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  #51  
Old 02/22/2007, 10:18 PM
rabidcrab rabidcrab is offline
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eh, ive seen enough successful tanks and enough different successful set ups to know that theres no reason to follow a cookie cutter aquarium model.

and to critter, theres enough buisness over here... trust me. as far as clams+pc's the setups vary.. alot. most of the time its either a simple light set up, with clams positioned very high (like my own set ups) or pc's retrofitted in hoods to give lots of light.

as bob said earlier "if its mantle is receiving enough photonic energy, it doesn’t matter if it is from MH, PC or other means."
Try it out for yourself guys, dont take my word for it. Im a bit over this thread, theres obviously enough people out there that wanna argue over clams and light. Its just a hobby, and no one has to turn it into an arguement, so sorry to all if i contributed to it, my intentions were purely to share my experience.
  #52  
Old 02/23/2007, 01:39 AM
critterkeeper critterkeeper is offline
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I understand the set-ups are not all the same, which is why it would be nice of you to actually document each set-up here. What we need are lots of facts/data and fewer opinions. Agreed? I am ALWAYS open to looking at new data, and have said many times that my conclusions/opinions would change if a significant number of hobbyists could report difinitive success under T5 or anything else. So far, that hasn't happened. I realize "a significant number" is somewhat subjective, but I'm in this to help hobbyists and clams - that's it.

So, I know it may take some time, but please take a few minutes and do the best you can to describe what you have living under what lights, etc. Besides, if you state that you have been so successful, but then won't take the time to give out specific details - you're really not helping anyone. For all I know, you've got 4 croceas in 4 tanks, all sitting 4 inches from the bulbs...

For anyone else too, I'd be particularly interested to hear from hobbyists about cases where they try a clam under X lights and they do fine, then they add another one (or more) and those don't. Get the idea?

Thanks,

JF

P.S. Somewhere down the road I do intend to write up a second edition of my clam book. This sort of thing (lighting) is the one area where I really need to hear more from hobbyists. Or everyone could just send me a hundred bucks and I'll set up a huge lab and figure it all out under controlled conditions myself (har, har, har - dreaming).
  #53  
Old 02/23/2007, 03:14 PM
bobbacon bobbacon is offline
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Quote:
Originally posted by critterkeeper
I understand the set-ups are not all the same, which is why it would be nice of you to actually document each set-up here. What we need are lots of facts/data and fewer opinions. Agreed? I am ALWAYS open to looking at new data, and have said many times that my conclusions/opinions would change if a significant number of hobbyists could report difinitive success under T5 or anything else. So far, that hasn't happened. I realize "a significant number" is somewhat subjective, but I'm in this to help hobbyists and clams - that's it.

So, I know it may take some time, but please take a few minutes and do the best you can to describe what you have living under what lights, etc. Besides, if you state that you have been so successful, but then won't take the time to give out specific details - you're really not helping anyone. For all I know, you've got 4 croceas in 4 tanks, all sitting 4 inches from the bulbs...

For anyone else too, I'd be particularly interested to hear from hobbyists about cases where they try a clam under X lights and they do fine, then they add another one (or more) and those don't. Get the idea?

Thanks,

JF

P.S. Somewhere down the road I do intend to write up a second edition of my clam book. This sort of thing (lighting) is the one area where I really need to hear more from hobbyists. Or everyone could just send me a hundred bucks and I'll set up a huge lab and figure it all out under controlled conditions myself (har, har, har - dreaming).





If you are truly serious about collecting data on the experiences of hobbyists, there are better methods than asking in a single thread at RC.
You should construct a matrix of questions to allow for a standardized scientific analysis. You might also want to use your website as a collection portal for the responses you may receive if you promote your survey to a wide range of hobbyists and reef groups.

