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  #76  
Old 01/07/2008, 12:10 PM
Randy Holmes-Farley Randy Holmes-Farley is offline
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RO/DI works perfectly well, maybe even better, without softening of hard water. What does happen is that the RO membrane gets deposits on it that render it less than effective over time.

FWIW, Spectrapure says the max hardness that they recommend is 170 ppm, so yours may be fine.

http://www.spectrapure.com/SYSTEM_BREAKDOWN.htm

I do not know of a good way around that problem, aside from softening the water or using the membrane until it's output is too low.

Perhaps others have better suggestions...
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  #77  
Old 01/07/2008, 12:28 PM
garygb garygb is offline
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Thank you for your quick response. The guy at airwaterice told me that the membrane would clog in 2 or 3 months without a softener.
  #78  
Old 01/07/2008, 12:38 PM
AZDesertRat AZDesertRat is offline
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I used a RO for 14 years before adding a water softener about 18 months ago. My tap water TDS is over 800 and the hardness is in the neighborhood of 20+ grains or about 350 mg/L (ppm) (mg/L or ppm divided by 17.1 equals grains per gallon hardness). Membranes lasted 3+ years no problem. The secret is keep the waste ratio at the recommended 4:1 or slightly higher as high as 6:1. By keeping the membrane well flushed it lasts just fine. Its when people try to reduce the waste that they shorten the membranes life.
  #79  
Old 01/07/2008, 03:00 PM
garygb garygb is offline
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Thank you AZDR, I thought that hard water shouldn't have to mean I couldn't use RO/DI. If your water is 350 mg/L, then it is significantly harder than anything I should be encountering in L.A. city water. I will test the TDS when the unit gets here, as it has a TDS meter. Again thank you and Randy for your quick replies.

This RO/DI is all new to me. I've had very good luck with just plain old tap water, one of my current ritteri anemones is over over 5 years old just using dechlorinated/dechloriminated tap and mixing salt in, adjusting temp. and letting it circulate for ~24 hours. I'm "upgrading" based on the readings I've done on here and WWM that suggests that tap is somewhat unpredictable. So, that is why I'm going to give the RO/DI a try.
  #80  
Old 01/09/2008, 07:14 PM
badpacket badpacket is offline
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AZ, quick question.

I am retrofitting my older 25-50gpd RO/DI to a 75 filmtec membrane from BFS. I forgot to add a 75gpd flow regulator to the order.
I'm thinking I can still use this set-up until I get the proper restrictor.

Is this correct, or will I need to reduce the current restricter flow more to increase pressure on the membrane to get production?

Just need to make 20-30 gallons in the next week or so while waiting for the new restrictor to be delivered.
  #81  
Old 01/09/2008, 07:59 PM
AZDesertRat AZDesertRat is offline
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It'll work but you will want to get the correct size soon. You will find you will not be wasting enough with that one so the membranes life would be shortened over time due to reduced flushing action.
  #82  
Old 01/09/2008, 09:01 PM
badpacket badpacket is offline
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Thanks, I should have mentioned it is one of the fast flush models that is have a lever to produce water or flush the membrane.
Might be a good idea to stop every once in a while and have it flush itself while making water?

BTW, in looking for one came across theh20guru.zoovy.com, AKA air, water & ice. Think you mentioned them before, but they are as competitive as BFS I think.
They've got a killer 150gpd 98% rejection Filmtec at a nice price.....
Dang, they include the fast flush restrictor too... anyone want a 75gpd NIB?

Tanks alot.

Last edited by badpacket; 01/09/2008 at 09:07 PM.
  #83  
Old 01/09/2008, 09:14 PM
AZDesertRat AZDesertRat is offline
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As long as you get the correct flow retrictor soon its should not matter. I just wouldn't go too long.
The 150 GPD membranes are a sweet deal if you can get one that really delivers 150 GPD at close to 98% rejection. I have witnessed problems with them producing 98% efficiency. Spectrapure tried them recently but had trouble getting them to pass their rigid standards so dropped them. They are the only vendor who bench tests their membranes that I am aware of so others may be relying on Dow's word that they work. Most vendors will not guarantee a membranes performance so you may or may not get a good one?
  #84  
Old 01/09/2008, 09:34 PM
badpacket badpacket is offline
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Thanks for the heads up. Knew I bought that dual inline TDS meter for a reason. I'm going for it, and they say they stand behind their products.
  #85  
Old 01/09/2008, 09:39 PM
AZDesertRat AZDesertRat is offline
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Use a handheld TDS meter to confirm the inline readings. The handhelds are more accurate and give you the added portability where the inline is dedicated and depends on flow past the probe to work. The reason inlines are not as accurate is they monitor air temperature and not water temperature. The readings can be something like 2% off for every degree difference C. in the air and water temperatures. I have two dual inlines and rarely use them for that reason, they never agree with good handheld like the HM Digital COM-100.
  #86  
Old 01/09/2008, 10:34 PM
badpacket badpacket is offline
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Well, I've got a handheld Hanna Primo also.... not buying anymore.
I'll find someone with a real good one out here in al ab somewhere and do a test.
  #87  
Old 01/10/2008, 04:03 AM
ahullsb ahullsb is offline
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Quote:
Originally posted by stevelkaneval
heres my tank its a 20 long about a year old and ive never used ro/di.

[IMG][/IMG]
[IMG][/IMG]
I don't think your lens can focus from that close!
  #88  
Old 01/10/2008, 04:07 AM
ahullsb ahullsb is offline
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Quote:
Originally posted by ricks
Here are a couple of pictures of our 500 gallon reef... I use unfiltered mud puddle water, has worked great for many years.

Just kidding..

If your choice is tap water more power to you. Most hard core reefers would never trust there prized reefs to tap water..

Happy Reefing


That is an AMAZING tank! After seeing so many on here, it's rare that one really catches my eye.
  #89  
Old 01/10/2008, 02:47 PM
rcmike rcmike is offline
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I am using a well (which I drilled BTW) and having just as good a luck without the RO/DI as I did when I had it hooked up. It is nice to fill my 30 gal. water change trash can in about a minute. My TDS is 130 but most of it is probably calcium due to the limestone.

My best looking tank was on well water at my parents house. I had great sps growth.
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  #90  
Old 01/10/2008, 08:48 PM
AZDesertRat AZDesertRat is offline
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As always, there are exceptions to every rule. Tap water is not the norm though and for good reason.
  #91  
Old 01/10/2008, 09:59 PM
rcmike rcmike is offline
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Of course. I wouldn't recommend it to most people. Not all water is created equal.
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  #92  
Old 01/11/2008, 11:35 PM
demonsp demonsp is offline
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This in not doing the tap water is fine issue any good , I would reccommend RO/DO in your tank.You would see a world of differance.


Quote:
Originally posted by stevelkaneval
heres my tank its a 20 long about a year old and ive never used ro/di.

[IMG][/IMG]
[IMG][/IMG]
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