Deep Sand Bed? Shallow Sandbed?

ReefDoctorMicromussas · #1 01/09/2007, 05:20 PM

OK... Help me my fellow reefers

I currently have my main LPS tank as 80gal with a 20gal sump, EV240 skimmer and running a Rena 3 Canister... I have great success with all of my LPS and have a 4-6in deepsand bed.... The problem is the sandbed always looks like **** But my critters are happily able to dig to China and beyond LOL

For the past year I have been constructing a 400gal show with 700gal circulating system...

400show
50 sump
150 refugium
100 frag/prop

I was considering that since the Refugium will have deep sand/mud anyway... placing a very shallow sandbed into the 400 mixed reef? I have seen hceiv and others do this successfully and am curious of various positives and negatives of this approach?

I have kept a detailed photo diary of this construction and should be posting it into the "Large tanks" forum perhaps as early as next month.

Any inputs would be appreciated

Tyke · #2 01/09/2007, 06:23 PM

For what it's worth Doc, I'm also working on a larger system and have decided to go the same route you're considering - DSB in the fuge with just enough sand in the show tank to make it look purdy. I don't see a down side as long as the fuge is large enough to accomodate an appropriate amount of sand but I'm tagging along to see what everyone else says. Generating enough flow in the fuge to take full advantage of the DSB might be a bit of a challenge. Good luck brudda!

ReefDoctorMicromussas · #3 01/09/2007, 06:26 PM

Thank You Tyke

Let me know if you learn anything extra we do not find here

ReefDoctorMicromussas · #4 01/10/2007, 11:39 PM

No more input??? awww cmon guys throw me a bone here

jjmcat · #5 01/10/2007, 11:44 PM

I have a 2 inch sand bed doc with about 6 or 7 inches in my fuge.
I like it so far and havent had any problems.

ReefDoctorMicromussas · #6 01/10/2007, 11:51 PM

Thats reassureing... Thats about what I was thinking too

WendyMc · #7 01/11/2007, 01:49 PM

Wow, I can't wait to see this system as it gets going! This is so exciting. Something I've always dreamed of doing. FWIW, I have a friend who recently set up a much smaller scale version of what you are doing: 40g breeder w/fuge. She spoke w/Dr. Shimek about whether or not she should have the DSB in tank & fuge, & his response was that it would be fine if it was in fuge only & if she wanted sand in the display to do a thin layer for asthetics only but to make sure she had some things to sift it (like cukes) & to occasionally siphon it to get out collecting detritis. He actually told her he thought a system is best served w/DSB, but if that wasn't an option, it would be better served with a bare bottom rather than a thin sand bed, but if she MUST have sand for asthetics this is his recommendation to prevent negative effects. I have seen so many successful lg systems w/thin sand in display & DSB in fuge I think you are going to be just fine...

Joshua1023 · #8 01/11/2007, 10:23 PM

IMO a DSB on a 400 gl tank would always look crappy. I know on mine I get the old toothbrush out and get to scrubbing all along the front of the glass at least once a month, digging the brush deep into the sand. I don't know the dimensions of your tank, but I imagine that it would be a far reach to do this on a 400 gl tank. If you have the anaerobic bacteria stored somewhere else in your system-i.e. extra live rock or DSB in your fuge- then you should be fine. Best of luck to you.

ReefDoctorMicromussas · #9 01/11/2007, 10:36 PM

Awesome info ... I feel much better about this... and good point about the Bacteria.. Basically as long as it is IN the system where really shouldnt matter. The sand will prolly be about 2" which will actually be below the glass line of this tank

Thanks Wendy, Josh, JJmcat, Tyke

AQUA DAVE · #10 01/12/2007, 12:25 AM

As long as you have the deep sand bed in the refuge you will be fine! You may even think of going barebottom in the main tank. For a 400 gallon tank you will have to have massive water circulation and you will mor than likely blow that sand around and cause it to be less asthetically pleasing. Thats just my take on it.

jvetter · #11 01/12/2007, 08:53 AM

My 30 gal tank has been running since 2000 with a 3/4" to 1" thick sandbed. This sandbed has been left undisturbed except for a tank move in 2002. No cukes or sand-sifting starfish. No refugium or remote DSB. The tank is a softy tank with mushrooms and xenia.

In the past six months I have witnessed an increased growth of bubble algae, and to combat the problem I have further increased the in-tank circulation from about 20X tank volume to roughly 30X tank volume. These numbers are peak flows achieved through the use of timers, a wavemaking device, and powerhead pumps. There is a layer of rubble now on top of the shallow sandbed, and my belief is that there is an accumulation of detritus that has contributed to the bubble algae growth. I will most likely remove the rubble soon and may replace a portion of the sand to.

I ran the tank for years with no mech filtration and skimming only.

IMO shallow sandbeds are definitely an option particularly with the soft corals that I have been keeping, but at-times heavy flow is needed as well as at least occasional mechanical filtration. Attention must be paid to removing accumulated detritus. But is this strategy really any different if you are running BB or DSB?

Creetin · #12 01/12/2007, 04:50 PM

Yeah keep the dsb in the fuge, and a 2 inch shallow bed in the main tank.
If your dsb goes south then you can change it alot easier than the main tank.
Plus you wont see all the crap deep in the sand.
Take a look at the seachems greycoast for your main tank.
Really like hat i used it. Its perfect, and you dont see all the crud like black sand, Plus its arag.

ReefDoctorMicromussas · #13 01/12/2007, 06:33 PM

Good info guys Thanks

Yes the tank will be useing 3X3200 gal/hr Darts and 1 100mlr Iwaki 2000 Gal/hr
Circulations should be Typhoon like LOL Paul at OM has helped me alot

ThaNgBOm321 · #14 01/13/2007, 08:10 PM

im no xpert but im with the guys about.... a ssb in the main and a dsb in fuge.. that way you can isolate the dsb when it go bad and need to clean the sand..

imo i think dsb in a main looks really funny..( i mean a crazy bacteria moldy look under a buch of corals.. looking kinda like sewer under a vacation spot) and take up a lot of room.. and we all know that we can always use extra room in our tanks.

gl and plz post lots of nice pic

YzGyz

Serioussnaps · #15 01/14/2007, 04:40 PM

I run BB and use LPS to cover my glass bottom

WendyMc · #16 01/15/2007, 01:56 PM

Serioussnaps any FTS? I'd love to see a set up like this...