These are only suggestions. After viewing your Curriculum Vitae, I was quite surprised that someone with a Masters Degree in Geology and teaching at the community college level, would ask such an open ended questions under the guise of wanting to collect scientific data. If one were naive, one might believe that you were just trying to 'put up or shut up' rabidcrab for having a different point of view.
  #54  
Old 02/23/2007, 03:44 PM
a4twenty a4twenty is offline
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Quote:
Originally posted by bobbacon
After viewing your Curriculum Vitae, I was quite surprised that someone with a Masters Degree in Geology and teaching at the community college level, would ask such an open ended questions under the guise of wanting to collect scientific data. If one were naive, one might believe that you were just trying to 'put up or shut up' rabidcrab for having a different point of view.

i guess one could make up that conclusion, or as he said , he is interested in the information for the second edition of his book.

you might want to take a look at his book,Giant Clams in the Sea and the Aquarium . it is an awesome read, full of up to date information about clams backed up with references. IMO, a must have for the clam lover
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  #55  
Old 02/23/2007, 04:20 PM
jmaneyapanda jmaneyapanda is offline
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Jeez- how have I missed this one?!

You can also keep a tridacnid under incandescant bulbs- provided you have enough of them over the tank. Does this make it a good idea to promote their use? Absolutely NOT! Because it has and will be frequently misinterpreted to others as "clams can live under any incandescant". This is why there is so much objection to the claims of success. Because it is far and away, without a doubt, the exception to the rule. Accept it.
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  #56  
Old 02/23/2007, 06:02 PM
critterkeeper critterkeeper is offline
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Actually, I already had a sticky post a while back with specific questions about keeping them under fluorescents. It stayed at the top for a couple of months I think - and only a handful of people responded, and most responses were incomplete. So, now I ask people directly whenever the opportunity arises.

I take what I can get...

"If one were naive, one might believe that you were just trying to 'put up or shut up' rabidcrab for having a different point of view."

Uh, put up is what I asked. Thought I made it it clear that shut up is what we don't want. If he's got info, we can all benefit from it.

Ain't it funny how different people get different things out of the same posts?

JF
  #57  
Old 02/23/2007, 08:39 PM
ezcompany ezcompany is offline
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i think its threads like these that causes chris to retire from posting on the forum
i don't think i've ever seen a "clams under pc" thread without some bit of antagonism
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  #58  
Old 02/24/2007, 08:49 AM
mbbuna mbbuna is offline
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Quote:
Originally posted by ezcompany
i think its threads like these that causes chris to retire from posting on the forum
i just don't need to post any more, haven't you noticed the increase in posting by people with very impressive credentials like Dentist, Biology student and Biochemist ! every one of these new posters have made posts just full of useful information, they've cleared up all the gray areas, there's nothing left to say.
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  #59  
Old 02/27/2007, 01:45 PM
Jovreefer Jovreefer is offline
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Ugh.. I cant believe I'm going to jump in on this thread... but here I am.

Granted I agree crocea's & maxima's should only be kept under MH... but they can be kept under PC's with proper care. I kept a crocea for almost 1.5 years under pc's, not only that but in a tiny nano tank.

I would definatly not reccomend it, espically to a newbie.

Clam was put in a 2 gallon tank in my cube for 4 months before transfering to a 10 gallon under 96W pc. Clam was almost 3 inches when I got him, I did feed fresh phyto about once a month when I visited a friend & grabbed some from him, so yes, it was getting tiny bits of extra supliments. Tank was no where near natural light either. No skimmer for about half the time either .. just bi-weekly water changes. That tank was running for 1 year.

I eventually upgraded to a 20H when I moved & got a MH light for the clam. Clam is still alive... will be 3 years old this comming july.

The only strange thing I've seen with this clam is the shell took on a Maxima growth look instead of the smoother crocea look. Dont know if that was somehow due to the PC lighting or what, but even a year later under MH it still has long "scoot" growth.

I've been meaning to get a picture of the growth forever now to show the smooth to ridgid growth... REALLY neat looking, I've had quite a few people comment on it who see it in person.

