up a new 1G and was more careful. This one reads 370, which is still lower than the 420 I usually get. I also tested alk and mg.

ca 370 Salifert
alk 12 API
mg 1110 Salifert

The MG is definitely lower than I usually see as well. I'm going to let this mix through the day and retest later on.

This is a 160G bucket that was shipped to me from DR F&S on 7/31/2007.

This is a bummer. Until now, RC was a very nice, balanced salt at an attractive price. I wonder what else has changed.

Mike O'Brien · #43 12/14/2007, 12:02 PM

I ordered a new salinity standard yesterday to recheck my refractometer. But how far off would it have to be to cause a 100 ppm difference. I'd tend to think it would be so far off that the corals would not be happy.

Randy Holmes-Farley · #44 12/14/2007, 12:17 PM

To make 1300 ppm magnesium look like 1200 ppm, the salinity would have to be off by (1300-1200)/1300 = 7.7%. So instead of 35 ppt you'd have 32 ppt, or instead of sg = 1.026 you'd have 1.024.

Mike O'Brien · #45 12/14/2007, 12:21 PM

Randy, What about calcium. I'm getting 300 ppm and others have 420.

Randy Holmes-Farley · #46 12/14/2007, 12:23 PM

That would be a whopping 25% salinity difference. Unlikely you could have that.

Mike O'Brien · #47 12/14/2007, 12:23 PM

I got 28.6 % if that is still the right math ?

Mike O'Brien · #48 12/14/2007, 12:24 PM

Cool. Thanks

Randy Holmes-Farley · #49 12/14/2007, 12:28 PM

I rounded to 400 ppm.

StrategicReef · #50 12/14/2007, 01:38 PM

What the heck, can you post your ALK too of new RC mixed water.

Mine has always been around 4-5 MEG/L or *2.8 = 14DKH

I am looking for the graph with the curve of ALK vs CA from reefkeeping so I know what CA level is suitable for this alk. it would be in the 420+ range I imagine