Sulfur DeNITRIFIER DIY!!! - Page 5

BOTR · #**101** 12/30/2007, 11:02 AM

If you guys are talking about flow rates of 60 drops per minute, why not just use the aqua-lifter pump? It would be a straight connection to the RO unit, and you could use 1/4" all around.

I do like the idea of a 50' coil before the unit as well. I know what Im using my time off for now!

Thanks,
Chris

IBASSFSH · #**102** 12/30/2007, 02:38 PM

I just ordered some sulphur balls for the set up at this link.

http://www.aquaticeco.com/index.cfm/...etail/iid/4912

There may be cheaper places out there, but I did not research too much.
I am currently waiting on a response from "The Filter Guys" on how much a set up like Melev's would run. If they are willing to sell such items. Here is their link:

http://www.thefilterguys.biz/

I also have another link to another site for price comaparison. I used to use them prior to switching to the Filter Guys.

http://www.aquariumwaterfilters.com/...pshop&Itemid=1

Another link to a place that has needle valves for flow control:

http://www.usplastic.com/catalog/pro...ookie%5Ftest=1

Once again there may be cheaper places to purchase this stuff. If anyone finds this stuff cheaper please post where you found it.

IBASSFSH · #**103** 12/30/2007, 02:41 PM

I did not order the Siporax due to it needing to be fed alcohol periodically.

melev · #**104** 12/30/2007, 04:19 PM

I took another water sample today. pH was 8.3 coming out of the reactor, and NO3 was still higher than 10ppm.

t-bone2 · #**105** 12/30/2007, 04:27 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by TulsaReefer
The chamber(s) don't have to be clear, but there are some advantages if they are. Over time, a very heavy bacterial film can build up over the sulfur, and if you can see it, you will know ahead of time that it's about time to clean the filter. Often when this heavy film builds up the filter will soon need cleaning or it will begin to emit H2S. If it isn't clear you won't be able to see this, and will have to wait until you smell it, which you probably will, just a little later. And it also makes it easier to see if the calcium media (ARM, etc.) has dissolved to the point where you need to replace/augment it. But in the end there is no real reason you couldn't build one that wasn't clear, just would be a bit more difficult to monitor.

thanks

TulsaReefer · #**106** 12/30/2007, 04:45 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by melev
I took another water sample today. pH was 8.3 coming out of the reactor, and NO3 was still higher than 10ppm.

Looking back over my log from when I set up my unit in March, it took a few days before I saw an real NO3 reduction, then it jumped back up for a few days, and then it finally took about 14 days running at 1 drop per second flow rate before the effluent was coming out at zero (my tank was around 50 at that time). Then I turned up the flow to 2 drops per second and it took a couple more weeks to drop back to zero again. Then again when I sent to 3 drops per second, and after that I pretty much left my unit at that flow rate. It also seems that the higher the NO3 in the tank, the longer it may take to break in, so if your tank is lower, it may take less time before the effluent drops to zero. This makes sense since it takes less time for the level of bacteria to increase to handle a lower incoming NO3 load.

Another thing to consider is that while sulfur denitrification can help to drop NO3 to zero, it's still important to do water changes. The chemistry involved actually produces sulfate, which is a relatively common compound in seawater, but not something that you would really want to raise to really high levels in a tank. Standard water changes should help keep the sulfate level down and from becoming a potential problem. But it is nice that you can do water changes now because of other reasons, as you need them, not driven by the constant need to bring down NO3. And it's also nice to be able to feed your tank pretty heavy and not have to worry about Nitrate formation.

Keep us posted, it's always interesting to see how these filters respond to different tanks and conditions. I know when I installed my unit I was testing daily just to keep an eye on what was happening. Some units seem to break in almost immediately, while others can take weeks or even months.

It's also interesting now that these units are becoming more mainstream, when I researched them last year there were very few people using them yet in the U.S., though it seems there have been people using them in Europe for some time now.

melev · #**107** 12/30/2007, 05:50 PM

Thanks for the information Lee. I'd read those and saw what you did, but I can't hear it enough right at the moment since I'm sort of in the thick of it now.

I noticed one person had theirs running fully open for 24 hours and then switched it to 1 drop per second, and I didn't do that. I'm guessing it will take longer to colony my media because of that.

TulsaReefer · #**108** 12/30/2007, 06:10 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by melev
Thanks for the information Lee. I'd read those and saw what you did, but I can't hear it enough right at the moment since I'm sort of in the thick of it now.

I noticed one person had theirs running fully open for 24 hours and then switched it to 1 drop per second, and I didn't do that. I'm guessing it will take longer to colony my media because of that.

I don't think it's that critical, when I asked what the purpose was I was told that it was just to get any bubbles flushed out of the system. One of the coolest parts of these types of units is that the bacteria that colonize into them are the same type that can be found in black smokers in the ocean, where sulfurous materials are brought to the ocean floor.

dkuster · #**109** 12/31/2007, 05:41 PM

Well, I tested for NO3 in the efluent a few days ago and it was still about the same as the main tank water (25 - 50 ppm).

But today I noticed the rotten egg smell. It got bad enough that the wife noticed "something stinky" when coming in the house.

