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  #1  
Old 11/22/2007, 02:00 PM
FishGrrl FishGrrl is offline
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Availability of H. comes?

I just saw on ORA's site they're now working with Hippocampus comes. Anyone know how easy they are to get ahold of (or difficult)? They've always been my favorite species, but I tried keeping WC tigertails and had miserable luck. A quick google search didn't reveal any vendors with them though. And more importantly, if anyone has any, please share your experiences with them!
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  #2  
Old 11/22/2007, 03:10 PM
KUDA KUDA is offline
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http://cgi.ebay.com/LIVE-SW-Fish-Sea...QQcmdZViewItem

I've been watching these on eBay for the past few weeks. They are a decent price too.
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  #3  
Old 11/22/2007, 06:25 PM
FishGrrl FishGrrl is offline
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Oooh. I wasn't expecting to find any so soon. I don't have a tank set up for them yet. I want them so bad, too. I was going to wait until I replace the floor where I wanted to set them up, but that's still a few months away. . . I wonder where else I could put them . . .
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  #4  
Old 11/23/2007, 02:00 PM
agibler agibler is offline
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*

Last edited by agibler; 11/23/2007 at 02:16 PM.
  #5  
Old 11/23/2007, 02:17 PM
ann83 ann83 is offline
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Randoma (the ebay seller) has them on a fairly regular basis since they breed them. There is no hurry to find a place to put them, they'll have more available at a later date and you can send a message if you are worried about it.
  #6  
Old 11/23/2007, 09:41 PM
randoma randoma is offline
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I'm randoma.

Feel free to email or PM me with any questions...
  #7  
Old 11/23/2007, 11:53 PM
LisaD LisaD is offline
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I'm hearing good things about Randoma's comes, and am planning to order a few myself in a few months. I realize this is a second hand endorsement, but several people I know well are happy about their purchases...

(P.S. Hi Tami!! )
  #8  
Old 11/23/2007, 11:59 PM
jg2269jg jg2269jg is offline
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do you have any sexed i am looking for a nice pair of horses for my seagrass tank i live in philly and am looking for the horses in like a week or 2
  #9  
Old 11/24/2007, 06:21 AM
seacraze seacraze is offline
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I am planning on purchasing some of Randomas H. Comes and have contacted a few of his past customers. I have heard all positive feedback - hope this helps.
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  #10  
Old 11/25/2007, 12:24 PM
FishGrrl FishGrrl is offline
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Hi Lisa! I thought of you when I saw there were cb comes available. You know my obsession with them. I'm supposed to be getting rid of aquariums, not setting up more!
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  #11  
Old 11/25/2007, 01:59 PM
randoma randoma is offline
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Just a few comments that I've been answering via PM/email:

My personal experience with H. comes, and this corresponds with what I've heard from others with them - they appear to be happiest at ~76-78F. I wouldn't keep them at temps >78F (at least not for long term) as I do believe that vibrio and other bacterial/viral infections are more deadly at higher temperatures. They do fine at lower temps (I've kept them as low as 68F for short periods) but they become quite sluggish at temps lower than 75F.

In general, captive bred seahorses are more social than wild caught. Most captive bred seahorses are raised in fairly close quarters whereas wild caught seahorses are generally more solitary/territorial. I can't remember the exact figures, but I believe that in the wild, each pair of seahorses will have a territory of multiple square meters. In comparison, captive bred, tank raised (I don't know about net pen raised as I have no direct experience) seahorses are kept at much higher stocking densities.

I keep small juveniles at roughly 4-6/gallon, large juveniles at 3-5/gallon, sub-adults at 2-4/gallon and young adults at 1-2/gallon. My adult stocking levels are also higher (roughly 1-2 gallons/'horse) than most people recommend, mostly because I've found that even when put in a quite large tank, with some exceptions, the captive bred 'horses tend to congregate together.

Additionally, groups of 'horses seem to eat better - I find that solitary, or isolated pairs of 'horses do not have the same hunting behavior as groups of 'horses. I think that there's a certain amount of competition instinct. I've never had any wild caught 'horses, so I don't know if this is something that is more prevalent with captive bred.

I, personally, have not had very good luck training H. comes to use a feeding dish. However, a number of people that have bought them from me have reported good success. On the other hand, I don't have any tanks with less than 12 'horses in them, which makes it difficult to get each and every one to come to the feeding dish..

Theoretically, I feed the juveniles 3-4x/day, sub-adults 2-3x/day and adults 1x/day. In practice, the adults get fed at least 2x/day because when they see me feeding everyone else, they line up and beg.....

I feed exclusively Hikari frozen mysis, I enrich 1 feeding, every other day, with Naturose, Vitamin C and Beta Glucane.

