College-

[TheBimbo]

Okay our son is graduating this year and we are trying to help him get into college, we are lost and I figured who better to ask but my Lounge friends ...


He is an Honor Student and has only ever gotten a C a few times on his report cards, I am unsure of what his GPA is as of now- I'm sure he knows this though... He had expressed going into the Air Force for many many years but hasn't really said much the last year or so, I'm not going to force it on him...

I just got off of the phone with somebody from Valley Forge Military College-they are offering him $14,974 a year for college- she said it's a 2yr college... I am so lost about all of this as I never attended college.


Sooo what do ya think? if this school is offering him something such as this, wouldn't another college do the same? He is really wanting to attend Penn State...


Christy

[hogpark7430]

I live by the Air Force Academy I have been told it is hard to get in to and has an equally as difficult academic program.

[Fat Man]

1. He's an honor student so he's pretty smart.

2. He's graduating high school so I assume he's eighteen or will be soon.

3. Therefore he's a legal adult who's pretty smart.

4. Buy him a suitcase and let him figure it out.

[dc]

First you need to see what he wants. Put in applications, apply for scholorships, grants whatever. Isn't there a guidance counselor there?

[Altpers0na]

if he is unsure of the air force thing , look for a school with an air force ROTC affiliation...

if he decides to sign up, he will have a leg up.. and if not it wont have hurt anything.. however i think taking ROTC money == obligation, not sure about that...

otherwise id really really shoot for a 4yr school. once you rule out the ivys, and super techs, penn is as good as anything else..

tons of collage money to be had, fastweb is your friend...

[Altpers0na]

o and i agree with fat man, im kickn mine out at 16... or at least thats what i tell em..

[Nykademus]

Sounds like they are referring to the G.I. bill which one gets if they join the military.

The first thing you guys should do is fill out the FAFSA, its a form that determines the level of financial aid that he may qualify for and is due by April 1st I believe, but you will want to submit it asap starting Jan. 1st (the money is first come first served type of deal). You might also look into scholarships for academics if he is an honor student.

A good starting point might be to look at what he ultimately wants to do when he is done, then plan the path to get there. It might help to tailor the options he has to his wants and needs.

For the record, if he asks if he can go to rodeo clown school.. tell him no. A bad day at the office takes on a whole new meaning in that line of work.

[Anemone]

Christy,

Visit the websites for the schools he's expressed interest in. Look at the total costs and figure out what you could afford, or are willing to afford. Then schedule some school visits (can be done on the web) - sometimes a school sounds really good when it's far away, but when you actually visit it, it's just so-so.

Visit several schools to get an idea of the variety.

If finances are an issue, there are scholarships, grants and loans out there. Also, going to a 2 year school first, then transferring to the 4 year school of choice is also a possibility (2 year schools are a lot cheaper, and although they don't offer the "fun" of being a part of a big-name school, he can get that in his last 2 years, and his diploma still coomes from the big-name sschool).

If you have more specific questions, ASK!!!! I have two in college, and I know there are a bunch of Loungers who attend school as well (many in their 5th, 6th or 7th year at a 4 year school, so they've got plenty of experience! ).

Kevin

[Sk8r]

Can he finance Penn State? Do you both know what it will cost and what his options are?
Does he have a career goal? Does he know what piece of paper he wants to exit college holding in his hand, one that says he's qualified to do some specific thing? Talk with him about this, and talk about his chances of breaking in, getting a job, supporting himself on that likely income, and where he'll have to live to do it.

His grades are respectable. Things like a past academic and work history will factor into what someone is willing to grant him or lend him...will factor into whether he can carry both a meaningful job and class work.

Some corporations will help finance further study for promising employees.

There are two routes to go: one is the academic, or profession, route...toward medical, teaching, business, management, accounting, law, law enforcement, etc or scientific, research, development, engineering...computer programming, design, etc.

Another is a BONA FIDE trade school that will turn you out with a specific skill and get you hired. DO NOT bite on those ads that promise to make you a game designer in two years [those companies actually want a college degree. You can get mechanical training and some clerical training here.

You can borrow money...but only as much as your past grades and likelihood of success make the lender believe you can pay back. The parent may have to cosign...likely will have to cosign, risking family finance on the youngster's integrity and promise.

The military is an avenue for education and training, but...its guarantees are not set in stone, and what you're promised isn't always where you end up. If you can get into officer training it's a little easier to end up where you'd like, as I understand, but ask a current military person about that prospect.

[TheBimbo]

you are bad!!!

Originally posted by dc
First you need to see what he wants. Put in applications, apply for scholorships, grants whatever. Isn't there a guidance counselor there?

Yes I've already cancelled 2 appointments b/c hubby wasn't going to make it. I'll call and make another one... I will forget everything she says to me- so hubby has to be there!!!

Originally posted by Altpers0na
if he is unsure of the air force thing , look for a school with an air force ROTC affiliation...

if he decides to sign up, he will have a leg up.. and if not it wont have hurt anything.. however i think taking ROTC money == obligation, not sure about that...

otherwise id really really shoot for a 4yr school. once you rule out the ivys, and super techs, penn is as good as anything else..

tons of collage money to be had, fastweb is your friend...

