berlin red sea skimmer - worthless?

[WarrenAmy&Maddy]

when i first got started i was 'told' the red sea was a good skimmer so of course i purchased one.

after learning so much more - i realize that this was by far not the ideal skimmer to have.

does anyone have comments about using this skimmer?
good bad ugly

are there upgrades to make it better? even converting it in some way to a better DIY type skimmer. - any personal examples of someone doing this?


it seems like it works for awhile
like a day or 2 then needs to be retweaked - SOMETIMES it seems like it might actually be working really well - for a little while atleast

w/ the exception of having high phosphates
my water quality has been good zero nitrates etc - but i think this is due to other positive 'conditions' in my system LR, dsb, fuge, ETC

[dsn112]

Well, im not sure how large your tank is and if your talking about a HOB skimmer, but I can tell you that the Prizm skimmer from the same Company is pathetic.

I recently ordered the Aqua C Remora for my size tank.

After all the reviews here about how amazing it is, I was almost sold. I called my LFS to see if they had it and they guy said that they did not carry it, but that I should definately buy it. I thought that said it all!!

[capn_hylinur]

If you are talking about this model it does a great job

[WarrenAmy&Maddy]

Originally posted by capn_hylinur
If you are talking about this model it does a great job

Capn
believe i have that same one - have you compared it to anything else?

do you have to tweak it constantly to get it to pull anything out?

btw what is that air tube coming off the lft side of the skimmer in that pic ?

[waif]

It is where his skimmate drains.

[t-bone2]

i like mine

[reefshadow]

I think they CAN be great skimmers, but after running one for years I have found that they do best with the right pump. You will get much better performance running ALOT of flow through it, much more than recommended. I was running mine with a mag 7 but recently stepped up to a 9.5 (950gph). I have had to drill and plumb the collection cup to a 5 gallon bucket and it skims out about a gallon of dark, nasty, stinky skimmate a week. I also drilled out the venturi cone to allow a higher velocity flow past the venturi. Just a tiny bit; drill too much and you'll make the skimmer worse. Not a mod that is really needed, but increased my berlins performance just that little extra bit.

In short, IME it is a crappy skimmer unless overdriven by a large pump.

[WarrenAmy&Maddy]

Originally posted by reefshadow
I think they CAN be great skimmers, but after running one for years I have found that they do best with the right pump. You will get much better performance running ALOT of flow through it, much more than recommended. I was running mine with a mag 7 but recently stepped up to a 9.5 (950gph). I have had to drill and plumb the collection cup to a 5 gallon bucket and it skims out about a gallon of dark, nasty, stinky skimmate a week. I also drilled out the venturi cone to allow a higher velocity flow past the venturi. Just a tiny bit; drill too much and you'll make the skimmer worse. Not a mod that is really needed, but increased my berlins performance just that little extra bit.

In short, IME it is a crappy skimmer unless overdriven by a large pump.

thanx!
that was the kind of info i was looking for... some things to think about doing until i can get a better skimmer!

how did you drill/plumb the collection cup?
and i am not following you on 'drilling out the venturi cone' ??? - would you mind explaining this a little bit further!

hey thanks again - i am atleast glad to find out some additional things to incr the output of this skimmer!

[reefkrazy]

i run mine with a mag 9.5 with a ball valve to hold it back just enough so it doesn't overflow into the collection cup. I think it works fine for a $200 skimmer.

[reefshadow]

I used a 1/2 inch hole saw drill bit to drill the collection cup on the side, NOT sure if this is generally recommended for acrylic, but it worked for me. You may want to check out the DIY forum and see if there are better options out there for drilling. I have 2 of these skimmers so I figured if I screwed it up, oh well. Then I stuck a piece of 1/2 inch vinyl tubing in there, sealed around it with silicone, and cut it to the right length to go to my collection bucket. Let it dry overnight.

