Harlequin Shrimp, are they ethical????

[cbicop]

I am not going to get into a long drawn out explanation of my opinion.

I just want to cast my vote that I think it is totally fine to feed any animal what it would naturally eat in the wild.

[GettingFiesty]

Agreed.

[Hoggn]

Pork, The other White Meat!

[thrlride]

Originally posted by cbicop
I am not going to get into a long drawn out explanation of my opinion.

I just want to cast my vote that I think it is totally fine to feed any animal what it would naturally eat in the wild.

I agree as well.

[revrenhex]

Im with Rick

And im down for Urchin nuts.










That is all.

[sihaya]

Originally posted by RicksReefs
your obtuse commentary is pretty clear to me. 'we need to make
our own moral judgements' about these things indicates to me
that you feel your on a superior moral ground than the rest of us
that do consume meat.

I honestly don't see the connection... how is saying "everyone needs to make their own moral judgements" in anyway claiming moral superiority?

IMO, whether or not you eat meat has
nothing to do with morality, it's a personal choice,

How is saying the above any different from saying "everyone needs to make their own moral judgements?"

but when you attempt to denegrate the rest of
humanity because we don't agree with you is a direct blow to
any 'morality' you have.

I don't remember denigrating anyone. Again, read my posts more carefully. I mention how Dr. Ron knows much more about the facts on which I base my decision to be a vegetarian... but that at the same time, he himself is not a vegetarian. And everyone knows I adore him.

But anyway, I really don't know why you're so irked... just put me on ignore already.

[Jamesurq]

Originally posted by RicksReefs
your obtuse commentary is pretty clear to me. 'we need to make
our own moral judgements' about these things indicates to me
that you feel your on a superior moral ground than the rest of us
that do consume meat. IMO, whether or not you eat meat has
nothing to do with morality, it's a personal choice, and i'm all for
personal choice, but when you attempt to denegrate the rest of
humanity because we don't agree with you is a direct blow to
any 'morality' you have.

And if you denegrate the rest of humanity, aren't you denegrating the entire American society? Well, you can do whatever you want to us, but we're not going to sit here and listen to you badmouth the United States of America.

Gentlemen!

[Hoggn]

Originally posted by sihaya
I mention how Dr. Ron knows much more about the facts on which I base my decision to be a vegetarian... but that at the same time, he himself is not a vegetarian.

So why is it you don't like Meat?

[sihaya]

Originally posted by kgallich
So why is it you don't like Meat?

I don't not like meat... quite the contrary, back when I ate it I liked it a lot. (especially Alpaca which is just so tender and delicious I could drool just thinking about it...)

But the reason I don't eat meat anymore is because with the world's population as it is... the regular consumption of meat is simply unsustainable. One of the main reasons the reefs are disappearing is because the oceans are being drained of life by fisherman. No, they don't drag their nets directly over the reefs... but you can't just draw a line around the reefs, call it a national park and hope to protect it. Everything in the sea is connected. You can't take out all the salmon and all the tuna and all the herring and all the sharks, etc... and expect the reefs not to suffer dearly. And additionally, the pollution and environmental destruction caused by the beef and poultry industries is just horrific. Not to mention that a lot of their practices are just cruel.

Now, I have little problem with hunters who go out into forrests overcrowded with deer and take home a month's supply of deer meat.

It's not about eating meat in and of itself... it's about the consequences of obtaining it.

[sihaya]

It's funny... a lot of people think that as a vegetarian I'd have a real problem with hunters. When in fact I have a lot of respect for many of them. Most of them are profoundly concerned about preserving the environment. They are very careful to be as humane as possible in the way they kill the animals they hunt. And the last thing they want is to threaten the existance of an animal or its natural habitat.

I've even known hunters who wouldn't eat anything they didn't kill themselves. (Though I'm not going to say that's common)

Certainly there are hunters that don't fit this ideal description... but I'm just re-enforcing the point that it's not primarily about eating meat. It's about the cruel and irresponsible meat industry.