Lastly, I've found that the H. comes prefer higher flow than my H. reidi. I generally try for 30x tank volume in flow. It is *very* important the the flow is not chaotic and that there are areas of lower flow for them to rest in.
  #12  
Old 11/25/2007, 09:28 PM
FishGrrl FishGrrl is offline
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Thanks for the information. Very interesting! Would you recommend that stocking density for the average aquarist? I would think it's a little high and most people would have trouble keeping the water quality in check. I'm interested to hear your thoughts on the matter before I take the plunge.
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  #13  
Old 11/25/2007, 09:31 PM
pledosophy pledosophy is offline
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Nice post Randoma.
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  #14  
Old 11/25/2007, 11:02 PM
randoma randoma is offline
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Quote:
Originally posted by FishGrrl
Thanks for the information. Very interesting! Would you recommend that stocking density for the average aquarist? I would think it's a little high and most people would have trouble keeping the water quality in check. I'm interested to hear your thoughts on the matter before I take the plunge.
I think it would really depend on your setup... I generally run an RDSB, with charcoal and floss in a sump on most of our tanks. I used to use bioballs(!) in the sump(s), (not in a wet/dry config, but just floating, for surface area) but I've been converting over to Marco Rock rubble as I've found that the rubble is more efficient than the bio balls and I still don't mind bleaching it if necessary.

Our three growout tanks have a total water volume of ~85 gallons (60 gallons for the tank, 25 gallons for the sump), ~100lbs of Home Depot play sand in the sump (~14" deep RDSB), ~20lbs of Marco Rock Rubble and/or 2-3 gallons of bio balls. Once the RDSB is cycled (takes 6-8 weeks before it has a noticeable effect), a daily siphoning of detritus from the bottom (roughly 2-4 gallons/day) keeps the nitrates <20. I suspect that adding a skimmer would help a lot also.

We also have a 29 gallon mixed reef that used to have an attached sump/RDSB, which used to have no problem with 12 young adult H. comes and assorted tankmates. It used to get a 25% water change once a month - I'm in the process of renovating the fish room and had to take the RDSB and skimmer off-line. Since then, it requires 2 25% water changes/week to keep the nitrates in check.

That said, without a harvestable refugium, DSB, remote DSB, or some form of denitrator, I would expect to have nitrate problems even with moderate-to-low stocking levels. So, if you have an adequate setup, I think you should be able to handle a reasonable bioload - maybe 1 'horse per 2-3 gallons. If you do not have an adequate setup, you'll have problems even with a really light bioload.

Keep in mind, H. comes are smaller, both in length and girth, than most of the more common 'horses (H. erectus, H. reidi). A full grown H. comes is going to be about 75% or slightly less, of the body mass of an H. erectus or H. reidi.

Pete Giwojna lists H. comes as a "medium" size 'horse, compared to "large" for H. erectus or H. reidi. His recommended stocking level for a medium size 'horse, in a 25 gallon "tall" tank is 6-10 (captive bred/tank raised), which works out to 2.5-4 gallons/horse. 14-18 for a 55 gallon tank, which is 3-4 gallons/horse.

*However* I would not go with anything smaller than a 15 gallon tall for any number of 'horses! In my opinion a 25 gallon tall tank (24x12x24) is the smallest 'reasonable' sized tank, and with a 10-15 gallon sump with refugium or RDSB, would be perfectly satisfactory for 6-12 'horses.

In general, I would look for tanks that are a minimum of 21-24" tall - 25 gallon tall, 45 gallon (36x12x24), 65 gallon (36x18x24), 90 gallon (48x18x24) are reasonable seahorse dimensions. Hex tanks are available in tall sizes, but my understanding is that getting decent flow in them is hard - I've never had a hex myself.

Keep in mind that ALL of this (except for Pete's advice) is my opinion and there are probably quite a few 'horse owners that would completely disagree with me.

----------

Now, the next thing I'm going to say, I should probably never admit in public, nor should this be considered a recommendation or endorsement! My personal H. comes (13 adults, ranging in length from 12cm to 14cm, a neon goby and 4-5 peppermint shrimp) have been in a 15 gallon tall tank w/5 gallon sump for almost 3 months now. It was supposed to be temporary, but for various reasons I just haven't had time to finish their ultimate home.

The 5 gallon sump has a refugium and approximately 4-5" deep sand bed, there's about 10lbs of live rock in the sump, the display is barebottom and mostly empty except for hitches.. With a 25% water change every 2 weeks, nitrates stay below ~30. I do have filter floss on the output from the return, but do not usually run carbon. However, the sump has been on-line for about 6-7 months and works very efficiently as a denitrator. I haven't been able to ask them (well, I have asked them, but they haven't answered ) if they feel overly crowded, but they are very active and appear quite happy... They also all tend to congregate at the front of the tank (they usually only use the front third of the tank). At least they do when anyone is watching. With any luck they will be moving to a 45 or 65 shortly and ultimately a 165.

The only reason why I mention this is, I don't think 'ability' is important so much as having things setup properly..
  #15  
Old 11/25/2007, 11:28 PM
randoma randoma is offline
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Oh.. One other thing I should mention about H. comes - *theoretically* they're more reef safe than other species, except for H. barbouri. All non-dwarf seahorses should be okay with most SPS and softies, most seahorses are not okay with most LPS. It is possible, but I'm afraid to test this in practice, that H. comes are okay with a wider range of LPS.

