400 Watt Metal Halide Will It Burn My Sps

reef rico · #1 12/02/2007, 04:29 AM

Hey ive got a 40 gallon tank which is 18 inches tall. I was wondering if i aquire a 400 watt metal halide with a 14k bulb, will it burn and kill the sps which i want to get and if so would it be able to support a full sps reef. My tank is 40 inches long 18 inches tall and 12 inches wide.

Faisal1976us · #2 12/02/2007, 05:46 AM

For keeping SPS in 40g tank you need just 150w , i have 55g with SPS and i use 150w metal halide and Blue Actinic from Arcadia

http://www.arcadia-uk.info/product.p...10&lan=en&id=4

its wonderful

aquarius77 · #3 12/02/2007, 02:08 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Faisal1976us
For keeping SPS in 40g tank you need just 150w , i have 55g with SPS and i use 150w metal halide and Blue Actinic from Arcadia

I disagree, a single 150w bulb will not grow sps in a 40 inch tank long term with any sucess. I would go for the 400 and just raise it a bit so you get more coverage and still have light intensity.
2x250 would be ideal.

znut Reefer · #4 12/02/2007, 02:45 PM

Agree with aquarius 2 250's would be better.

power boat jim · #5 12/02/2007, 03:29 PM

Giving sps too much light is like trying to giving a fish too much water. Just acclimate the coral when you get it. start it at the bottom and move it up over a couple of weeks.

JPMagyar · #6 12/02/2007, 04:32 PM

No - it will not "burn" your SPS.
Yes - it will support a "full SPS reef"

BUT

there are a thousand items I would focus on before worrying about buying a 400 watt bulb,

AND

I agree 400 watts is overkill for an 18 inch deep tank, and 250 watts would probably be better. Here's a picture of a coral I am keeping now under a 250 watt 20k MH bulb

and here are 2 pictures of a coral I grew in 2003 under 1000 watt bulbs - not 1000 watts of lighting but honest to goodness 1000 watt bulbs. I had 3 of them on my tank at one time and the coral shown below was no more than 10 inches from dead center under a 1000 watter

Needless to say I found that to be a bit unnecessary

reef rico · #7 12/02/2007, 06:57 PM

Thanks for the help guys but ill probably go with the 400 watt because i live in australia and the 400 watt is only like 30 dollars more that the 250 watt. Since im only 15 i don't have alot of cash and thats why i would rather get the 400 watt that 2 250 watts.
Im just scared about buying the 400 watt then regreting that i got it because its just to much light intencity for a shallow tank and my dad would chuck it crazy lol (his cash). So you guys are sure that i want burn out the sps?

JPMagyar · #8 12/02/2007, 09:14 PM

You know one of my biggest regrets in life is that I didn't listen when people tried to pass their years of wisdom on to me . . . and I don't mean that to be sarcastic . . . I mean that with all sincerity.

Don't buy a 400 watt MH for a tank that is only 18 inches deep unless you are planning on upgrading to a 30 inch deep tank sometime soon. It is absolutely overkill and you will gain nothing from the purchase except more heat and a higher electric bill. Buy a 250 watt fixture with either VHO or T5 or PC supplementation. If you can't afford a fixture like that than wait until you can, or if you must have MH now then simply buy a single 250. There is nothing you won't be able to keep with a single 250 that you would be able to keep with a 400.

And for the record its not the "intensity" that would be a problem, but the heat. Even a 150 watt MH can overheat a reef tank easily if the tank is small and the airflow is weak.

The Village Curmudgeon,

Joe

reef rico · #9 12/02/2007, 10:05 PM

How about if i could get the heat under control would it be alright for the 400 watt?

ycnibrc · #10 12/02/2007, 10:17 PM

no halide can be as strong as the sun and sometime in low tide the reef is only 12'' or less and the corals still survive. The only problem you will have is the heat if you have enough fan to blow the heat away then you have no problem.

power boat jim · #11 12/02/2007, 10:22 PM

I have three 400w lights above a 18 in deep 125gal. Put a clip on fan on the tank and have it go on with the light. its good for about 3 deg F. My lights sit 9" above the tank I do not have a hood. What you will notice is more evaporation with bigger lights and fans.

If you do upgrade to a deeper tank you wont have to upgrade the ballast, thats the mistake I made. I now use my 250w on my softie tank.

reef rico · #12 12/02/2007, 11:35 PM

Thanks for the info. Ill probably get the 400 watt but would it be able to light up the left and right of the tank as well as keeping the sps thriving on the left and right.

JPMagyar · #13 12/03/2007, 07:38 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by reef rico
. . . would it be able to light up the left and right of the tank as well as keeping the sps thriving on the left and right.

No - the spread on a 400 watt bulb does not extend 40 inches.

Have you checked out Sanjay's Website ?

Here's my last try . . . this is my tank under 250.