I think I covered all the basis hear, size of tank, lights, duration under lights, size of clam, no windows, feedings... so I'd hope any questions be truly for discovery & not simply to dis-credit me & flame me

Edit: oh yea... almost forgot, it grew in every tank, I had a new shell layer in the 2 gallon. several in the 10 gallon & just as many in the 20 under the MH.. have not noticed any speeding up or slowing down of growth this whole time. Actually just measured the clam last month for the first time when I got my new baby maxima, clam is now 6.5 inches. Much bigger than I had guestimated.
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  #60  
Old 02/27/2007, 02:38 PM
Serioussnaps Serioussnaps is offline
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I wonder what the skeptics opinions on T5 s and clams are?

BTW i didnt know PETA was an RC sponsor! its a stinking dime a dozen clam that alot of people would see as food
  #61  
Old 03/02/2007, 09:49 AM
critterkeeper critterkeeper is offline
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And yet again - people saying they're keeping this and that under this and that and everythings great. But when asked to post specific details, I get one person (jovreefer) that gives at least something, and the rest disappear. Same thing happens all the time.

Where'd you go rabidcrab?

Bobbacon, are you starting to see why I'm not ready to start recommending T5s?
  #62  
Old 03/02/2007, 10:05 AM
mbbuna mbbuna is offline
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Quote:
Originally posted by critterkeeper


Bobbacon, are you starting to see why I'm not ready to start recommending T5s?
Bobbacon is no longer with us along with a few other fake names he used. Bob first appeared in this thread http://archive.reefcentral.com/forum...hreadid=979591 on the same topic. a week after that thread he bought a 250w MH but just had to keep trolling about how good PC's were for clams
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  #63  
Old 03/02/2007, 06:55 PM
a4twenty a4twenty is offline
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Quote:
Originally posted by mbbuna
a week after that thread he bought a 250w MH but just had to keep trolling about how good PC's were for clams
some people aren't happy unless they're causing crap

i see he has moved on, maybe him and Shari should get together
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  #64  
Old 03/02/2007, 07:25 PM
rabidcrab rabidcrab is offline
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Quote:
Originally posted by critterkeeper
And yet again - people saying they're keeping this and that under this and that and everythings great. But when asked to post specific details, I get one person (jovreefer) that gives at least something, and the rest disappear. Same thing happens all the time.

Where'd you go rabidcrab?

Bobbacon, are you starting to see why I'm not ready to start recommending T5s?
like twenty said, sum people arent happy unless theyre causing crap

ive been done contributing to this arguement.. i stopped caring a while ago. sorry?
  #65  
Old 03/03/2007, 01:56 PM
a4twenty a4twenty is offline
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Quote:
Originally posted by Jovreefer
The only strange thing I've seen with this clam is the shell took on a Maxima growth look instead of the smoother crocea look. Dont know if that was somehow due to the PC lighting or what, but even a year later under MH it still has long "scoot" growth.

I've been meaning to get a picture of the growth forever now to show the smooth to ridgid growth... REALLY neat looking, I've had quite a few people comment on it who see it in person.
missed this the first time through

crocea do grow scutes but in the wild they break off when they bore in between rocks and corals. it is normal for tank a raised crocea to have scutes. ( or a wild caught that has been in an aquarium for years )
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  #66  
Old 03/03/2007, 03:26 PM
bgwil99 bgwil99 is offline
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Well, I wish I would have checked into this clam/lighting topic a little more before I purchased a Crocea. I have a 29g with 2 x 55watt pc's. I am adding 4 x 24 watt t5's with individual reflectors to go with the pc's. So I will have about 210 watts of light over a 29g.I was thinking it would be alright at the bottom of the tank, but after reading this I'm thinking of moving it up to the upper 1/3.

To the people who know...what bulb combo would you recomend for the pc and t5 lights?

I will document results on this forum with data and pics. I am new to reefing and this will be my first clam, so I will be seeking knowledgeable advice. Wish me luck!

Thanks.
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