UV is very beneficial

[gabe3d]

I've been in the hobby for some time and never really heard any strong or conclusive matter that would make the use of one a no brainer. It is only until a couple of days ago did i realize how much the UV is actually beneficial to my system. When i first built my system a year ago I bought a UV sterilizer for my system since it was on sale and I had some money to spare. My thinking back then was that even if it didn't do anything it wouldn't hurt anything, boy was I wrong.

Last week as I removed the bulb from the unit i broke the bulb, upon looking for a replacement bulb I couldn't justify spending $60 for something I couldn't visually see helping my system. As days went by algae started to appear very rapidly on the glass and rock. I didn't think much of it until it became obvious that something was problematic. First thing was to check my parameters, but only to find that everything is good. Bulbs are less than a month old so was ruled out earlier on. Long story short, as oppose to buying a new UV bulb, since i couldn't find one locally, I went to a pond shop and bought a much larger and heavy duty one for my tank.

Within a day and a half the water clarity was obviously different and all the algae on the rock were gone. I couldn't believe the result and change after using the UV. I am now never going to set up a tank without one.

[ClayWagner]

What kind of skimmer do you have? Do you use an carbon/phosban? What's your livestock like (fish/corals)? My UV sterilzer did control algae, but it's a known fact that it kills ALL organisms good and bad. I feel a system should be able to operate without one if possible, and if you're getting algae and other nuiscances that quickly after taking out the UV then something is whack with your filtration. When my sterilzer broke I got some algae as well (fixed with new skimmer), but I noticed my corals grew about 3x faster without it! Coralline started shooting up everywhere and my fish's colors and activity increased as well. I feel that UV's are an impedence on the tank's biological filtration as well, because it kills nitrogenous bacteria that are in the water column of the UV. Not to mention the increased temp from close proximity to the UV bulb. But if it works for you, don't mess with success ;0). Lots of big time reefers with HUGE tanks don't bother with UV's, maybe from experience? Who knows...I've only seen a UV setup on maybe one tank of the month for a LONG time. Try leaving it off for a month or two and tell me how the corals grow.

[kdblove_99]

I also use one and IMO i feel it takes out more bad than good so i will always continue to use one!

[sjm817]

Originally posted by ClayWagner
What kind of skimmer do you have? Do you use an carbon/phosban? What's your livestock like (fish/corals)? My UV sterilzer did control algae, but it's a known fact that it kills ALL organisms good and bad. I feel a system should be able to operate without one if possible, and if you're getting algae and other nuiscances that quickly after taking out the UV then something is whack with your filtration. When my sterilzer broke I got some algae as well (fixed with new skimmer), but I noticed my corals grew about 3x faster without it! Coralline started shooting up everywhere and my fish's colors and activity increased as well. I feel that UV's are an impedence on the tank's biological filtration as well, because it kills nitrogenous bacteria that are in the water column of the UV. Not to mention the increased temp from close proximity to the UV bulb. But if it works for you, don't mess with success ;0). Lots of big time reefers with HUGE tanks don't bother with UV's, maybe from experience? Who knows...I've only seen a UV setup on maybe one tank of the month for a LONG time. Try leaving it off for a month or two and tell me how the corals grow.

Dont agree. UV only kills what is in the water column. Beneficial bacteria is in the sand, LR, surfaces, not free in the water. That is why you have a sandbed and LR to house bacteria. I run a small 36W UV on my system and have an insane amount of Coraline. I run it just because i like the extra clarity in the water.

[ClayWagner]

Read up on nitrogenous bacteria there bud. Although nitrifiers create a biofilm on rocks and sand, they are most certainly in the water column. (how do you think they move from "live" rocks to "dead" rocks?) Both chemolith/autotrophs (inorganic/organic nitrogenous bacteria) are VERY sensitive to sunlight/UV light. This is why it's bad to have a DT in a room with lots of sunlight. I've taken several micro/macro/molecular biology classes and the effects of UV light DOES decrease the amount of nitrogenous microbes in the aquarium, whether you'd like to agree or not. Does it outweigh the cons? Who knows...

[sjm817]

The beneficial bacteria in your LR and sand is what you need, Unless you cram it through a UV, it doesn't get touched. Any that is free floating and gets affected by the UV is inconsequential.

I've been running one for ~ 7 months now, and my tank hasn't crashed. So I can assume that my beneficial bacteria is still in place.

[ClayWagner]

Free floating bacterial is inconsequential eh? Where do you think this would go without a UV sterilizer? Perhaps settle somewhere and start to colonize a larger nitrifying population? I think so...

[luke33]

There are bacterial in the water but we have so much in our LR and Sand it doesn't matter if it gets zapped in our UV's. Its so minimal its not going to matter and besides, if it were to make a negative impact, more bacteria culture's would grow on our LR or sandbed.