The venturi cone is located at the bottom of the skimmer where the water feeds in (but not in the skimmer body itself). If you take the skimmer down, empty it, detach the pump, and then twist off the PVC where it goes into the body you will see it. It is a cone shaped piece inside that narrows to a tiny hole. Sometimes this hole can become blocked by a piece of dead coral, a shell fragment, ect... and can severely hamper performance, so even taking it apart and cleaning it out can be a huge help. Filling the whole skimmer with vinegar and then soaking overnight and rinsing can really help melt away all the calcium deposits and stuff, helping performance. IMPORTANT- when you thread the piece of acrylic that goes to the pump back on to put the skimmer back together, ONLY do it enough turns so that you have it back to the factory tightness. Tightening it more WILL crack the piece in the body that it threads into. Been there.

Really I think your best option for now if you want to keep this skimmer is going to be a much higher rated pump and then drilling the collection cup because it will fill much faster. Drilling the venturi cone can be a hit or miss thing that can ruin the skimmer if you aren't very careful, worked for me though. The benefit of the higher GPH pump is that it vastly increases the volume of water flowing past the venturi opening, sucking more air in and therefore increasing the amount of bubbles in the chamber by far. I can't actually run the venturi wide open (the plastic adjustment screw)- the skimmer will overflow and fill up my 5 gallon bucket within an hour! It used to be that I would have to run it wide open and still didn't get much skimmate.

I think I have also heard of people using an air stone inside the chamber to increase the amount of bubbles, but I never tried that, just seems like a PITA to me.

The only thing about the mag drive pumps is that they do produce alot of heat. If this is a smaller reef or if heat is a big problem for you, you may want to look into a different pump.

Good luck!

[WarrenAmy&Maddy]

reefshadow

great thanks for your time in providing this info!


where do you drill the collection hole for the tubing?
iow just somewhere on the side near bottom?... i assume then its just gravity fed into a bucket and doesnt the airline tubing get clogged/gupped up in no time ?

i will have to try getting a bigger pump and see if that doesnt improve the performance.

regards

[reefshadow]

Yeah, mine's about 1/3rd of the way up. If you use 1/2 inch tubing it won't get clogged for a long, long time (if ever). I guess after a couple of years you could yank it off and replace it.

[WarrenAmy&Maddy]

Originally posted by reefshadow
Yeah, mine's about 1/3rd of the way up. If you use 1/2 inch tubing it won't get clogged for a long, long time (if ever). I guess after a couple of years you could yank it off and replace it.

Reefshadow
thank you for the info! - i have a mag 9 sitting around here that i use for water changes thus able to do the 'modification' w/o costing me any money - i am going to use the instructions you provided to see if i cant improve this skimmer!

regards

[capn_hylinur]

great tips on the pumps etc guys.

I have found that the pump has to be constantly cleaned because the venturi picks up debris easily and gets clogged.
It could be due to the fact that the live rock leaves detrius in the sump though?

As far as overclocking these--it has to be tempered with your filtration system
i.e I have a big refugium that's primary function is to introduce a greater variety of bacteria and inverts back into the main tank. an overclocked skimmer would be detrimental in this case

[WarrenAmy&Maddy]

Originally posted by capn_hylinur
great tips on the pumps etc guys.

I have found that the pump has to be constantly cleaned because the venturi picks up debris easily and gets clogged.
It could be due to the fact that the live rock leaves detrius in the sump though?

As far as overclocking these--it has to be tempered with your filtration system
i.e I have a big refugium that's primary function is to introduce a greater variety of bacteria and inverts back into the main tank. an overclocked skimmer would be detrimental in this case

Cap'n
i noticed in your system you have

fuge - skimmer - return

some people do it differently perhaps for some of the reasons you mentioned

skimmer - fuge - return

then it wouldnt be a concern


i have a 2 stage sump (2 separate sumps)
w/ an attached 50gal display fuge inbetween... the phosp reactor sits in stage 2(return) and empties back into stage 1 (skimmer stage) thus recycling this water...

