things not to use or buy during your first 6 months in the hobby: FYI

[leoslizards]

hmm.. are those considered SPS?

[Nanz]

Originally posted by Sk8r
Cones, yes, cones, along with one of the sea snakes, the box jellyfish, the blue-ringed octopus and the poison arrow frog, are some of the deadliest creatures on the planet.

What is Cones ?

Are they a snail? I got some live sand/mud for my refugium and I have this strange cone-like snail. I can get a pic for you.

[kathainbowen]

Sk8r.... in light of some recent threads over here in the New to the Hobby forum, can we add sharks and rays to the list?

[Crimthann]

Attack of the killer Cone snails - dun dun dunnnnnnnnnnnnn


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LcBKH7s4SVQ

Actually pretty cool. I read a while back that they use their venom which has a pain numbing quality for those spinal injections for pain relief.

[Sk8r]

There is a tiny [under one half inch] snail called a dove snail which is a very good thing for your tank: it has a unique trick of using a rappel line to descend from rock to rock, like spider silk, and they are tiny, so they get into places other snails can't go: this, though cone-shaped, is not a cone snail.

Cones you might see would be about the size of a fighting conch, smooth, patterned shell.

Alas, we cannot have most of the wide range of really pretty-shelled creatures. Most that we can keep safely are colored like rocks, because that's where they live and eat: nature's camo. The only relief from this monotony that we commonly have is the nassarius, which should be pure white or maybe a very pale band or two. Don't buy brown nassarius: I don't know where they're getting them, but there are some false nassarius going around---gotten from ebay, as I understand.

[Onte]

How often could one expect to get a cone as a hitchhiker? Is it a rare occurrence? One of the sources I've read about them in scared me to death - the source makes it sound as though they're really darn common.

[Cope]

I have some green naz snails? They seem just like the white ones?

[Sk8r]

No, absolutely not common in the US. If you were a reefer in areas where there are a lot of cones and a lot of wild-cat collecting, it could happen. It can even happen where one has bought some massive pieces of rock and put them in uncured.

But they're quite obvious, once they get down on the sand where they operate. And if you ever do spot one, about 2" long, interestingly patterned in leather brown and white, usually, without the 'crown' that distinguishes a conch, it's time to get out the camera and get pix onto RC for a sure ID. I don't think in the 2 years I've been online that anybody has ever turned one up. But they are worth knowing about, so if you should by some weird combination of circumstances, get one, you can ID it. You'd remove it just by getting an ordinary clean bacon tongs [metal ok on short exposure] and lifting the rascal out. Me, I'd put him down in the fuge, and then transport him to the lfs for somebody who might have an interest in him.
Sumps and fuges have a real nice alternate function as a place to put some rascal you know you don't want, be it a gorilla crab [furry to the max] or mantis or even eunicid worm. There's often somebody who wants them.

[Nanz]

Originally posted by Crimthann
Attack of the killer Cone snails - dun dun dunnnnnnnnnnnnn


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LcBKH7s4SVQ

Actually pretty cool. I read a while back that they use their venom which has a pain numbing quality for those spinal injections for pain relief.

Wow that was interesting... My snail looks nothing like that. Its les than 1/2 na mostly white with ridged edges.

I think I may also have some of the brown Nassarius snails. I ordered them from Vivid Aquariums. They look just like my white ones that I got from Live Aquaria but they have a brown shell.

[Sk8r]

Cope, that green could be algae, but maybe a local variant: if they operate like nassarius, great. I've never seen green; I've never actually seen brown, except in some odd internet offerings, and I do know that there is an Ebay seller who is collecting odd snails out of the Caribbean and selling them. I am really not keen on Ebay sellers of livestock: you don't know what you're getting into if you don't know the hobby well, and if you do know the hobby well, you know other reasons not to deal that way, including the chances of getting illegally collected items, disease, you name it. I have actually seen an Ebay offering of 'anemone' rock. It was, of course, covered in aiptasia. Clever, but not real nice. And I'm betting some novice marine keeper bought it.

On the brown ones, watch their behaviors closely: be sure they're not skinny-shelled on one long end [ever seen a whelk shell?]. Nassarius are fat-shelled more or less all over, have a distinctive forked tail [they look almost like a flatworm with a shell!] and can't climb glass or rock---they're SO slimey they slide off or U-turn. One thing all true nassarius are is---fast. Only a stomatella [good guy] snail can keep up with them.