And I have little problem with the Peruvian families who eat the guinea pigs they raise in pens in their little backyards. (Even though I love quinea pigs and cringe at the thought.)

[revrenhex]

Can a mod re-subject a thread?

[amcarrig]

Run off from commercial vegetable farms also contribute to the destruction of coral reefs but I'm sure that you knew this already?

It all comes down to this. Every single human being consumes and expels. Consumption and expulsion will always lead to the destruction of something or other so either learn to deal with it or starve to death.

[thrlride]

Originally posted by revrenhex
Can a mod re-subject a thread?

LOL, yeah.


So, you are against eating meat because what the meat industry does to the environment? What about all the fertilizer runoff in Florida from the agriculture there ruining the reefs?

[thrlride]

You beat me to it amcarrig.

[amcarrig]

Originally posted by thrlride
You beat me to it amcarrig.

Sorry

[Hoggn]

Since you stated that it isn't the meat you have a problem with it's the industry you have the problem with. Couldn't you say the same for the produce industry as well? If that is the case then you should just take the noble way out and fall on your sword.

[GettingFiesty]

I have written and rewritten this post so many times that my head is spinning, but I am still confused.

I guess because I grew up where we were more concerned about the damage farmers were doing to the salmon in our rivers and our Great Lakes, that I haven't connected eating salmon with the destruction of the reefs.

Are you only boycotting meat/fish/poultry because of the reefs?

[sihaya]

Originally posted by amcarrig
Run off from commercial vegetable farms also contribute to the destruction of coral reefs but I'm sure that you knew this already?

It all comes down to this. Every single human being consumes and expels. Consumption and expulsion will always lead to the destruction of something or other so either learn to deal with it or starve to death.

I understand all that... but I try to choose the lesser of two evils... and certainly agriculture is the lesser.

And FYI, I do try to buy organic products that don't use these chemicals. It's not always practical or even possible.... but I do my best. And that's all anyone can do.

[sihaya]

Originally posted by GettingFiesty


Are you only boycotting meat/fish/poultry because of the reefs?

No... also because of the ozone and the forrests and the praries and the rivers and all that...

[Hoggn]

Originally posted by sihaya
No... also because of the ozone and the forrests and the praries and the rivers and all that...

How do you live your life? Almost seems that since life on Earth is so bad that maybe it would be better to move on...

[sihaya]

Originally posted by kgallich
Since you stated that it isn't the meat you have a problem with it's the industry you have the problem with. Couldn't you say the same for the produce industry as well? If that is the case then you should just take the noble way out and fall on your sword.

Here's the thing... yes, agriculture has its evils. But for the same amount of environmental destruction caused for one lb of produce, you only get 1/10 lb of meat. It's a matter of degree here.

And I am a big fan of organic produce... it tastes better anyway. But I know a lot of people can't afford that, so it's not as big an issue with me. However, people just don't need to eat even 1/10 the meat they do.

[RicksReefs]

this is the runoff from big sugar and citrus, i live 5 miles from this.



here's a day when they didn't back pump their fertilizers and pesticides into the drinking water supply of lake okeechobee.



enjoy that OJ for me, will you?

[sihaya]

Originally posted by kgallich
How do you live your life? Almost seems that since life on Earth is so bad that maybe it would be better to move on...

Now that just hurts... there's no need to suggest I "move on." Don't you think that's going a little far?


Regarding agriculture run-off, see above post...


Now, if you'll excuse me, I'm going to go back to playing with my talking Ann Coulter action figure before someone else subtly suggests I commit suicide.

[GettingFiesty]

Rick, I totally understand. I have seen what has gone into the Great Lakes from farming. Very sad.

[RicksReefs]

what gets me is because they're a big part of floridas economy,
they're allowed to take all the water they want (even during
drought), add fertilizer and pesticides to it, use it, collect it, then
pump it back into lake okeechobee, which supplies drinking water
to south florida. money talks and it's saying 'screw the environment
and peoples health'.