What pump is as quiet as a Velocity but won't raise the tank temp?

[sicshift]

I have a Velocity T-4 for my 80 gallon. I have an open top with hanging halide pendants. My tank temp averages about 80-82 but now that summer is coming along, it's rising.

I'm going to be putting fans on it, especially when I get a canopy for it. Then I'll have quite a few.

I'm not interested in buying a chiller yet either. My buddy (Rleechb) has nearly the same setup only a few miles from here and his tank doesn't have the heat problem mine does. We have the same lighting and sump and tank size is almost the same but he doesn't have a velocity.

So I'm thinking about switching. Anyone have a recommendation? This tank is also in my bedroom close to my bed so silence is the most important thing. Rleechb has said that the Iwasaki is nearly as quiet but doesn't have the heat problems. Anyone have opinions?

[MarkM3]

Personally, I have not run a velocity pump, thus can't directly compare the noise or heat transfer to the water. However, I do have a little giant MDQX3 (not 100% sure that is the exact model number, but it is the "3" model). It is extrememly quiet; more quiet than my euroreef, more quiet than my MH ballasts, more quiet than my old rio powerheads ever were. The motor does get scorching hot, but the motor is spaced off the pump housing nearly 1/2" to prevent heat transfer.

[photobarry]

Installing the fans so they blow across the water's surface should help quite a lot. This past week my tank room has been getting up to 85 but the tank water never went above 80.

[Stretch]

The velocity heat issue is far over blown......

I never found a temp increase, when adding it, prefectly silent.


If you don't want the heat, you get the noise, don't what the noise get the heat can hav both generally .

[mikeo1210]

The velocity heat is not "over blown".. 4+ degrees is substantial.

sicshift-You may have already chosen a pump.. being that this is a few weeks old.. I have the same issue and read on Bob Fenner's site where it was suggested that an Ampmaster was a good replacement for the velocity. Silent w/ no heat transfer.

The little giant sounds interesting. I hadn't considered that one to this point.

[isom]

your T4 raises your tank temp 4 degrees!? what size is the tank? if your pump is really raising your temp 4 degrees all on its own then you have must have a defective pump or some other problem.

Yes, T4's may add some heat to a system, but 4 degrees is outrageous and certainly not average. i have a T4 on a 100g and i haven't seen much of an increase at all.

all pumps are going to add heat, especially submersibles like the mags. external pumps will add heat too, and it seems the velocities add more heat than others. the amount of heat that these pumps add should pale in comparison to the heat added by lighting, especially halides.

[mikeo1210]

Do a search if you like. Velocities are known for adding a lot of heat. AT LEAST 3 to 4 degrees. More than any other pump.

[Clyde]

its because its water cooled, not fan cooled.

you could try putting a fan on it, but it might turn as loud as a iwaki ?

[mikeo1210]

Yea, so what's a good replacement?

Do you experience w/ Little Giant?

[isom]

mikeo1210,
i've done the searches and i've read many threads about the T4. I did a ton of research before i bought the pump. most people experience a 1 or maybe 2 degree increase, which i think is an overestimate as most people do not actually isolate the pump and observe the heat it adds.

how did you decide that the pump adds 4 degrees to the tank? were you running the system at a stable temp, then added the velocity, and then observed a 4 degree increase? i just have a hard time believing that your t4 raises your tank volume (which looks like 135 gallons by your sig) 4 whole degrees alll by itself. the pump would have to be giving off a MASSIVE amount of heat to raise 135 gallons by 4 degrees.

[mikeo1210]

I've had different pumps on my setup. I know this pump adds 4 degrees to my system.

It IS a fact that the velocity adds a good deal of heat to one's tank. There's nothing to argue here.

The downside to this board is having to sift through arbitrary opinionated responses to find the mindful ones that are based on actual experience.

Do you have anything to offer the original poster? Experience with other pumps?

[MalHavoc]

The reason why Velocity pumps are so quiet is because they have no fan. Any pump with a fan will be louder than the Velocity pumps, including Little Giant pumps. The exception is the 3MDQX, which has no fan (and is why it gets so hot).

You have to ask yourself what you want in a pump. The "QX" series of Little Giant pumps are not pressure rated. The T1 and T3 Velocity pumps are. Ampmaster pumps are not. Is this for a closed loop? A sump return?

[Wilafur]

toss a fan over the sump and it will counteract the heat increase associated with the t3. a 6" clip on will reduce the temp by approximately 2-4degrees.

another fan blowing directly over the surface of the tank will reduce the temps by another 2-4 degrees.

[isom]

mikey,

i would hardly consider my posts "arbitrary" as they ARE based on actual experience. AS I SAID, I run a T4 on my system...perhaps you should read a little more carefully. also, i am not arguing that T4's do not add heat. again, you should read more closely. i am just arguing that T4's in general do not add as much heat as you claim they do. To me, this seems very relevant to the original post.

