Are Clowns Hard to Keep?

dntx5b9 · #1 03/21/2006, 11:07 AM

I started my 20G in August, and I think I killed 6 false clowns so far. First two, I lost to ick along with a royal gramma. But the other 4, they died slowly. The 2 of 4 that died were not too healthy when I bought them from Petco, but the last 2 that died, were doing well for a while (over 2 months), but died over the weekend. I was away for 4 days on vacation, but had someone feed the fish daily. Firefish and others in the tank are fine (see my signature for the list), but two clowns died. Are clowns not very hardy? I have been able to keep two corals in my tank alive, but not the clowns. I want to get them for my kids, but if they keep dying on me, I am not sure ... Nitrate is always around less than 5ppm, temp between 76 and 78 and ph was around 8.0. Any comments?

kingtoad · #2 03/21/2006, 11:14 AM

What are your phosphates at?

How long was it before you introduced new fish after you lost your clown and royal gamma to ich?

I have a true percula, he's a champ, been through a lot of stuff and he's really healthy.

ahill3780 · #3 03/21/2006, 11:22 AM

Did you buy all these clowns from the same vendor? I have kept two Ocellaris for over 4 months now and I have never had any problems with them - even when I had them in a non-RO/DI tank with moderately out-of-range params. These fish really are very hardy, I would look at the source and the means of their capture and other stress factors.

BenH98 · #4 03/21/2006, 11:51 AM

buying fish from PetCo might be your source of death... I'm not saying PetCo is bad, but find a LFS and you should be much happier

rutledgek · #5 03/21/2006, 11:55 AM

Some species of clowns are easier than others but there are some that are considered the hardiest of salt water fish. Other than the blue damsels that people use to cycle their tank.

michaeldaly · #6 03/21/2006, 12:29 PM

I also cant keep clowns I ve lost all 4 I ever bought.
I can successfully keep butterfly and angelfish, so I positive it is'nt my water.
I think the cause is that I can only get hold of wild caught clownfish and they are known to have a bad survival rate.
2 of the clowns caught brooklynella and 2 just dropped dead

beefcake78 · #7 03/21/2006, 01:43 PM

I have had my petco clown for almost 1 1/2 years very easy to keep

tibbs2 · #8 03/21/2006, 02:55 PM

Are you spraying anything in the air that could get into the water and kill the fish? Is your water getting enough oxygen?

IslandCrow · #9 03/21/2006, 04:42 PM

I don't suppose you know if the clowns are wild or captive bred? The captive bred clowns are supposed to be very hardy. My maroon has survived all of my muddling through this hobby. I've heard of quite a few people having fish they bought from Petco die inexplicably, and based on that, I think I'd rather get my fish mail order than from Petco. They just don't seem to be very reliable. It probably depends on the specific store, though.

aubee91 · #10 03/21/2006, 04:52 PM

You might want to post over on the Fish Disease Treatment forum as someone there may have more information, but I'd suspect some sort of parasite or disease in your tank like Brooklynella, which can be very common in clownfish. I don't think any of the other fish you have will host or are susceptible to Brooklynella which would explain why only clowns are dying.

If it is something like this, you'll want to make sure that it's not still present in your tank before putting any more fish in there. And when you do, try to find captive bred clowns. Many clowns, especially ocellaris and perculas, seem to be quite hardy if they are healthy when acquired.

But again, others will have more and better info.

Alaskan Reefer · #11 03/21/2006, 05:03 PM

My ocellaris has been through it all in my 5+ years of doing this now. He refuses to die. He's been moved three times, been used to cycle a tank, been attacked by a yellow tang and two different royal grammas, been put through 50+ ppm nitrates, been put through heavy phosphate and hair algae, had ich, been left unfed for almost a month, been subject to hyposalinity and hypersalinity, been subject to temperatures ranging from 72-85, survived an assortment of water quality issues -- you name it, I've done it to the poor guy in my learning experiences. Today, he's a bruised and battered veteran of several wars with my diadema urchin as the urchin tries to come close to his home -- lots of black urchin tips in his sides and head, and he still shows no signs of slowing down or backing off. He may be the one with the dents and damage, but there are always lots of urchin spines left on the sand too.

I think the only thing that would kill him is the death of his hammer coral or old age. I have to believe he's captive bred he's one tough SOB.

dntx5b9 · #12 03/22/2006, 04:20 PM

Thanks for all the replies. I believe that the false that I get from petco are captive bred. What's strange about the death of my last 2 are that they were eating really well and doing fine, and then suddenly dead within 3 days. Don't know my phosphate level, but I started using DI water three weeks ago. Don't think it's water quality related issue, but it may be what I am feeding them? I usually feed them pellets (new life spectrum) and now and then I give chopped up shrimp that I buy from a grocery store. Could the shrimp causing death?

okreef98 · #13 03/22/2006, 04:28 PM

I have had a maroon clown forever. Stayed alive even when I couldnt afford DI water. This is one tough fish

Porkibear · #14 03/22/2006, 05:49 PM

Hmmmm....I'm not too sure if the grocery store would inject stuff into their shrimp, but if you are feeding them pieces of shrimp, I would buy frozen shrimp instead. They are flash frozen off the boat, and usually fresher.