However, seahorses should never be kept with anemones, clams or aggressive fish (such as tangs or any clownfish other than true/false percs). I do have some 'horses with a Kole Tang and they've been working out well, but Kole Tangs are extremely shy.. And the one we have is probably shy for a Kole Tang...

Pete Giwojna has an excellent list of seahorse compatible corals here:

Seahorse Compatibility

(Taken from "A Seahorse Reef, Part 1: Reef Compatibility of Hippocampus spp." by Pete Giwojna, originally published in Tropical Fish Magazine.

In theory, H. comes may be compatible with table 2 corals, but NOT table 3.

From the second part of the article, here's a list of seahorse compatible fish:

Anthias (assorted Mirolabrichthys, Pseudanthias, and Anthias sp.)
Firefish Goby (Nemateleotris magnifica)
Purple Firefish Goby (Nemateleotris decora)
Gobies (assorted small species)
Neon Goby (Gobiosoma oceanops)
Assessors (Assessor spp.)
Midas Blenny (Ecsenius midas)
High Hats (Equetus acuminatus)
Marine Betta (Calloplesiops altivelis)
Banggai or Banner cardinals (Pterapogon kauderni)
Flame cardinals (Apogon pseudomaculatus)
Pajama cardinals (Apogon nematoptera)
Pipefishes (assorted small species)
Percula clownfish (Amphiprion percula)
False percula clownfish (Amphiprion ocellaris)
Royal Grammas (Gramma loreto)
Blackcap Basslets (Gramma melacara)
Green Chromis (Chromis viridis)
Longnose Hawkfish (Oxycirrhites typus)
Six Line Wrasse (Psuedocheilinus hexataenia)
Flasher Wrasse (Paracheilinus spp.)
Fairy Wrasse (Cirrhilabrus spp.)
Scooter Blennies (Synchiropus spp.)
Green Mandarin Goby or Dragonet (Pterosynchiropus splendidus)
Psychedelic Mandarin Goby or Dragonet (Pterosynchiropus picturatus)
Orchid Dottyback (Pseudochromis fridmani) – avoid other Pseudochromis
species!

Good inverts for seahorses include decorative cleaner shrimp like those
listed below:

Peppermint Shrimp (Lysmata wurdemanni)
Scarlet Cleaner Shrimp or Skunk Cleaner Shrimp (Lysmata amboinensis)
Fire Shrimp (Lysmata debelius)
and/or
large ornamental snails (living sea shells) such as the following:
Tiger Cowry (Cypraea tigris)
Deer Cowry (Cypraea cervus)
and/or
Assorted Feather Dusters (Sabellastatre magnifica, Sabella sp.) whose
colorful crowns resemble gaily-colored parasols.
  #16  
Old 11/26/2007, 12:18 AM
FishGrrl FishGrrl is offline
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Wow, that's a lot of information. Thanks for the run down. I was kind of thinking a 25 gallon aquarium and your experence makes it sound entirely doable. I actually have a 15 high I was sort of vaguely considering using, but I don't like how cramped the space under the tank is, since I prefer running a sump. I had a 2.5 gallon sump under there once upon a time ago, and it was impossible to work on. And I have small hands!

If I can pick your brain a little more . . . how long do these guys take to reach maturity? Are the fry pelagic? And can they be raised on bbs, or do you need to start with something smaller like rotifers or copepods?

As an aside, how do you like the RDSB? I read about the idea some months ago, and while I've meant to try it, I haven't had the time to set anything up.
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  #17  
Old 11/26/2007, 11:57 AM
randoma randoma is offline
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I'm not sure what the size of a tank has to do with the amount of room underneath it... However, if it was an option, I'd definitely go with the 25 over the 15. The 15 high is kind of an annoying size to work with. (In my opinion).

H. comes fry are pelagic/demersal (do not hitch at birth) and are similar to H. reidi in care. You'll probably need rotifers/copepods for the first 3-7 days.

I think RDSB's are great. I especially like that having a shallow sandbed in the display makes moving tanks around much easier. However, they do take a while to have a noticeable effect. I've never added one to an existing tank, so I don't know how long it would take for one to have an effect there, but when started with the initial cycle, it has been my experience that it takes at least 6-8 weeks before there's any noticeable effect and 3-4 months before I'd say that an RDSB is really effective. I've never tried to seed one from an existing RDSB, however I plan to try doing so soon.
  #18  
Old 12/03/2007, 06:59 PM
jg2269jg jg2269jg is offline
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Hey randoma are you going to have the yellow reidi again on ebay i saw them yesterday and went to talk my girlfriend into them today and they were gone my lose completely haha
  #19  
Old 12/03/2007, 07:14 PM
randoma randoma is offline
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Yes, I'll have more in 3-4 weeks, possible sooner.
  #20  
Old 12/03/2007, 10:07 PM
jg2269jg jg2269jg is offline
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nice
  #21  
Old 12/10/2007, 10:36 PM
Chibils Chibils is offline
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I'm glad this thread came up - I've never heard of, nor seen, Hippocampus comes. Beautiful seahorses, only rivaled by H. barbouri, and they stay relatively small for 'horses.

When I set up my seahorse tank (some years in the future ), I think I'll have H. comes.
 

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