Angels For PE Control

cham · #1 09/22/2007, 02:16 PM

Looking at some recent TOTM's and other sucessful SPS tanks I have noticed something.

It seems most of the pictures show limited PE. I've seen a number of nice tanks with Angels in them and wondered if this was done for polyp control.

My tank has great PE, in fact so much it takes allot away from the beautiful colors of the base tissue. I just started kicking around the idea of putting a small angel in my reef and wanted to bounce it off this forum before I do anything like that. Most likely I would like to add a flame angel to try and limit a polyp rampage that some of the larger angels are capable of.

In a majority of my corals, there is little or no color brought to the table from the polyps and less PE would make my tank overall more colorful.

Are there trade offs in color or growth patterns?

Goodwood · #2 09/22/2007, 02:27 PM

You are very right less PE more color, on millis you will really see a difference.

Freed · #3 09/22/2007, 02:34 PM

I wouldn't think anyone would want to risk the health/life of their coral for more color if the coral might die because of the constant picking from the fish.

cham · #4 09/22/2007, 02:40 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Freed
I wouldn't think anyone would want to risk the health/life of their coral for more color if the coral might die because of the constant picking from the fish.

Interesting. I had no idea the corals would die from picking by fish. I always thought it was more of an annoyance to them, like redbugs or something. I certianly wouldn't put color ahead of the corals life.

I was thinking more along the lines of a flame angel. Not really known as much for "contstant picking" as they are more known for occasional picking.

MammothReefer · #5 09/22/2007, 02:50 PM

i've lost colonies to angles before. I had a regal angle that ate a number of SPS

Freed · #6 09/22/2007, 02:54 PM

Yes, if an angel gets a taste for a particular colony, or several for that matter, it just may eat the polyps until the coral can't handle it any more. It's not just nipping at the polyps to keep them closed it's eating the entire polyp. That's some angel's main food source in the wild.

cham · #7 09/22/2007, 03:00 PM

Wow.

I had no idea.

Has anyone had experience with a flame angel doing this? I always thought these guys were a little more "reef safe" (lol, no angel is totally reef safe) than the large angels.

This is why I ask questions before I move on something like this.

Freed · #8 09/22/2007, 03:10 PM

I have watched mine pester the hell out of my mega cup coral but not eat the polyps. I have seen him eat a few acro polyps here and there but I keep him fed and he doesn't seem to bother the corals much in the last couple years. Larger angels eat coral polyps as a staple food source.

bosborn1 · #9 09/22/2007, 03:12 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Freed
I wouldn't think anyone would want to risk the health/life of their coral for more color if the coral might die because of the constant picking from the fish.

This is quite subjective. Not all Angels are stony eater. Infact most aren't. The fish will pick and nibble as they are grazers. Much like tangs. There are some angels that you should outright avoid but some of the large Pomacanthuras sp are harmless. They will pick time to time but not destroy entire colonys. I've had Imperators over the years and have only really observed eating of soft corals and LPS.

I would say that if your system is large enough try a Imperator. If not you might want to try a heathly Centropyge potteri. They seem to not have a "taste" for sps.

This is just from my experiance. Like I said its highly subjective.

Scott

jay24k · #10 09/22/2007, 03:13 PM

Also, I know people touch the coral before the picture to show the actual color of the coral. Alot of tricks people do to get the color to show.

cham · #11 09/22/2007, 03:24 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by jay24k
Also, I know people touch the coral before the picture to show the actual color of the coral. Alot of tricks people do to get the color to show.

Yeah, I've heard of people blasting the polyps with turkey basters to do this. BTW my tri-color & tort are doing great.

So I've still got some thinking to do. The whole idea came about since I've been really wanting a flame angel for quite awhile. I know there was some risk of nipping involved and that has always made me steer clear of them since I was afraid of losing PE. As the months have passed I've started to think "well, if by chance the flame started nipping and I lost some PE during the day, that really wouldn't be all that bad. ".

Thats basically the whole idea. Just wanted to see what others thought about any health effects and if anyone was acutaly doing this on purpose for PE control.

kev apsley · #12 09/22/2007, 03:44 PM

all I know is that I have a shaggy millie that won't color because of the shaggy carpet it puts out

kev apsley · #13 09/22/2007, 03:45 PM

all I know is that I have a millie that won't color up because of the shaggy carpet it puts out

Goodwood · #14 09/22/2007, 05:16 PM

Good luck if you do try, I have tried around 12 angels.

Most will nip eventually or at a specific coral from time to time.

dukes707 · #15 09/23/2007, 07:25 AM

i dont know... i had a lemon peel angel that was a model citizen in my 40g. now in my 90g i have a potters angel. he nips everyonce in a while but nothing major. he's been in there all year and nothing has died due to him. now much PE during the day cause of him and my damsel, but hey cant win 'em all i guess. long story short, you can keep angels in sps tanks, but its really the luck of the draw when it comes to nippers. HTH

RichK · #16 09/23/2007, 07:41 AM

Angels and SPS are always a crapshoot. You never know what the fish will do until it is in the tank. I have a Regal angel in my 125 and it doesn't pick on a thing. The only thing it ate was all my xenia. That, BTW, made me really happy because the xenia would smother every thing.

I wouldn't add an angel to "control" PE because eventually it will affect the health of the coral. IMO, get used to the PE.

Rogger Castells · #17 09/23/2007, 03:12 PM

I like butterflies for PE control, I just placed a Black Back BF and she went to work right away, I will let you guys if this theory is true in a few weeks.

bureau13 · #18 09/23/2007, 05:58 PM

This is interesting, I don't think I've ever heard of people trying for LESS polyp extension. I actually get pretty poor polyp extension, and I've been wondering why. I don't see any fish picking at SPS, but I do have a Blue face, Regal, Flame and Coral Beauty. Again, none of them have been observed actively picking at the SPS (the Blue face is a Zoanthid-vore) but much like tangs they're always grazing around for something. Maybe I'll just start telling people I've done that on purpose!

jds

Rogger Castells · #19 09/23/2007, 11:09 PM

Good idea

Serioussnaps · #20 09/24/2007, 12:23 PM

This is insanse! Ever heard of a turkey baster?

bureau13 · #21 09/24/2007, 02:56 PM

My Blue face is WAY more attractive than your turkey baster!

AudioAdict · #22 09/24/2007, 03:17 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by bureau13
My Blue face is WAY more attractive than your turkey baster!

^^ i agree. I want to add a Venustus angel to my tank.

Rogger Castells · #23 09/24/2007, 03:24 PM

I know someone locally that is selling a venustus angel. They are nice looking fish.

stony_corals · #24 09/24/2007, 03:31 PM

There are many reasons why corals exhibit PE, they are biological the thought of trying to artificially prevent this is bizarre and could put significant stress on the coral that could then result in rapid shutdown, death.

Serioussnaps · #25 09/24/2007, 03:33 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by bureau13
My Blue face is WAY more attractive than your turkey baster!

And my millies more than yours

All joking aside when I do my upgrade post Christmas early spring I will be adding a pair of Regal angels