Black Polymnus Saddlebacks

[Sokretys]

i got an unmatched pair maybe 6 weeks ago. they were wild caught...but had been at the store for 3.5 months. so i thought it was safe. they are doing quite well. just introduced a purple firefish maybe 4 days ago. at first they were a little scared of it. until they learned they could bully it. day by day they are getting less aggressive with it. everything is easting so all is well in that regard. just got a small BTA im hoping they will host.

ive heard and read that saddlebacks can be quite aggressive. is this all members of the genus of only some? im looking to add some more fish...ive got them in a 29. they larger BSC is about 1.75" and the smaller is 1.25". id like a pygmy angel to add second to last and a tiny tang very last. to remove from the tank once he outgrows it. prior to that...i was thinking of a mccoskers flasher wrasse?

id like a flasher wrasse in there very much...small, peaceful, brings more timid fish into the open. im sure the clowns would bully him at first. would a flasher be able to handle it?

any input would be much appreciated.

-Nate

[Sokretys]

also..how do i know if the clowns have paired up?

[CHARLIE AGUILAR]

I have a pair that is also wc and they will eat from my hand and i have never seen any aggression in them. Thee natural host is the Haddoni carpet anemone. Although they will host a bta but be careful they are very aggressive towards there anemone.
As far as tank mates the angel will get to big for a 29 as well as the tang, its more stress on them to have to grow up and mature in a sm tank then haveing a lg tank.Just my .02.
Post some pics of the clowns id like to see them as well as everyone else.

[littleshark]

Thats so cool. If they are do a twitching dance then they are seeing whose a male and female. The one that gets bully the most will become the male. And they stay together most of the time. Mines sleeps in the anemone together.

[Sokretys]

yeah right now the dominant one will sleep in my open brain. which doesnt seem to mind when either of the clowns buffet it. im def aware that the dominant will turn female. as far as this twitching dance? could anyone be more specific. i saw the smaller one go to the larger and kind of shake his tail at it? it is hard to explain..ill look for some video on youtube. my brother just got a nice camera so ill try and get some pictures.

i have read nowhere that a flame angel would outgrow a 30. ive heard they require at least 20, and ive heard 30. obviously they would be happier in a larger tank.

as far as the tang goes...id get a tiny. so less than an inch, and when he gets too big, 3-4 inches. or if its less and he is showing signs of stress...than i can trade him in for store credit at my shop.

aggressive towards anenomes...mine is about 1.25 inches across when open...will they kill him? i havent seen them touch him yet and he is looking great so far.

details on the mating dance?

thanks. -N

[Sokretys]

heres the larger of the two. the other is identical only smaller

[chrisstie]

I know its difficult hearing things you don't want to hear, but I care very much for the animals we care for in this hobby and also work at an LFS. It has been a tremendous opportunity not just to learn first hand about many more species than I could ever take care of in my own tank, but also an opportunity to observe these wonderful animals in captivity.

That said, let me see if I can address a few things and then answer your question about the "dance."

I am with others in this thread who will say that some animals will get too large for your tank. When you think on what could "fit" into a 30 gallon it isn't necessarily what you can physically fit in there, but what will live comfortably and thrive in there. The clowns and a firefish are excellent additions. While one is more of a column swimmer the other may be territorial and stay in one area.

A flame angel would fit, per se, but they are one of the larger of the pygmy angels and when you consider there are already 3 fish in a 30 gallon having a larger fish in there may cause the clowns to feel defensive of their territory and become a bit mean. Instead I would perhaps consider one of the smaller pygmy angels like the cherub angel (gold face purple body).

In regards to a tang, please don't consider this. Our baby tangs in our holding tanks at the store don't enjoy being in such a small space. While the fish indeed is a small size, the instincts of said fish make him want for a large territory and a lot of rock to graze on. Sometimes tangs wont even accept prepared foods and will need more than ~30 lbs of rock to graze on to stay alive. They are better left to 6 foot long tangs and larger where they physically can enjoy enough territory to not feel couped up or stressed. Even if you are able to get a little one into your tank that does well, he will *quickly* outgrow a 30g.

It's not easy to hear what you don't want to, but you'd be an outstanding hobbyist to consider these things before buying animals for your tank.

In regards to the shimmy-dance your clowns are doing, its typical of pairing. Usually the female will dominate the male and to show his submission and acceptance, he will turn sideways and jiggle at the female. This type of behavior occurs later on in other fishes when spawning time is near and it can be more of a courting or mating dance.

Best of luck in the hobby~

[Sokretys]

that makes sense as far as the tang goes. i would consider myself a fairly intelligent person. spelling and grammar arent my strengths but im capable of understanding pretty much anything if enough information is given. anyways, so it sounds like you are saying that regardless of a tangs size the instincts and nature of them to swim long distances from reef to reef to graze. i observed a nice school of about 25 of doctor sergeons in bermuda this past summer traveling 100 feet to have a few bites and then back to the same reef they came from prior to eat much more. as if they were scoping things out for the tastiest algae. it was pretty cool.

as far as the angel. ive seen quite a few flames in reef tanks, i had a 1 inch maxima clam for about 5 months before he kicked it...which really sucked. ive had my flame scallop for about 10 months now and is doing great. that being said, i have some pretty rare lps in my tank...of which i would not like to come back and find that my angel has had a little snack. ive heard and read that the cherub can sometimes be quite aggressive..or peacfull. im having a troubleson 6line right now with the same thing.

the way i have thought about it for saltwater, is 1 inch of fish for every two gallons of water if the tank is less than 48". does this sound right. or even 1 inch of fish per 2 gallons but only applying to larger fish, like the clowns or wrasse, but throwing in a whole bunch of gobies etc?