I slowed the drip rate coming out of the reactor and the smell seems to have gone away. I estimate the drip rate to still be high (somewhere around 120 drops per minute).

bgcook · #**110** 12/31/2007, 06:01 PM

dkuster - you say the rotten egg smell is coming from the reactor even though the nitrates tested 25-50. i am no expert, so those of you who are please correct, but the rotten egg smell should mean that the reactor is too slow releasing hydrogen sulfide. i think you may need to increase the drip rate.

bgcook · #**111** 12/31/2007, 06:01 PM

dkuster - you say the rotten egg smell is coming from the reactor even though the nitrates tested 25-50. i am no expert, so those of you who are please correct, but the rotten egg smell should mean that the reactor is too slow releasing hydrogen sulfide. i think you may need to increase the drip rate.

IBASSFSH · #**112** 01/01/2008, 05:49 PM

Anyone have any updates?

bgcook · #**113** 01/01/2008, 05:50 PM

mine is up and running for 3 wks now. effluent zero, tank nitrates around 5. i have had no problems so far. drip rate just over 60 drops per minute.

IBASSFSH · #**114** 01/01/2008, 08:43 PM

I have noticed that the Korallin and Midwest units combine their media together. Do you think it would work in RO unit combination? I have seen cartridge chambers that are 14"-20" (I think), that would make it easier to combine medias. You could add your own sponge to seperate the two as the more expensive units do. This may enable people to use just one or two chambers vs. the three configuration models.

I would like to ask each person trying/using one of these units to post how you started them. How many drips to start out, and so on.

melev · #**115** 01/01/2008, 09:00 PM

Mine has been set up for a few days now, and I'm watching to make sure it stays at 1 drop per second. It is really too early for me to state anything of significance.

The sulfur media I got only is maybe 2.5" worth, but from what I've ready that shouldn't be a factor.

dvanacker · #**116** 01/02/2008, 04:14 PM

I order some clear canisters to try this.......it may be what I'm looking for. Will post updates hopefully as well as everyone else.

BOTR · #**117** 01/02/2008, 04:21 PM

Just binging up my earlier question. Is there any reason an aqua-lifter could not be used?

bgcook · #**118** 01/02/2008, 04:33 PM

i thought about using a aqua-lifter (had an extra one from an old cpr overflow), i just wasn't sure that it would have enough pressure to go through to canisters with the refillable units. i initially hooked one up in the sink and i just didn't feel the output was very powerful. it seemed to be too easy to plug the tubing with my finger. not much pressure at all. the maxi jet i am using, i also plugged into the sink with the current connections and it just seemed to have much more force. my opinion is that the aqualifter isn't powerful enough. didn't try it, so i can't say for sure.

melev · #**119** 01/02/2008, 04:37 PM

It would have been nice to use an Aqualifter at a mere 3w of power, but I couldn't get a Maxijet 400 to work, so I seriously doubt the Aqualifter could handle the backpressure the way mine is set up.

dkuster · #**120** 01/04/2008, 12:25 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by bgcook
dkuster - you say the rotten egg smell is coming from the reactor even though the nitrates tested 25-50. i am no expert, so those of you who are please correct, but the rotten egg smell should mean that the reactor is too slow releasing hydrogen sulfide. i think you may need to increase the drip rate.

Well, maybe I did the opposite of what I should have, but the smell did go away and it hasn't returned. The main reason I reduced the flow rate was because I was still reading nitrates in the efluent.

I'll test the water again later today and post a followup.

dkuster · #**121** 01/08/2008, 12:03 PM

Just as a followup, I tested the efluent water again over the weekend. Tank nitrates are somewhere between 25 and 50 ppm, while the efluent nitrates are reading 10 ppm. Not quite zero yet, but heading in the right direction.

I also tested for calcium. Main tank is at 400 ppm while efluent is at 420 ppm. So the sulfur denitrator does add some calcium.

Quote:

Originally posted by dkuster
Well, maybe I did the opposite of what I should have, but the smell did go away and it hasn't returned. The main reason I reduced the flow rate was because I was still reading nitrates in the efluent.

I'll test the water again later today and post a followup.

melev · #**122** 01/08/2008, 04:23 PM

I tested mine a couple of nights ago, and it was still 35ppm coming out of the reactor. I started mine after you started yours, so I'm hoping that it is just a time-period thing that will soon start doing what it should.

TulsaReefer · #**123** 01/08/2008, 09:19 PM

My experience with these is that each unit is very individual and may take a different amount of time to get going. There are so many factors that play into how quickly the bacteria grow that it's hard to predict the length of time it will take. A small difference in temperature, water flow, pH, nitrate level, and many other factors can play into the equation. But for all those trying this, just be patient, and it will in most all cases come around. Some people seem lucky and the nitrates drop almost immediately. For others it takes quite a while.

And once the unit does kick in, you have to keep things in perspective too. I did some calculations based on drip rates when I started out, and at 60 drops per minute (assuming about 12 drops per ml, which is what I measured out of my unit, your drop size may vary slightly), your only really doing about 1.87 gallons of water a day. And you can multiply it out from there, at 3 drops per second your doing about 5.6 gallons per day. But then at the same time, it's like doing a 5.6 gallon water change every day, and this is where the nitrates begin to head downward. But at the same time, it also means that it's not going to drop your nitrates in a large volume of water overnight either, it will take time. But as long as the unit is removing nitrate at a faster rate than your tank produces, your still going to be heading down, add in a few water changes, and before you know it you'll be enjoying zero (or near zero) nitrate water.

IBASSFSH · #**124** 01/08/2008, 09:30 PM

dkuster how has your alkalinity been holding up? Anyone else?

melev · #**125** 01/08/2008, 09:40 PM

That's what I'm hoping Lee. I tested today, and it seems like it still is the same level as the reef.