[sjm817]

Originally posted by ClayWagner
Free floating bacterial is inconsequential eh? Where do you think this would go without a UV sterilizer? Perhaps settle somewhere and start to colonize a larger nitrifying population? I think so...

So, since I'm running a UV, and it is killing my bacteria. What are the negative symptoms, and when will I see them?

This topic has been covered many times in many threads. If UV does affect the very small amount of free floating beneficial bacteria, it is a non issue.

[ClayWagner]

First of all, there are far more benificial microorganisms/organisms than nitrogenous bacterial (phyto,zoo,etc.). Second of all, I never stated you would see "negative symtoms", I was just simply stating my better experiences without one. Don't get your panties in a bunch, I wasn't dissing UV users. I even stated that if it works for you "don't mess with success". Don't be so biased towards something that has worked for you. And if anyone has been in this hobby for more than a month you would know that just because you don't SEE something happening doesn't mean it's not happening. Of course UV sterilizers increase water clarity, no doubt about it. And in some cases (phytoblooms) their benefits greatly outweigh the assumed negative effects. IME without one I had a lot more growth in my corals before putting it on and after taking it off. Could this be the only factor? Of course not, but it is assumed so. The corals (couple of caps and acros) that my return penductors were aiming at almost holted in growth until I removed the sterilizer, and now their back to growing like weeds.

[gabe3d]

My filtration system is not too bad. I have a Korallen Zucht M skimmer, i run three fluidized reactors, and a 30 gallon fuge. Here is a pic of it and also a pic of the new UV.





Fish wise, i have a good amount.
-1 x regal angel 4''
-1 x purple tang 3.5''
-1 x naso tang 4''
-1 x blue spotted rabbitfish 5''
-1 x orange spotted rabbitfish 2.5''
-7 x blue green chromis
-4 x bartlett anthias
-2 x ocellaris clown

Bacterias that are beneficial to the nitrogen cycles are not in the water column for the vast majority of them, because of their anaerobic properties.

Corals as of now are going quite well and also i've never had a problem with slow corraline algae. I always need to scrape the back fo the glass every week to keep it clean.

[gabe3d]

Zooplankton and phytoplankton shouldn't be a problem either since i feed those regularly anyways.

[sjm817]

Originally posted by ClayWagner
First of all, there are far more benificial microorganisms/organisms than nitrogenous bacterial (phyto,zoo,etc.). Second of all, I never stated you would see "negative symtoms", I was just simply stating my better experiences without one. Don't get your panties in a bunch, I wasn't dissing UV users. I even stated that if it works for you "don't mess with success". Don't be so biased towards something that has worked for you. And if anyone has been in this hobby for more than a month you would know that just because you don't SEE something happening doesn't mean it's not happening. Of course UV sterilizers increase water clarity, no doubt about it. And in some cases (phytoblooms) their benefits greatly outweigh the assumed negative effects. IME without one I had a lot more growth in my corals before putting it on and after taking it off. Could this be the only factor? Of course not, but it is assumed so. The corals (couple of caps and acros) that my return penductors were aiming at almost holted in growth until I removed the sterilizer, and now their back to growing like weeds.

Maybe I did overreact a bit. Sorry about that "Bud" I'm not really biased towards or against UV. I'm fairly neutral on the subject. Other than a small increase in water clarity, I didn't see much of a change one way or the other. There has been no negative impact, nor would I expect to see one. There is a lot of misunderstanding and misinformation on UVs. They dont kill ich that is on your fish, nor do they kill the beneficial bacteria that the tank needs. These are the two things that come up constantly on these threads.

There is a guy in our area that sets up very large, very $$ high end reef systems, and also maintains them. He puts a UV on every system. His systems are gorgeous. I was talking to him one day and he was surprised that I didn't run one which is the reason I tried it.

[richofoz]

could someone please explain this statement to me?
"This is why it's bad to have a DT in a room with lots of sunlight"

Maybe I'm thinking along the wrong line here but don't all of the worlds coral reefs grow under direct sun light?
Pretty sure you could describe that as "Lots of sunlight!"

Am I missing something?

[ClayWagner]

Different kind of light. Nice system Gabe...keep up the good work .

[richofoz]

How is sunlight out side different to sunlight inside?

[ClayWagner]

I guess what I was trying to say is different angle of light. Nitrogenous bacteria grow in the crevaces of rocks away from light. If light is coming into your DT room, more than likely its at somewhat a horizontal angle and hits the DT in places you'd not like it too. Or at least that's what I think... This is why people put up shades that you can pull down over the edges of the tank in the morning when dawn comes and blasts light at the tank.

