List Of Coral Wholesalers In The Us

Julio · #1 05/19/2004, 09:47 PM

Hey Guys,
does anyone know where i can get a list of the coral wholesalers in the US?
I am doing a reasearch paper to see what the death rate of all the coral species imported atleast into the US.
Thanks in advance.

mhurley · #2 05/23/2004, 07:05 AM

Might get some answers here.

[moved]

Julio · #3 05/23/2004, 07:47 AM

thanks for moving the thread.
I been trying to contact Fish and Wildlife but i keep getting an answering machine, i hope they call back soon. The only other place i can think f contacting would be the board of health.

GreshamH · #4 05/23/2004, 09:06 PM

I doubt US Fish and Wildlife would give you that info. AS far as I know, being a wholesaler myself, there is no such list yet compiled that is available to the public (although FAMA is a good place to start when compiling such a list). True, US F&W Service has all of the importers in there database someplace, but not all wholesalers are importers.

o2manyfish · #5 05/23/2004, 09:20 PM

Fish and Wildlife insures that what is coming into the US is allowed to come into the US. However, they are not responsible that what comes into the US is alive.

When shipments arrive, hundreds of boxes and thousands of pieces, they check for quantity and identity, but they don't check every box, nor every bag.

The only place to get the information you want is from the importers themselves. However, I don't think any of the wholesaler can give you, or would give you accurate numbers.

I don't think even this information would be of value, as you know the stresses on corals being collected and transported are huge. You would need to see what the stats of the corals are not upon landing in LA but a week after they have made it to the US, and at that point they could have been in several different systems and the variables are infinite.

Dave B

Julio · #6 05/24/2004, 07:58 PM

Dave,
i know that fish and wild life does not take responsibility for what comes in alive. I was refering to them as a source of info. If all the importers are registered through fish and wild life i am sure all the importers have all the contact info i need for the wholesalers they sell to. The question is will they give me the info.

Steven Pro · #7 05/24/2004, 08:55 PM

MAC and others have tried to get that information and were met with a lot of resistance.

Julio · #8 05/24/2004, 11:02 PM

do you know why?

fishome25 · #9 05/25/2004, 12:24 AM

these are trade secrets and even though it may be for a good cause I doubt many will just offer you that information, and if they did I really doubt they importers would give you the time of day. I get import deliveries a few times a month so email me if you want my info from me.

Steven Pro · #10 05/25/2004, 07:25 AM

Any information they volunteer could later be used against them by government officials or environmental groups.

dendronepthya · #11 05/25/2004, 12:54 PM

Meaning if they published a 90% death rate, there would be a greater liklihood of an importation ban?

fishome25 · #12 05/25/2004, 01:01 PM

I would think so. Or maybe ban things that always come in dead like xenia.

Steven Pro · #13 05/25/2004, 02:18 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by dendronepthya
Meaning if they published a 90% death rate, there would be a greater liklihood of an importation ban?

I don't know what the actual rate is, but do you think a 25 or even a 10% rate of loss would be acceptable to some people/groups? I doubt PETA or others would agree to any rate regardless of the number.

KindCorals · #14 05/25/2004, 06:36 PM

Its really hard to imagine how much stuff really dies before one piece gets into someones tank. Its even harder to imagine how big the ocean and wild reefs really are and that there is still so many new corals and fish coming in every week. I wonder how much longer the ocean alone can support this hobby. Im just glad that so many people have successful propagation setups to help out.

Julio · #15 05/25/2004, 09:25 PM

From what i been hearing from many authors is that the rate of death is 10:1 on invertibrates.

fishome25 · #16 05/26/2004, 12:45 AM

all inverts? crustacean, mollusk, shrimp ect? 10 alive 1 dead I hope you mean.

KindCorals · #17 05/26/2004, 10:15 AM

I really hope its not the other way around, shrimp at least ship pretty well IME

fishome25 · #18 05/26/2004, 10:21 AM

Actually I probably lose more shrimp than anything, well next to xenias, sponges, and acros.

Julio · #19 05/26/2004, 08:51 PM

i mean 10 dead for everyone that makes it into the hobby.

fishome25 · #20 05/26/2004, 08:53 PM

that may be the case from the ocean to a hobbyists fish tank, but not at the import level alone.

Julio · #21 05/26/2004, 09:37 PM

i am pretty sure there is not much of a difference.

oama · #22 05/26/2004, 09:38 PM

A 10 dead for every 1 alive ratio is not indicative of all inverts. It is more likely reversed and even greater for aquaculture specimens.

Julio · #23 05/26/2004, 09:42 PM

i am not refering o aquacultured animals, i am basing this on animals taken directly from teh sea. I did not come up with these numbers, i got them from Anthony Calfo, Bob Fenner and Eric Borenman, Scott Michael and two other people.

fishome25 · #24 05/27/2004, 12:17 AM

There is a huge difference. Some are lost at every stop they make. I have never lost more than 10% of the inverts I've imported at the time of delivery, but a few have died over time.

Julio · #25 05/27/2004, 08:37 AM

most of these animals are lost during transhipping, or at the holding facility of the collectors.