Bubble Master 160 vs Bubble King Mini 160

[Reeferhead]

They're fairly similar except for the price, which would you go with?

A few of the basics:

ATI Bubble Master 160
$460
7"x8"x20"
Air: 800 lph
Water: 1200 lph
21 watts

Bubble King Mini 160
$850
7"x7"x21.75"
Air: 600 lph
Water: 1000 lph
18 watts

[GSMguy]

Bubble king mini, the bubble plate is better designed and even though they are similar height the mini has a better reaction chamber Also the ATI are built Flimsy compared to the BK that is built like a tank.

then again you would expect all that for the price difference.


Nick

[Reeferhead]

By "better reaction chamber" do you mean specifically the bubble plate? or something else in the design that makes it better?

[GSMguy]

Originally posted by Reeferhead
By "better reaction chamber" do you mean specifically the bubble plate? or something else in the design that makes it better?

the bubble king plate is lower and much wider that is a big part of it because it reduces turbulence exponentially better but it is more than that

the ati bubbleplate has a plastic tube above it that essentially shoots 1200lph straight up the skimmer resulting in lesss dwell time and more turbulence. its like a cannon but too much turbulence IMO

They will both skim. it just comes down to the most efficent design in terms of use of space and turbulence reduction.

agian the Bubble king you can take every peice apart and it is built like a tank. I picked them both up and looked at them next to each-other and the BK seemed thicker and much heavier

[Reeferhead]

Thanks for the info, I wonder why ATI didn't incorperate a bubble plate into their design? Are there patent issues? Everything else in design seems the same.

[GSMguy]

Originally posted by Reeferhead
Thanks for the info, I wonder why ATI didn't incorperate a bubble plate into their design? Are there patent issues? Everything else in design seems the same.

they have a Bubble plate but not all Bubble plates are created equal....

As for Patents Klaus doesnt seem to be worried about people copying his invention, he knows that customers know where bubble plates came from. Its almost promoting his design by imitation. Klaus seems genuinly interested in pushing the limits of skimmer design and advancing the industry.

[Reeferhead]

The Bubble Master 200 has a bubble plate but I don't see one on the 160



I bet it could be modded fairly easily, although you shouldn't have to mod a $460 skimmer

[GSMguy]

Originally posted by Reeferhead
The Bubble Master 200 has a bubble plate but I don't see one on the 160



I bet it could be modded fairly easily, although you shouldn't have to mod a $460 skimmer

you see in the picture the inner tube inside the reaction chamber? the top of it is so close to the Neck that it just doesnt react as long and there is more turbulence

the small ATI skimmer is prettty different from the others and i think its the newest design, might be they were getting bettter results without the Bubble plate for some reason.

[Reeferhead]

I get what you saying, it makes sense. I think maybe they were trying to do a better job of reduce escaping microbubbles by using the inner tube.

[Reeferhead]

Oh, I probably should have mentioned earlier, I already ordered the Bubble Master. The Bubble King is way out of my price range. Actually, the Bubble Master is out of my price range too, so don't tell the wife how much it costs

I'll have it on Monday and post some pics of it in action. This thread has peaked my interest enough to concider modding it. However, my current skimmer is a complete DIY and I've never been happy with the results so I'll probably leave the BM the way it is.

[GSMguy]

i think the Bubble master will work just fine and at that price the choice would be easy id probably go with the ATI
and if i had the money for the Bubble king id get an ATB nano cone.

[Reeferhead]

Yeah, the ATB cones are Bad @$$ but wouldn't work with my footprint restraints

[kysard1]

The BM160 out puts underwater, no opportunity to plumb to a filter sock to catch bubbles.

[mr. pluto]

the return bubble issue does not seem to be a problem w/
the bm. lets put it this way, what can you do with the extra $400.00 you did not spend. Is the BK worth $400.00 more
than the BM. wishing is one thing pulling the trigger is another

[GSMguy]

Originally posted by kysard1
The BM160 out puts underwater, no opportunity to plumb to a filter sock to catch bubbles.

i would guess thats what a well designed sump baffle system would take care of.