Whelks are something I probably should mention: they are as described above, and they envelop and kill, crawling over their victim. Fish don't stand still for this, obviously, but a whelk will be after anything it can get.

Some people are scared of fighting conches...the name is a joke. THey're gentle creatures who 'buck' to dislodge irreverent crabs and other snails that might climb onto them. The only thing you should NOT have in the tank with a conch is a plate coral: conches have a jagged spur they use for pole-vaulting over small obstacles and for defense; but it rips heck out of plate coral and will kill it by accident.

[leoslizards]

Originally posted by Crimthann
Attack of the killer Cone snails - dun dun dunnnnnnnnnnnnn


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LcBKH7s4SVQ

Actually pretty cool. I read a while back that they use their venom which has a pain numbing quality for those spinal injections for pain relief.

Did you see this vid?
Cone Snail

[Swanwillow]

Originally posted by leoslizards
hmm.. are those considered SPS?

Nope, softies.

[Cope]

I have seen my naz snails climb glass/and rock? Nex time I see em I'll get picks.
I'll look for the green ones as well.
Thanks for all the help
Cope

[Sk8r]

Mind, nassarius snails will make it about 10" up the glass---fast---before their slime overwhelms their energy and they sort of U turn and slide and fall down. I've never seen one get on rock.

If you get a pic of your brown rock-climbing nassarius I'd sort of like to fly them by the Invertebrate forum to find out if they are a legitmate subspecies or something else---maybe a perfectly 'fine' something else, but I'm just curious now. Remember that nassarius are carnivores, and the white ones have the polite habit of waiting until something is sincerely dead. I just want to be sure the brown ones are as polite.

Note: just did some googling, and found Nassarius Vibex, plus a kissing cousin, the New England and offshore-British Dog Whelk, which as you can tell, is a whelk---nassarius are close to the whelks, but better mannered. The dog whelk, which is what I fear is being sold on Ebay, [it can be collected on the coast] is indeed a scavenger, but has a nasty habit of preying on clams and limpets and other shellfish by boring a hole into the shell and having lunch. If you have brown nassarius, I'd just put them to work in the refugium, if you have clams or limpets upstairs.

[fishox]

I have a 5 -6" long cuc that I bought about a year ago. How can I find out if it is of the poisonous variety? Can anyone point me to website or some other resource?
Thanks

[Sk8r]

Google "cuke nuke" and some interesting articles will turn up.

One expert says, yes, they're ALL toxic, but careful maintenance will prevent them nuking the tank. Sea apples are the worst, he says, and most toxic. If a fish bothers a cuke, it is dangerous. if they get into a powerhead it is less dangerous but not inconsiderable. If they expel 'cuverian threads', usually through being bitten on the rear [where their gills are] by aggressive fish, this is Not Good. I would say the fonder you are of your tank and its occupants in their current incarnation, and the larger the cuke in relation to your total tank volume, the more you probably should consider moving on your cucumber to somebody with less to lose. Do read the articles and make sure you are comfortable with the situation.
There was also a recent tragic incident with a guy who had a boxfish that, similarly stressed, took out a tank.

Of fish and inverts that, stressed, can take out your tank, similar to 'cuke nuke' they are:
1. sea apples [variety of cucumber: very dangerous]
2. cucumbers [most]
3. boxfish
4. cowfish
and one plant: caulerpa, [if its lighting cycle is changed or you have an extended power out, be careful of it. If present in massive amounts it can de-oxygenate your water while sporing, which it does in response to light changes. Keep a light on it 24/7 and you're safe.]

[fishox]

Thanks Sk8r. I think I'll take the cuc and the pink urchin that eats the coraline that I work so hard to grow, back to the store.

I also have caulerpa in my sump on a 24/7 lighting schedule. Maybe I should toss that too and go with chaeto.

[Sk8r]

I would seriously recommend cheato. I have a mixed ball myself, and am about to reduce it to cheato only [a few strands of caulerpa recently bloomed to many.]

If it were my tank, I'd sure rather be safe than sorry. I've had an entire tank nuked once, a week after I'd hauled all those fish back from Maryland to Oklahoma using a hand pump while somebody else drove. I've never forgotten that. Horrid feeling.