Best of luck with whatever you choose, and don't forget to keep us posted with pictures

Joe

MJAnderson · #14 12/03/2007, 11:43 AM

I have a 20k radium 400w on a Galaxy ballast over my 40g breeder. Bottom of the reflector is 15" above the water 22" above the frag rack. On the frag rack directly under the light I'm showing par readings just over 400. On the far edges of the tank I'm showing 190-200. I find it's a great mix for a SPS/monti growing. Honestly I would find it a bit strong for a 'normal' tank unless the light were even higher. Unless you had fairly low landscaping I think the middle of the tank would still be off limits to anything but a clam/specific SPS. Par readings at the water level under the light are over 600.

SitBackAndWatch · #15 12/03/2007, 05:23 PM

Hey JPMagyar, DE or SE? if DE, HQI? and what kind of bulbs do you have?

JPMagyar · #16 12/03/2007, 08:15 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by SitBackAndWatch
Hey JPMagyar, DE or SE? if DE, HQI? and what kind of bulbs do you have?

I'm using single ended XM 10k and 20k on a PFO-HQI ballast. I was going through the plots on Sanjay's Website when I realized there was little or no difference between the 400 watt bulb and a 250 watt bulb on a PFO-HQI ballast.

raynist · #17 12/03/2007, 08:26 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by JPMagyar
I'm using single ended XM 10k and 20k on a PFO-HQI ballast. I was going through the plots on Sanjay's Website when I realized there was little or no difference between the 400 watt bulb and a 250 watt bulb on a PFO-HQI ballast.

According to the article that this data came from the 250 XM10k on an HQI ballast is using 374 watts. Most electronic 400w ballasts are right around 415 watts so you are not saving as much electricity as it may seem (400 to 250). You are using about 11% less electricity and getting about 11% less par.

http://www.advancedaquarist.com/issu...004/review.htm

But I totally agree, no need for a 400 watt bulb in this case. a 250 or even a good 175 (iwasaki 15k) would be enough.

---Ray

JPMagyar · #18 12/03/2007, 09:23 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by raynist
According to the article that this data came from the 250 XM10k on an HQI ballast is using 374 watts. Most electronic 400w ballasts are right around 415 watts so you are not saving as much electricity as it may seem (400 to 250). You are using about 11% less electricity and getting about 11% less par.

---Ray

What!?! You mean no "free lunch". I'm flabbergasted

Call my lawyer!

Seriously though, thanks for the link. I'm sure Rico will enjoy the extra credit homework

I admit its hard to compare "apples to apples" when talking about lighting especially considering how emotional people get

I would add that for me the savings when switching from 400s to 250s was a little more because I was coming off 400 watts on PFO-HQI which was a little over 500 watts.

Sorry Rico - didn't mean to hijack the thread

. Atleast there's lots of good intentions and great links, heh!?

Joe

frank arriaga · #19 12/03/2007, 09:30 PM

wish I knew that before i pick up 4 400 watt.

markandkristen · #20 12/04/2007, 08:42 AM

you know what they say experience is not the best teacher ... but most often used...

JPMagyar · #21 12/04/2007, 10:31 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by reef rico
I was wondering if i aquire a 400 watt metal halide with a 14k bulb, will it burn and kill the sps which i want to get and if so would it be able to support a full sps reef.

Quote:

Originally posted by MJAnderson
Unless you had fairly low landscaping I think the middle of the tank would still be off limits to anything but a clam/specific SPS.

Just one last comment before I let this one go . . .

I want to emphasize a point I was trying to make earlier as well as politely disagree with the second statement above. 400 watt bulbs won't "burn" corals that are properly acclimated. Here's another shot of my old tank. Aside from the purple Montipora Digitata in the dead center that was thriving 9 inches directly below a 1000 wattt bulb, I had zoos, mushrooms, acros, and leathers all growing in the top 8 inches of water, and that reef is under a total of 3500 watts of lighting. There were three Ushio 10ks on 1000 watt Euro-ballasts made by PFO plus four 60 inch VHO actinics.

My point is - the majority of corals found in pictures here on RC would be just fine if placed directly below a 400 watt bulb as long as they were given time to adapt. I think the middle of your tank will be "off limits" to few if any corals if you use a 400 watt bulb. Sorry MJ - I'm just offering my own 2 cents

Of course, I still recommend 250s but that's another story, heh?

HTH someone,

Joe

MJAnderson · #22 12/04/2007, 04:50 PM

Not sure how to explain your growth with studies showing that too much light causes photoinhibition.

http://www.advancedaquarist.com/2007...hotoinhibition

JPMagyar · #23 12/04/2007, 06:34 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by MJAnderson
Not sure how to explain your growth with studies showing that too much light causes photoinhibition.

http://www.advancedaquarist.com/2007...hotoinhibition

Oh, that's easy - Vodka and Honey - that was my secret recipe; but don't tell anyone or it won't be a secret anymore

Seriously though - I agree completely that too much light is NOT a good thing. You do, however, bring up an interesting gist - Are 400 watt bulbs becoming "passe" because they are simply "too much light"? For those that are interested I am starting a thread here:

Do 400 watt bulbs do more harm than good?

Joe