all the water goes from stage 1
thru 50gal fuge then into stage 2 back to tank - there is an 'overflow' created in stage 1 in the case that the pump into fuge either stops or clogged etc then stage 1 automatically overflows into stage 2 thus eliminating any 'flood' possibility...

i recall reading one time something about your posting re xenia

i keep a small colony in the main display
- then pull off the weeds and dump it in the fuge thus creating a nice xenia forest w/ n the fuge which doesnt look bad and ibelieve contributes significantly to my ZERO nitrates in the tank (not to mention 10bucks per at LFS)... my chaeto hardly grows at all and in fact will even go so far as to say the xenia outgrows the chaeto in my tank - as have only once in 4 mos had to 'trim' the chaeto since putting it in and it wasnt much even then!

[WarrenAmy&Maddy]

.

[capn_hylinur]

Originally posted by WarrenAmy&Maddy
Cap'n
i noticed in your system you have

fuge - skimmer - return

some people do it differently perhaps for some of the reasons you mentioned

skimmer - fuge - return

then it wouldnt be a concern


i have a 2 stage sump (2 separate sumps)
w/ an attached 50gal display fuge inbetween... the phosp reactor sits in stage 2(return) and empties back into stage 1 (skimmer stage) thus recycling this water...

all the water goes from stage 1
thru 50gal fuge then into stage 2 back to tank - there is an 'overflow' created in stage 1 in the case that the pump into fuge either stops or clogged etc then stage 1 automatically overflows into stage 2 thus eliminating any 'flood' possibility...

i recall reading one time something about your posting re xenia

i keep a small colony in the main display
- then pull off the weeds and dump it in the fuge thus creating a nice xenia forest w/ n the fuge which doesnt look bad and ibelieve contributes significantly to my ZERO nitrates in the tank (not to mention 10bucks per at LFS)... my chaeto hardly grows at all and in fact will even go so far as to say the xenia outgrows the chaeto in my tank - as have only once in 4 mos had to 'trim' the chaeto since putting it in and it wasnt much even then!

very interesting--can you post a few pics.

Actually I am in the process of adding another refugium--mud and mangroves.
The water would go there first then sump and return.
The other existing refugium would be separate like it is now--suppling the bacteria and inverts to the tank.

[WarrenAmy&Maddy]

Originally posted by capn_hylinur
very interesting--can you post a few pics.

Actually I am in the process of adding another refugium--mud and mangroves.
The water would go there first then sump and return.
The other existing refugium would be separate like it is now--suppling the bacteria and inverts to the tank.

sounds like an interesting project and a nice benefit to your system.

i only have a pic of the fuge w/ some xenia in it -
when it was first set up - it has a forest of xenia in it now... plus the addition of pin cushion urchin (from another tank), green dragonet (from fellow reefers tank where it wasnt getting enough food) and most recently a green brittle star from the main 125 display - (wasnt sure if he was eating my peppermints or not so he now has a new home in the fuge)...

i need to get some photos of the guts of the tank -fuge/sump etc - i will try to later and post them.

[cwschoon]

I have a 60 gal pred tank w. a volitan, dogface puffer, clown and 2 damsels. I have a Prizm delux but am not overly pleased-bubbles and noisy. I have had it for a while and it does do the job but am considering an upgrade. I do need a hang on....That Pet Place is having a sale and I can get a Berlin hang on -23"-w. pump for $ 160.00. Any opinions?? When I was in sales in this industry, I used to be of the opinion that Berlin's were overpriced for their performance. If not the Berlin, any opinions would be greatly appreciated.
Thanks,
Craig.

[capn_hylinur]

Originally posted by WarrenAmy&Maddy
reefshadow

great thanks for your time in providing this info!


where do you drill the collection hole for the tubing?
iow just somewhere on the side near bottom?... i assume then its just gravity fed into a bucket and doesnt the airline tubing get clogged/gupped up in no time ?

i will have to try getting a bigger pump and see if that doesnt improve the performance.

regards

update info from recent exeperience:
my air column was shutting down quite often. When I took the plastic outer air venturi cover off I discovered that it was plugged solid. Recent posts confirmed that it was salt build up --being sucked in from the salty air around the sump area.
I literally had to take a nail and hammer to it to get the hole reemed out.