She said that they have Air Force ROTC- but this is only a 2 year college. I wish he'd just try for Pitt here in J-Town he could stay here at home and we'd save oodles of $$$



Christy...

[JokerGirl]

He really needs to start thinking about this soon. In theory, he should've already started applying to schools at the end of his Junior year, especially if he's expecting to get into any good schools, and even more so if he wants scholarships.

Unfortunately, in this day and age, there is a lot of competition to get into good programs. Typically, a 2 year degree is considered to be an Associates degree, and if he's that smart, he really should be looking at a 4 year program which will get him a Bachelors.

A lot of schools have application deadlines for Fall entrance, so he needs to start looking into that and getting them sent away.

He also needs to think about whether or not he needs to take the SATs and/or ACTs. A lot of schools base your acceptance on how well you score on the SAT.

[Anemone]

The reference to the FAFSA (Free Application For Student Aid) was a good one. It's a pretty extensive questionaire, so you'll want to start on it soon, and give yourself some time to get/find the required info:

http://www.fafsa.ed.gov/

Kevin

[JokerGirl]

P.S.

Penn State is an Ivy League school i.e. meaning one of the best in the country. He will probably need SAT scores of 1200-1300 to get in.

[Anemone]

Oh yeah, if he's graduating this year, he needs to get Apps in for 4 years schools ASAP. Some of them will have already had their application deadlines pass (and these he'll have to apply for second round consideration, if he's interested). Others will be at the end of this month. Most can be done on the web.

Kevin

[TheBimbo]

Wow- you Lounger's are awesome!


He took his SAT'S about 2 weeks ago and we're awaiting his scores. He said he's interested in Economics... We doubt he'd do well in a trade school.

*** sigh *** I hope that we didn't mess up by waiting so long to do this. As for saving money on the 2 year college route, we have mentioned this to him as well b/c the first year in college (from what we've heard) is all basic classes... So why pay that kind of $$$ to a pricey school when he can get the same thing around here at a Jr. College??? right???


Christy...

guidance counselor will call me back...

[Altpers0na]

doh, shows what i know...

id also advise taking as many, passable, collage course or equivalent class's before actually going to collage as possible...

i know of no good reason to wait for your freshman year to knock out the basics...

and an accredited, transferable, clep is a lot cheaper than a class.

[Anemone]

Originally posted by JokerGirl
P.S.

Penn State is an Ivy League school i.e. meaning one of the best in the country. He will probably need SAT scores of 1200-1300 to get in.

Actually, they're using a 2400 point test nowadays. I'm betting a true Ivy League school will require at least a 2000.

And Penn State is not an Ivy League school - the Ivy League is Brown, Columbia, Cornell, Dartmouth, Harvard, Princeton, Yale and the University of Pennsylvania (not the same as Penn State).

Kevin

[JokerGirl]

Originally posted by TheBimbo
Wow- you Lounger's are awesome!


He took his SAT'S about 2 weeks ago and we're awaiting his scores. He said he's interested in Economics... We doubt he'd do well in a trade school.

*** sigh *** I hope that we didn't mess up by waiting so long to do this. As for saving money on the 2 year college route, we have mentioned this to him as well b/c the first year in college (from what we've heard) is all basic classes... So why pay that kind of $$$ to a pricey school when he can get the same thing around here at a Jr. College??? right???


Christy...

guidance counselor will call me back...

I would be really worried about that. He can essentially go to a Jr. College for the first year, but he needs to make sure that those credits will transfer to the college he wants to transfer to. I know that my university is VERY picky about what credits can and will transfer from community colleges.

Hopefully his SAT scores get back in time. While he's in the process of waiting for them, he should get started on the applications for the universities he's looking at. Many of them will require him to write an essay on some flaky topic that he could care less about. Most of them can be submitted online luckily, and they are usually pretty quick to admit/reject your application.

[JokerGirl]

Originally posted by Anemone
Actually, they're using a 2400 point test nowadays. I'm betting a true Ivy League school will require at least a 2000.

And Penn State is not an Ivy League school - the Ivy League is Brown, Columbia, Cornell, Dartmouth, Harvard, Princeton, Yale and the University of Pennsylvania (not the same as Penn State).

Kevin

Wow, I didn't realize they had changed the SATs in the last few years. And okay, I was wrong in calling it an Ivy League school, but it is still one of the best state universities in the country.

[Phyxius]

Check with several schools and see what they will offer. Daughter was an Honor student/AG placement all through school with a 4.23 GPA and graduated early. She had schools throwing scholarships her way left and right when she was applying last summer just to get her to come to their schools. She ended up going to EKU for Forensic Chemistry and the gave her In-State tuition, Academic Scholarships and Honor student discounts on books and the like. It ended up knocking thousands off her tuition bill every year till she graduates if she maintains a set GPA. Check with where you work and see if they have any tuition benefits for your kids. Duke University has a tuition program and since my wife has been their 17yrs they paid a pretty big chunk of what tuition was left. We ended up paying for Housing and food only for the yr.