Also, my guess is that Petco really doesn't specialize in saltwater fish. If you notice, they've got more freshwater livestock than saltwater. Since Petco is a large pet supply store, I'm sure their fish livestock is transported with the cheapest means possible. I would also think that they don't really acclimate their fish very well because they want to sell them quickly. Try to find a local fish store that specializes in saltwater marine aquaria, and ask them more specific questions about their procedures on acclimation and even how they catch the fish.

My false percula was one of my first fish, and it's been very hardy.

angelsj247 · #15 03/22/2006, 05:55 PM

well you shouldnt buy anything from petco or petsmart... thier fish are not very healthy..
what is your salinity at, nitrites and ammonia?

Subrafta · #16 03/22/2006, 09:39 PM

Some of the healthiest fish I've seen are the captive bred clowns from Premium Aquatics in Indy (www.premiumaquatics.com). The two I got were "courting" in the bag on the way home. Email them for info -- you're only a zone or so away for shipping.

As others have suggested, post your levels, but if your other fish are doing OK and all the dead clowns come from a single source, I'd suspect that's the issue.

As far as food goes, frozen cyclopeeze rocks. Everything loves it, and it really brings out their colors. If you haven't seen it before, it comes as a bright red "candy bar" sized brick. Virtually no excess water, so just shave a bit into the tank and watch the fish go crazy. LPS corals love it too.

dntx5b9 · #17 03/23/2006, 10:13 AM

With regards to the health of the fish from stores like petco, if the fish survives few weeks in your tank, doesn't that mean that the fish, initially may not be strong and 100% healthy, have now recovered and as good as new? Or are they of bad quality and will not do well in general no matter what?

Cuervo420 · #18 03/23/2006, 10:23 AM

my mated pair of tank raised ocellaris have been thru hell and back and are still as healthy as ever. I've had Coral and Marlin for 4 years and about 6-7 tank moves and changes. My advice: buy aquacultured, healthy fish from a reputable LFS (read: not PetHo)

Sheol · #19 03/23/2006, 10:44 AM

I'll sing along with the chorus here. Even when I botched badly in the salinity dept. my false percs came through it smoothly. So smoothly I didn't realize what the problemm was, since they were doing great.
Kill 'em? I suppose a small nuke or a cracked tank might do it.
However, clowns, esp. wild caught are prone to certain diseases. I think you got a bad one from PetCo. & your tank may have a clown-specific pathogen in it.
No more PetCo., ok?

Matthew

Reef_|<eeper · #20 03/23/2006, 11:05 AM

I too, have bought a clown from petco. Infact, I bought two and also a yellow-tailed blue damsel. They are still alive and kicking. After getting them though, I will not buy salt fish there anymore. I just don't trust them, I don't think that the workers know enough about them to really give me any advice. I will either mail order now or go to my lfs.

rochestertank · #21 03/23/2006, 11:19 AM

i recommend you find the best lfs around you (usually means the oldest) and NEVER go back to petco. Bring a small sample of your water with you to the lfs and ask someone behind the counter to test the water. go from there. leave petco for dog food.

dntx5b9 · #22 03/27/2006, 02:54 PM

If I have a clown specific pathogen in my tank, how would I know it and how would I get rid of it? My firefish goby is doing really well, and like I said corals and other critters are doing well as well. My little ones keep asking me to get nemo and marlin but I am hesitant to get more clown fish for time being.

rutledgek · #23 03/27/2006, 03:58 PM

If the pathogen is really clown specifc than the way to get rid of it would be to not keep clowns for a period of time. Without knowing the life cycle of the pathogen though it is near impossible to figure out how much time. An exampl of this technique is curing a reef tank of ich where copper can't be used. Ich only attaches to fish. Therefore by keeping a tank without fish(shrimp and other inverts are ok) for just over 1 month will ensure that all of the ich has run its life cycle and is no longer in the tank. For ich this would be done concurrently with treating the fish in the tank, but for your disease let the tank go and then add the new clownfish.

dntx5b9 · #24 04/01/2006, 10:35 AM

Last time I had an ich outbreak, I left the tank empty for 6 weeks before adding new fish. So, how long should I leave the tank empty to make sure that any clown related pathogen has ran its course? It's been two weeks so far ...