[jmchzn]

I use UV but I think it's a crutch. For the most part nutrient free water does not support all the bad things we kill with the uv BUT the UV kills all the good things we shouldnt be killing. So I achieve a nice reef and fish seem healthy. Corals seem heathly so I keep it running. Most really great huge reef tanks I've seen use UV for a couple hours a week or not at all. But these guys live w/ the reef 24/7. Don't jump all over me but I have a small life outside the reef.....NOT..hahhahahaha

[RandyStacyE]

I use UV and I dig it. I can see how many could think of it as a crutch though.

For instance if one were to slack off on their water changes then a UV may keep things from getting nasty as quick as it would if one did not use UV. All I mean is ... like gabe3d said, he shut his UV down for a while and it got green real quick.

Is there a masked water quality issue here or does the UV just help to maintain his system?

The use of UV 'may' mask a water quality issue and ya never know it until you shut down the UV.

I like UV because it works GREAT. Just use a good RO/DI unit, keep up on the water changes, don't over feed, etc... and your likelyhood of problems should be to a minimum (if any).

I once picked up a fish from a LFS and it had ick. Next thing I knew all my fish were carrying ick around. I can honestly say that since I picked up UV I never saw ick again. I know UV only kills what passes through it, but the fact remains I never saw ick since.

[oct2274]

i agree with people who think UV is a mask for bad water quality. You should not need UV unless you are trying to get rid of something like ick = won't totally rid system, but will definitely slow the spread. UV = bandage

[sjm817]

I use filter socks, a powerful skimmer, refugium, carbon, and UV for water filtration. The UV is no more of a "mask for bad water quality" than any of the other filtration methods. My water quality is very good with or without it. It is just another method of keeping the water clean.

[gabe3d]

My water quality is not a problem at all, i've tested the water many times using a variety of test kits. Don't get me wrong about the UV, when i meant I had algae starting to grow I didn't mean an outbreak. I have perhaps 10 snails, which I know is very low, in my tank and I usually clean the glass only once a week at most, with the UV working. But without it it have to do it every other day or so to keep it clean. I think having algae growing on your glass is quite normal so if I can find a way to reduce this and also gain the visibly clearer water then I don't mind running a UV. I'm not saying that it is a must have item to run a successful good reef and also i don't think it is a bandage as it doesn't really fix anything rather just makes water clearer, not cleaner.

[DarG]

Most people dont run UV's large enough and/or with the correct flow to kill everything that passes through it. In fact, with the UV units most hobbyists use I wouldnt be at all surprised if alot more passed through living that ends up "dead". It takes a surprisingly large unit to kill everything in a single pass.

My 25 watt unit on my 90 gallon definitely is not killing eveything that passes through it, very far from it.

I bet alot more people would use them if it guaranteed that you couldnt have a hair algae outbreak alone. I mean, the way a UV sterilizer is depicted by some, it kills absolutely everything, good and bad. If that was the case, nobody using a UV should ever experience a nuisance algae outbreak.

I have run a UV for probably 25 years. There have been times in that period where I couldnt afford a new bulb right away or a new unit when an old one burned out. But I have run them for the majority of that time. You can most certainly experience nuisance algae while running a UV. You can have coralline growing out your ears with a UV running. Never had any nitrification issues while running one. I think it's a tool that helps control parasites, helps with algae control - water clarity. I dont see how it is a "crutch". Crutch for what? I have admittedly neglected a tank before while running UV 24/7 and I can tell you that it doesnt prevent a neglected tank from going south, quick.

It's an aid for those who use it, that's all it is.

[bergzy]

uv has been an interesting topic for me, as has ozone...

before i ran zeovit, my water clarity was 'clear', when i ran ozone...water clarity became transparent...

with zeovit...you are not to use ozone or uv...

my water became 'invisible'...

my wife even commented the third day of zeovit 'is there something wrong with the tank? the water is too clear!'

the basis behind zeovit is a bacterioplanktonic oligotrohic based system..fancy way of saying it using little critters to consume the nasties AND they become food for the corals.

since tapering off zeovit...i noticed nuisance algae creeping back up...esp cycano which i havent seen in years...

to get rid of this, i now dose vodka where the ethanol has been 'studied' (i dont know if any saltwater studies have been done though) to create exponential bacterial growth.

water clarity has gone from clear to invisible again, my cyano disappeared within a week and my corals are growing happily away.

thus:

for me...

ozone and uv would have a detrimental effect on the bacterioplanktonic population that is present in the water column.

just another 'thing' to think about!

[reefwisher]

Let say your nitrate read at 20 ppm. If you shut down your uv. Will your nitrate decrease since your not eradicating the nitrogenous bacteria in your water column. Just a thought.