As far as an alternative pump, i've used iwakis in the past, but they are VERY loud. An iwaki 40rlt that i had setup in my family room sounded like someone was running jets on a hot tub at full power. sure, it didn't add much heat, but I couldn't take the noise. i opted to go with the velocity and a chiller. I'd rather spend a little extra and have a nearly silent setup.

like MalHavoc said, any pump with a fan is going to be loud. Any pump w/o a fan will add heat to the system. It just depends on how much noise you are willing to tolerate.

[mikeo1210]

Originally posted by MalHavoc
The reason why Velocity pumps are so quiet is because they have no fan. Any pump with a fan will be louder than the Velocity pumps, including Little Giant pumps. The exception is the 3MDQX, which has no fan (and is why it gets so hot).

MH-

So Ampmasters and QX series Little Giants have no fan and do not add heat, correct?

MarkM3 stated above that he has the 3MDQX and that the motor gets hot but, the way it's designed it supp. doesn't transfer heat to the tank.

Not ALL pumps w/o fans transfer heat. What did you mean by them not being pressure rated?

This is for my return.

Wilafur- Thanks for adding to the topic.

[MalHavoc]

The only LG pump that doesn't have a fan is the -3 model. All of the other ones have fans. The Ampmaster pumps don't run completely cool either. They may not have fans, but they lose a ton of their flowrate when placed in an environment where they have to work against head pressure. The Little Giant MDQX-3 may run cooler than the T4, but it's also pushing 300 GPH less water.

How much heat a T4 will dump into your tank depends on a bunch of factors. Yes, they run hot. Sure, they add heat to the tank. But the size of the tank, and the relative temperature in the room will have a lot to say about it. DJ88 (another mod here on RC) has a T4 on his small 30 gallon tank and he has no heat issue with it, as far as I can tell. In my case, my tank is in a room with an ambient temperature in the low 60s most of the time. In that sort of environment, a T4 will probably just end up making your heater turn on less. If you're already dealing with heat issues from other things, like metal halides or a hot room, then common sense dictates that it's not a good idea to add a pump that many people refer to as a "space heater".

"pressure rated" pumps are designed to work in environments where they have to deal with a lot of head pressure. For instance, a sump in the basement would need a pump that could pump all the way back to the tank. An ampmaster would die in that sort of situation, whereas a pressure-rated pump like an Iwaki would probably do quite well, provided you start out with something that satisfies your flowrate requirements. Poke around with RC's head loss calculator at http://reefcentral.com/calc/hlc2.php to see what satisfies your requirements.

Sometimes, a noisy pump is noisy because of other issues. Try putting a vibration pad underneath it, or use flexible tubing between the sump and the pump and the pump and your rigid return line to isolate vibration, or try soundproofing your cabinet with cork soundboard or something. Probably a lot cheaper than spending money on a new pump.

[yessongs]

I don't know how quiet they are http://www.aquadirect.com/store/cust...me.php?cat=224

[MalHavoc]

The blueline pumps are basically Iwaki pumps. They are fan cooled. My experiences with them show them to be slightly more quiet than an Iwaki, but not by a whole lot.

[yessongs]

To reduce evaporation, instead of placing a fan over the sump can you point it at the pump?

[mikeo1210]

The fan is meant to increase evaporation thus cooling the water. Pointing the fan at the pump won't do this.

Jason-My problem is a hot room. I can't afford the increase in heat from any of my tank's equipment. That being said, the hottest the house will get is the mid 70s. Every other reefer I've met in my area doesn't run a chiller as it doesn't get that hot here.

I had sound proof board before when I had my MAK4 but, it was too loud. Now the velocity is too hot. This is where I am, "back at the drawing board".

[salt lick]

I did some quick thermodynamics calcs:

so if you sealed your 80 gal tank (no heat out), and the 150 watt T4 put half the energy into the water then the temp would rise about 8 deg F

evaporating 1.5 gals per day removes the same amout of heat as a 50% efficient 150 watt pump adds (if you evaporate 1.5 gals per day that will equal a pump adding 75 watts 24 hours/day to the water).

of course heat is lost thru the walls etc. also.

so T4 will not raise your water temp if you have a fan!

P.S. I run a T4, a T3 and an Ampmaster 3k on my 225 gal
and the temp is same as room without lights

[JohnM99]

I actually measured the difference between a Blueline and a T4 on my systems - with about 160 g of water the temp rose 1-2 deg F with the Velocity. I added a fan and left it on overnight and it plunged the temp down to 71 deg!!! (from 82).
So, now I have it on a Temp controller - the fan comes on once in a while on a hot day, but is mostly off. The pump is not powerful enough, but the Blueline I had was too powerful. The Velocity is by far the quietest pump I have ever come across, but it did add a bit of heat - not too much.

[JohnM99]

Salt Lick - out of interest, how much louder is the Ampmaster than the T4?

[salt lick]

John,
Ampmaster is almost same as T4, you have to touch it to tell it is running. How are the Blueline pumps?

[bigcat39]

I have a Panworld (Blueline) 100PX on my return. It is not the quietest thing in the world, sounds a LOT like a dishwasher pump. BUT, it does not seem to add any heat at all to the tank. And it really moves water. WMMV.