Cheap prop set up

SoFloReefer · #1 12/30/2007, 09:21 PM

I want to get all my zoanthid frags out of my display tank and put them in a propagation tank. I want to set everything up for cheap.
To do this I'm going to use a shallow Rubbermaid type container, about 12" deep. On the bottom I was going to put some live rock. The egg crate (to support the frag plugs) is going to be elevated about an inch above the rock. There will be a couple of powerheads moving water between the rock and egg crate. Since the zoa frags will only be about 4 to 5 inches from the surface of the water I am going to use cheap flourescent tubes (I think they are T-12s but I'm not sure). I'm not going to run any type of filtration besides the live rock and two powerheads. I will do 25% water changes every week or two if needed. So what do you think?

thirty5 · #2 12/30/2007, 09:23 PM

I would definately run a skimmer on it though.

KCZoanthid · #3 12/31/2007, 05:38 AM

No skimmer. Protein skimmers actually remove the dissolved organics that our corals feed on.

The live rock will take care of any nitrates. A few nitrates isn't bad for zoas. Remember, zoas rely on zooanthelle algae inside their bodies for nutrients. That algae needs some type of food, in addition to light. Algae eats nitrates and organics that are dissolved in the water column.

I only run my skimmers at night, when the polyps are closed up. During the day I turn my skimmers off so that any organics or nitrates in the water can be absorbed and used as a food source.

I think it's a myth that you MUST have a skimmer. Is it nice to have a skimmer? Of course. Do they remove unwanted organics from the water column and keep the water clean? Of course.

Could they strip all the nutrients out of the water and "starve" your corals? I think it's certainly possible.

Run the powerheads and a light. Do some searches on lighting schedules. It's been reported that you are actually saturating the corals after about 5 or 6 hrs of lighting. So, you could run 2 light cycles in a 24hr period. Set the timers for 6hr intervals.

On-- 6am
Off--12pm
On--6pm
Off--12am

On again at 6am.

From what I read, you can increase growth by running them through multiple light cycles in one 24hr period. You can't/shouldn't do it in a tank with fish because it jacks them up. But in a frag tank--with nothing but corals--why not try it?

fatrip · #4 12/31/2007, 08:21 AM

I would put a few animals in there the keep the bio cycle going. maybe some hermits and a few snails. also im not to sure on the NO tubes. I don't think they will sustain the zoas with there light needs, but give it a shot. if they start going down hill, I would get some PC light pronto. I would get a small skimmer, this way you wont take all of the organics out of the water and your wont need to cycle it. I do agree that you really don't need a skimmer because the zoa's do like "dirtier" water but it is also good to run a skimmer to get more oxygen into the water column than just by surface agitating gas exchange.

also could you post the article on multi light cycles, I would like to read on that. thanks

SoFloReefer · #5 12/31/2007, 11:39 AM

I was thinking the same thing on the multiple light cycles especially since I'm just going to be growing soft corals. I was at a LFS with thousands of gallons of frag tanks and the guy didn't have a single skimmer running. He only had an overflow going first through some filter floss and then over some bio balls. His water was very clean. I think you only need skimmers if you are putting a heavy biological load on your system. I have 6 fish in my 46 gallon so I have to run my skimmer 24/7. On this prop tank I'm not going to bother. My main concern is the lighting though. I could put together a decent T5 system for around $100 using sunpark ballasts but I would rather go the cheapest route possible. I know the intensity will be fine for zoas because I have done some experiments growing them in shade in my tank and they don't need that much light. I don't know about the spectrum though. They sell tubes in different spectrums I think from 3000k up. I should probably try to find something around 10000k right? Does anyone have any input on using regular household fluorescent tubes?

airinhere · #6 12/31/2007, 01:01 PM

http://archive.reefcentral.com/forum...readid=1220656

Thread is sorta long, but it is pretty complete about the dual light cycles I am currently still using.

As for the skimmer.....
Its probably one of the most important things you can use to maintain your water quality.

At least set up a refugium full of chaeto or an algae scrubber system to serve as a form of nutrient removal.

Lights (N.O. flourescent) Zoanthids (or almost any corals we keep) are photosynthetic. More/better lighting translates into healthier, faster growing corals.

Why provide underpowered lighting if you want to grow coral?

You could get away with a holding facility using N.O. flourescents, but for a farm type operation you really need to have as good of lighting as possible.

lvpd186 · #7 12/31/2007, 01:09 PM

I would have to disagree on not running a skimmer. A good skimmer goes a long way in to keeping water quality up. And I think the statement

Quote:

Could they strip all the nutrients out of the water and "starve" your corals? I think it's certainly possible.

Is a little strong. I don't think running a skimmer could ever "starve" a coral. If that was the case why are there so many coral farms that have skimmers? If you look at what seems like most of the prop systems on this forum you will see that they run skimmers. Calfo stresses running a skimmer in his book and talks about running them at his greenhouse. Also I believe that zooxanthellae algae feeds by means of photosynthesis directly from light, not from nutrients in the water column. Either way good luck with the prop system!

sahnee · #8 12/31/2007, 05:01 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by airinhere
http://archive.reefcentral.com/forum...readid=1220656

Thread is sorta long, but it is pretty complete about the dual light cycles I am currently still using.

As for the skimmer.....
Its probably one of the most important things you can use to maintain your water quality.

At least set up a refugium full of chaeto or an algae scrubber system to serve as a form of nutrient removal.

Lights (N.O. flourescent) Zoanthids (or almost any corals we keep) are photosynthetic. More/better lighting translates into healthier, faster growing corals.

Why provide underpowered lighting if you want to grow coral?

You could get away with a holding facility using N.O. flourescents, but for a farm type operation you really need to have as good of lighting as possible.

Glad a read the entire post before posting. I agree with the Chaeto in the sump! I'd go with a lower flow on your return pumps so the algae could be used more benefically as far as cleaning the water itself. I highly recommend a skimmer! Not necessarily the best something descent. Or just to a 10% water change every week. Time consuming but if your willing go for it!

Go with a 250 halide with 14k bulb growth and coloration

fatrip · #9 12/31/2007, 05:26 PM

"Does anyone have any input on using regular household fluorescent tubes?"
yea dont use them. even if you put the zoas in the shade in your tank there is still more light than under a NO flourecent tube.

i'd go with the t-5 set up for a 100 bucks. i wouldnt go with a 250w mh for just a few zoa's especialy if they are only 4 inch under the water even 2 t-5's are a little eccesive. and the 250w would heat the water way too much in a little prop tub anyways. would deff go with some sort of nutrient export weather it be a skimmer or a refuge w/ macro. i would relly souly on water changes but still preform them.

Reefdiver77 · #10 01/05/2008, 01:39 AM

I run 250 MH on my 20L prop tank. Bare bottom. Refugium with chaeto, koralia powerhead, 10 gallon sump with liverock and carbon (as well as one naughty gorilla crab). I use a CPR Backpack skimmer. I have leathers, zoas, sps and lps in the tank and all are growing like crazy. I keep the MH on 8 hrs a day.