Also make sure you get the turbo pump for this unit---makes all the difference in the amt of air bubbles in the air column and the effeciency of this skimmer.

[capn_hylinur]

Originally posted by cwschoon
I have a 60 gal pred tank w. a volitan, dogface puffer, clown and 2 damsels. I have a Prizm delux but am not overly pleased-bubbles and noisy. I have had it for a while and it does do the job but am considering an upgrade. I do need a hang on....That Pet Place is having a sale and I can get a Berlin hang on -23"-w. pump for $ 160.00. Any opinions?? When I was in sales in this industry, I used to be of the opinion that Berlin's were overpriced for their performance. If not the Berlin, any opinions would be greatly appreciated.
Thanks,
Craig.

Hey Craig--have you learned windows copy paste feature
this must be the third thread I have seen this post in

You know if you post 6 times you will get six different answers--can get confusing

[WarrenAmy&Maddy]

Originally posted by cwschoon
I have a 60 gal pred tank w. a volitan, dogface puffer, clown and 2 damsels. I have a Prizm delux but am not overly pleased-bubbles and noisy. I have had it for a while and it does do the job but am considering an upgrade. I do need a hang on....That Pet Place is having a sale and I can get a Berlin hang on -23"-w. pump for $ 160.00. Any opinions?? When I was in sales in this industry, I used to be of the opinion that Berlin's were overpriced for their performance. If not the Berlin, any opinions would be greatly appreciated.
Thanks,
Craig.

Craig
i purchased the one i have when first starting out
was told it was the best!!!


as a noobie never take the word of a pet store OWNER/employee
(wasnt familiar w/ RC at that time!)

i certainly wouldnt buy it again today!
there are too many other much better options out there...

so fwiw i dont know about the one you are interested in
but might recom going w/ a skimmmer that seems to have a better reputation for quality/performance!

regards

[capn_hylinur]

Originally posted by WarrenAmy&Maddy
Craig
i purchased the one i have when first starting out
was told it was the best!!!


as a noobie never take the word of a pet store OWNER/employee
(wasnt familiar w/ RC at that time!)

i certainly wouldnt buy it again today!
there are too many other much better options out there...

so fwiw i dont know about the one you are interested in
but might recom going w/ a skimmmer that seems to have a better reputation for quality/performance!

regards

I was under the impresssion that Berlin's had a decent reputation?

[reefshadow]

I have a 60 gal pred tank w. a volitan, dogface puffer, clown and 2 damsels. I have a Prizm delux but am not overly pleased-bubbles and noisy. I have had it for a while and it does do the job but am considering an upgrade. I do need a hang on....That Pet Place is having a sale and I can get a Berlin hang on -23"-w. pump for $ 160.00. Any opinions?? When I was in sales in this industry, I used to be of the opinion that Berlin's were overpriced for their performance. If not the Berlin, any opinions would be greatly appreciated.

I would not recommend this skimmer at full price, considering that for decent performance you are going to have to spend another 100 bucks on another pump. (I recommend a mag 9.5 personally). The ones that come with the Berlin will not run it efficiently. If you can find a used Berlin at around 50 bucks that would be the most I would pay. Look around a little while and you can find them super cheap.

I was under the impresssion that Berlin's had a decent reputation?

Nah. They have a very poor reputation but do well with the mods discussed above. As said, I would never pay full retail price for one, but they are rather easy to find used for cheap. People get so unhappy with them they are torn between chucking them from a third story building or selling them to you for peanuts.

[reefshadow]

Oh yeah I meant to mention to you Capn- If you occasionally take a very hot cup of water and stick the end of the venturi line into it, it will suck the water down into the venturi cone and help keep it clean.