Need some help and advice...

jade2122 · #1 01/06/2008, 11:57 PM

Ok so here is my problem. I want to get a bigger pump for my 90 that is going up in 2 weeks. However i do not want to have to get my sump drilled but want to use and external pump. Does anyone know how I can run an external pump without drilling sump? I know some people have done it but how...also pics or drawing would help..thanks!

Cheekmonkey · #2 01/07/2008, 12:24 AM

I have, I do an upsidedown U shaped pipe. Fill the part of it on the outside of the sump and that will be enough to get the pump primed and it will create a permanent siphon, so long as you place a ball valve to close it and maintain the siphon when you take it apart.

lifesworksataol · #3 01/07/2008, 12:25 AM

well reeflo pumps are self priming. so you just put a tube underwater and over the top of the tank and into your pump. it sucks the water right out of your sump! its pretty awesome. why dont you want to drill the tank though? its pretty easy and cheap.

jade2122 · #4 01/07/2008, 12:27 AM

i am looking at getting a mag 24...any pics to help me understand how you did it? thanks!!!

lifesworksataol · #5 01/07/2008, 12:29 AM

mag 24 wont work. they dont self prime.

jade2122 · #6 01/07/2008, 12:34 AM

can i do what cheeky said and start the prime myself? lemme see a pic of your setup cheeky

lifesworksataol · #7 01/07/2008, 12:40 AM

also if your water gets low or you suck some air it will mess it up and if your power fails you have to reset the prime sometimes. its just not very reliable. iam sure anything can be done, but you want to be able to count on it! why dont you want to drill it?

please if iam wrong someone else speak up

i want to see some pics too :-D

lifesworksataol · #8 01/07/2008, 01:07 AM

here is his pics

http://www.o-r-c-a.com/modules.php?n...iewtopic&t=629

norwall · #9 01/07/2008, 01:26 AM

Yeah, don't know if i would trust a mag drive out of water. I have nothing against mag pumps (I use them, in sump) but, have heard they can leak out of the nose o-ring. Just ask around, I could be wrong.

skinnyjoe1976 · #10 01/07/2008, 06:38 AM

first off why don't you want your sump drilled? if it's glass i understand, but if it's acrylic than it's a 2 mintue job. second the mag work well out of water. you might get some salt creap but just wipe it off. i used mag external for years with not problems. i would reather them be outside than in due to heat that they produce. [IMG]

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as you can see it's a mag18 on my 29 and is working like a champ. i would not recommend up and over due to it possibly running dry. you can always use a check valve on the intake side to prevent back drain and suction loss. most pumps are self priming. if you decide to go up and over then is you can get the sump higher than the pump then it will help, this is a odd way of doing it but the are several ways to deal with it. the best way is to drill the sump or go internal. and last of i have a sump in the garage that might work for you. it's ray's but i just got done plumbing his new tank and new sump and this one i got i'm cleaning for him. but i know he is looking to sell it. and if it's to big or not what you are looking for give me a ring and i'll help you design a sump and see what david would charge to build to one. 321-266-8564. leave me a message if i don't answer

lifesworksataol · #11 01/07/2008, 08:48 AM

i think the problem is room for not drilling. but she has to have the pump there anyways, so i dont know.drilling is always the answer :-D haha

Cheekmonkey · #12 01/07/2008, 10:22 AM

jade2122 · #13 01/07/2008, 10:45 AM

it is a glass sump how much does that cost to get drilled? I'm just trying to save some cash by not drilling it...also how safe is it to drill into a 30 gallon tank?

jade2122 · #14 01/07/2008, 10:45 AM

how do you get that to prime cheeky??

teog · #15 01/07/2008, 11:30 AM

I wouldnt do a up and over either. To many problems can occur with this type of setup. Get it drilled or go with in the sump pump.

At one time I had a mag 24 running in the sump of my 180g and never had a raise of temp. I would imagin if you run a mag 24 on a smaller tank you would have a rise. As would any pump in a sump.

lifesworksataol · #16 01/07/2008, 12:17 PM

you can get it done at oviedo glass or just ask around on the site. its like 15 bucks or something like that. its super cheap and well worth it. its not hard to do and if it breaks you can just put a piece of plexi on the inside and go on with it.

skinnyjoe1976 · #17 01/07/2008, 03:20 PM

sitc drills and 30 gallon should be okay. just remember not to over tighten the bulkhead. it just needs to seal.

Cheekmonkey · #18 01/07/2008, 03:28 PM

After major maitnence when I take the pump out, I take off the upside L portion to the left and pour water in the down pipe... I then replace the L and turn the pump on that primes it...

But even when u turn the pump off for hours it maintains the siphon, the only time you have to prime it is when you take the plumbing apart

AquaKnight407 · #19 01/07/2008, 03:37 PM

I would avoid this for two reasons. I know Mags are listed for external, but I don't have total confidence in that (love them for in sump though). I don't like that U idea for a mag. Also I wouldn't worry at all about heat. I have 2 Mag 18's on my 125gal and temps are never a problem (with MH lights too).

Getting the tank drilled should be pretty easy. I just got a 29 drilled for the new fuge on my 125. Posted on the FMAS RC board and they were quick to help. Someone here should be able to do it. If not, SITC or Oviedo Glass are two options.

jade2122 · #20 01/07/2008, 03:54 PM

yea but a mag 24 on a 90 would probably be a big hot, also 500 watts of halide and 440 watts of vho plus all the other equipment in tank/sump. i think it would be too much heat. i will most likely just get sump drilled. i have never plumbed an external pump before..what do i need to know. the in and out are 1 in.

skinnyjoe1976 · #21 01/07/2008, 04:53 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by jade2122
yea but a mag 24 on a 90 would probably be a big hot, also 500 watts of halide and 440 watts of vho plus all the other equipment in tank/sump. i think it would be too much heat. i will most likely just get sump drilled. i have never plumbed an external pump before..what do i need to know. the in and out are 1 in.

pm me or give me a call because it can be difficult to do and i will help you plumb the tank

evega · #22 01/07/2008, 09:11 PM

Yes Mag24 and Mag18 they do leak from O ring.

jade2122 · #23 01/08/2008, 11:09 AM

hey skinnyjoe >> going to drill the sump just to make things easier, SITC will do it for $15. Does anyone else have trouble with mags leaking?

skinnyjoe1976 · #24 01/08/2008, 02:42 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by jade2122
hey skinnyjoe >> going to drill the sump just to make things easier, SITC will do it for $15. Does anyone else have trouble with mags leaking?

the only issues i've seen is when people buy them second hand and they sit dry for long periods of time and they don't remove the volute and clean and lube the seal. but other than that none of mine and i think i've used 15 or so over the years from mag5 to mag 36 and never a problem. the only 2 problems i've had is one of the 24's magnets exploded but bought it second hand and i overtighten the volute on one and cracked it but other than that the are just power hogs. and if you plumb it yourself make sure to do your self a favor and use unions and ball valves before and after you pump so you can service it with out lossing any water and allows you to throttle the pump better. also run the 1" as far as you can so you can keep the gph. you can even increase the gph by inducing the inlet and outlet to 1.5" instead of 1" but you will lose total feet at shutoff. btw you need to take the pump with the fittings to sitc so the know how far up to drill the hole if not drilled in the correct location it can put a bind on the hole and the plumbing

jade2122 · #25 01/08/2008, 06:22 PM

thanks a ton skinny!