[Creetin]

I have not seen any bubble problems with ATI's. None escape my 250.
The bubble plate debate. LOL Thats all speculation i have seen no hard proof of anything.
LOL i bet those BK votes came from people that dont own one.

Congrats on the pickup, Lots of happy people with them despite the poor design. :P Just kiddin.

[sjm817]

My BM250 works very well. No exp with the BM160. My 250 has the adjustable T output with the wingnut. I dont like the new underwater output design. I like to be able to direct the output and keep it at the surface.

[Creetin]

Originally posted by GSMguy
the bubble king plate is lower and much wider that is a big part of it because it reduces turbulence exponentially better but it is more than that

the ati bubbleplate has a plastic tube above it that essentially shoots 1200lph straight up the skimmer resulting in lesss dwell time and more turbulence. its like a cannon but too much turbulence IMO

They will both skim. it just comes down to the most efficent design in terms of use of space and turbulence reduction.

agian the Bubble king you can take every peice apart and it is built like a tank. I picked them both up and looked at them next to each-other and the BK seemed thicker and much heavier

So this skimmer must be a bad one too?
I really like this new BK and plan on getting one when avail.
I think its a good thing by having that tube there, It's there so water can leave without bubbles, and What I THINK would get better contact time out of each and every bubble.
Think of it as a well designed bubble trap.
I own a ATI and i do not think it lowers performance one bit.
This is as drastic as i think of a cone i will go with.

[Creetin]

Last one i forgot to mention that GSMguy is correct about the bigger bubble plate, I would like to see ati do something more the likes of the bk there, But The ATI's work.

[Reeferhead]

Well my Bubble Mater 160 has been running for a couple weeks now and I must say I'm very impressed. I'm terrible at taking pictures but I don't even have it dialed in yet and I've been very happy with its performance.

[GSMguy]

Originally posted by Creetin
Last one i forgot to mention that GSMguy is correct about the bigger bubble plate, I would like to see ati do something more the likes of the bk there, But The ATI's work.

yes the ati works.... just the small bubbleplates dont work as well..


the 160 has no bubble plate i wonder why, didnt the old ati bm 150 have a bubble plate?.


the size of bubble plate does seem to matter, the bubble plate on the new BK cone is huge, like the surface area of 4 ati bm250.

Creetin you should have pointed out how i thought there was a bubble plate in a skimmer that has no bubbleplate therefore making my post total garbage, i apologize.

[sjm817]

Originally posted by Creetin
So this skimmer must be a bad one too?
I really like this new BK and plan on getting one when avail.
I think its a good thing by having that tube there, It's there so water can leave without bubbles, and What I THINK would get better contact time out of each and every bubble.
Think of it as a well designed bubble trap.
I own a ATI and i do not think it lowers performance one bit.
This is as drastic as i think of a cone i will go with.

I like the look of that BK too. I'm curious how it would stack up against the BM250.

[hahnmeister]

I think the Supermarines will shred. The cone shape keeps the bubble density in the top very tight and uniform. The wide bubble plate provides excellent turbulence reduction (even with the cone, but as it turns out, this restriction doesnt act so much as a nozzle as you might expect). The greatest height from the plate to the top with the new design... and this design allows for much higher air flow rates/density than others... I can see that. Beyond making a taller version of it (which comes with its own advantages and drawbacks), I think this will be the skimmer design to beat. This is the one I would put up against the larger ATB cones, FWIW.

[CruzinKim]

Originally posted by Reeferhead
This thread has peaked my interest enough to concider modding it. However, my current skimmer is a complete DIY and I've never been happy with the results so I'll probably leave the BM the way it is.

No, don't need to mod it. My BM160 works perfectly out of the box. The only adjustment that would make the BM160 even foam better is put a small piece of RO/DI tubing into the end of the air hose to restrict the air a little bit. Your foaming will get finer and the foamhead thicker. Otherwise, it doesn't need a bubble plate.

[Reef Sponger]

I would have thought mini-BK would out vote BM 2 to 1, but it's a surprise to see a 50%-50% split. I almost picked up the mini-BK160, but the release took so long that I picked up the BM160. I have no disappointment with the performance of the BM160, just that it's built so flimsy compared to all the ERs and H&S I've owned.