Check around and ask around as there are a bunch of programs out there like FAFSA mentioned above for loans to parents and students alike. Just check them out as there are some off the path shady programs too,

[Anemone]

Originally posted by TheBimbo
As for saving money on the 2 year college route, we have mentioned this to him as well b/c the first year in college (from what we've heard) is all basic classes... So why pay that kind of $$$ to a pricey school when he can get the same thing around here at a Jr. College??? right???

Yep, that's exactly what all parents say. It's not, however, what the kids generally want.

It can allow a student to get into a better school in two years (if grades or scores weren't high enough from high school), or save money those first two years (important for parents).

The drawback, as I mentioned, is that the college "experience" just isn't the same at most 2 year schools. They're usually "commuter" schols, with kids in transition to 4 year schools or looking to get out into the work force, so they have less school identity and "pride." Kids in college are often all about belonging to something bigger than themselves, and somehow learn AND grow up overthe four year process. Some of that fun just isn't there at two-year schools.

FWIW,
Kevin

[JokerGirl]

Originally posted by Anemone

The drawback, as I mentioned, is that the college "experience" just isn't the same at most 2 year schools. They're usually "commuter" schols, with kids in transition to 4 year schools or looking to get out into the work force, so they have less school identity and "pride." Kids in college are often all about belonging to something bigger than themselves, and somehow learn AND grow up overthe four year process. Some of that fun just isn't there at two-year schools.

FWIW,
Kevin

Shhhh don't give away the big secret! I agree though. Going to college is about getting out of your parent's house and learning how to get by on your own. At the same time, though, most kids can't handle the new found freedom that they get once they go to school, so I would be careful as to just how much you give him.

Most kids have this idea that when they go off to school it's going to be one big party all the time, and eventually they end up screwing up a semester or two.

I would try to get it into his head that he is going to school because HE wants to learn and that there isn't going to be anyone there making him get up and making him study. He needs to make sure this is really what he wants because it's a huge financial investment, but one that will ultimately pay off in the end.

[Anemone]

Originally posted by Phyxius
Check with several schools and see what they will offer.

This is also very good advice. Schools range wildly in what they'll give, and what they are looking for. Some schools are very picky - and will offer very littel, while the same student can apply to what appears to be a comparable school and get close to a full-ride. it's all about what the school is looking for.

Scholarships in general are funny things - they can be based on race, corporate affiliation (where parent's work), school choice, major choice and dozens of other things (some schoold have "shopping lists" of things certain donors are looking for - like a left-handed violin player majoring in math and coming from Grandma's home town)... some seem strange, but there are people out there who want to choose who gets their money, and schools (and community groups) let them (get your son to start camping out in the couselor's office - all the scholarship applications/notices/contests come through the counseling office... he needs to check their at least once a week for opportunities for free money).

Kevin

[drauka99]

as has been mentioned - Jr. Colleges and Community Colleges are great for getting the beginned classes taken care of but what happens is - alot of kids can't transition from the 2yr school to life at the big 4yr school. Also there is what used to be refered to the freshman drop - as in grades not acctually droping them - if your son goes to jr. college and makes A's and B's he can safley assume that his JR year at a 4yr college he will make C's or below. Its very hard to get the whole culture diffrence from jr. college to 4yr. Imagine Jr. College as college light (about 1/2H.S. and Half College) and then 4yr schools as fully college based.

I did community college and am enrolling into a 4yr school soon.

Also check and see how many credits he can transfer from the JR to the 4yr school if you go that route. if he has 75 credits but is only allowed to transfer 60 by the new school - you've paid for 15 credits he can't use toward his degree and has to take the classes again if they are required for his degree

[Sk8r]

Two observations:
SOber talk with son re family sacrifice to enable this, and that study time comes before party, classes have to be attended even if widely cut, and all courses have to be passed iwth the highest possible mark: college is too pricey nowadays for most families to finance even a single year of wild oats and hormone-driven fog. State that you do not intend to be eating beans for four years to finance him living la dolce vita...

And secondly---it does matter where that degree is ultimately from: he can start at a 2-year. What matters is the big logo at the top of that final diploma. Graduates from Penn State will have an easier time earning more in their lifetime, because employers will say, "Mmm, three applicants, one from Podunk U, one from Party U, one from Penn State..." Guess which one will get the position. So it does matter. But it's not everything. He might decide to go to grad school [on his own nickle, via scholarship.] He might use personal finesse and smarts to parlay an education into something transcending the logo at the top of the sheepskin... I couldn't afford the 'big school' for my undergrad. What I did was wring every ounce of learning out of inferior classes that I could manage---knowing I wanted to compete with the best, but I couldn't afford a gold-plated education, I was AT every class session, I asked questions that annoyed and bored my stoned and hungover classmates, I didn't cut, and I actually read the textbooks---a lot. I ended up in grad school competing with graduates of the ivy league on the grading curve, and doing just all right with my 'party school u' background, because I'd wrung everything I could possibly get out of the cheaper school, and they'd just gotten what was convenient out of their cadillac educations taught by Nobel Prize winners. And to do justice, some few of those ivy league grads HAD worked their tails off, and they were good! So it all comes out in the wash. You CAN get more than you pay for.