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  #101  
Old 12/18/2006, 03:24 AM
BubbleMonkeyIII BubbleMonkeyIII is offline
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Im a very nice honest guy, Im good with people, I try to be fair with everyone, as best to be honest. When I realized my mistake not being CLEAR completely with the guy in the AD, I took the blame manned up and when He made a counter offer to solve the prolbem I agreed.

Also, I contend from the beginning, I could have LIED when he asked me about the repair. I didnt. and dont.

Ok for the last time. I admit I misreprested the light in my ad. Next time I will be more careful when wording things like this.

Was i trying to rip the guy? No, should i have been more "honest" telling every single issue I had with it along with the description... yes... Ok?

Ok:? Now can we move on?

Remember, It was not me coming in here AIRING dirty laundry in RC. this is not the place for it and I said so. When I found this link I SEE PAGES AND PAGES of ATTACKS.

I asked a question in the forums about how this wire could come apart on me and the proper way to connect it, and he basically comes on that thread Defaming, SLANDERING ME, Calling me names.. He Defamed me in public. Which is also WRONG. if not MORE wrong that what I did. None of you KNOW all the details and what anyone REALLY KNEW about this deal

He chose to bring it in here, I had to defend myself.

I wasnt bringing his attitude he had with me in here, I could have but I didnt. Seems like you poeple know about him anyways, I wish I did.
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  #102  
Old 12/18/2006, 04:21 AM
BubbleMonkeyIII BubbleMonkeyIII is offline
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Also all of you are baggin on me about what the AD says. But I failed to reveal to you about the other details of the transaction concering the fact HE KNEW UPFRONT that it was A DIY project that would require Major Re-WIRING IN the fixture no matter what to connect new ballast to the light sockets.

Also all of you dont know what Bergy and I discussed in emails or on the phone after he agreed to buy it. apart from the ad or not. He knew it was not ready to just PLUG IN and run as it was... I made it plain to him going in about the need for the new wires to be attached to the fixture INSIDE The unit.

Number one,

The biggest problem I have with this guy is that he BOUGHT THE FRIGGIN THING AS A DIY RE-WIRE PROJECT. Not a "PLUG and PLAY" BRAND NEW LIGHT just hook up and go.

THis is HUGE IMHO

Really though the AD wasnt clear, I admitted but due to our discussions he understood what it was going to take to make it work I made sure Of this that he could do it, before he purchased it, we talked about what it would TAKE to wire that thing up.

Really, I was being nice about the AD to him, because, I dont care what the AD said, We discussed AFTER the FACT through E mails and over the phone before he bought it what it would take to make it work.

Most of you jump on me about the AD but you dont know the whole story about what was discussed about the light and the HUGE DIY wiring project it was going to be for him to connect NEW T5 ballast wires INSIDE THE LIGHT FIXTURE, and a New HQI ballast which he purchased from me to run the light. This is what I discussed with him over the phone. He KNEW it going in.

This little fact escaped this whole drama.. I regret it wasnt in my first POST.....

The fact of the matter is that he would have had to CUT EVERY single power wire existing in the unit to remove the 6" of stock wires with connectors on the ends.. which ran into the light.

To connect the BW ballast cords he would have to hardwire the NEW ones in to the sockets inside the light for the HQI and T5 bulbs, thus he would be FORCED to REWIRE everything including my repair to make the lights WORK in the first place. This is why he also BOUGHT The BALLAST and CORDS from me to do exactly this.

So the fact the wiring was broken or even repaired was a mute issue as far as I was concerned no matter what it was advertised as, I told him and discussed the DIY nature of this light CLEARLY.

After telling him and advising him about the rewiring job that would be required to power up the light He knew what the light was going to need and agreed to buy it ANYWAYs.

Bean is right, you dont know the WHOLE story behind this mess...

Maybe he realized he wasnt upto it or again that the T5 ballast were not there then tried to back out. I dont know about all that...but I know one thing, you cannot just push wires into the thing and make it work without a STOCK ballast with those connectors.

So this was the real problem I have with wiring claims is that he found after the fact was that he PURCHASED THE BALLAST TO RUN THE LIGHTS including the cords. Right? And If im telling the truth that he KNEW it neeed to be rewired, (which I am) how can he freak if ONE wire is broken and one was repaired knowing THEY ALL HAD TO BE CUT ANYWAYS IN ORDER To hardwire the thing and make it work???

That light had NO stock pre wired ballast to run it with when it was sold to him I threw it out and this was made PLAIN even i the AD. He planned on using that BALLAST and It was TOLD to him it was a DIY project and a big rewiring one at that. These lights have special THREE PRONGED connectors on the ends.. that extend into the light. Unless he SPLICED Those onto the HQI WIRES from the BW7 (Not safe) he was REQUIRED and told he would have REWIRE the fixture

I have a challange question for anyone..

Can anyone including bergy, tell me how he was going to Hardwire TWO NEW BALLAST's wires INTO and through that light to the EXISITING HQI sockets and T5 sockets? WITHOUT rewiring cutting and SPLICING EVERYTHING in there including the repaired wire that I did?

the light had no ballast, The exisitng wires have stock thre prong proprietary connectors that would have to have been removed and the new HQI from the BW run through and reconnected to the CUT HQI WIRES inside. Same ting goes with the T5 wires. Which he would then have to solder, crimp, connect compress whatever, to do the job right.

Basically the whole thing needed a rewire and he knew it. Case closed.

The answer is He KNEW it needed to be rewired, I told him so, he agreed to this after the fact of the AD.

Those 600volt wires needed to go through that endcase and be hard/ REWIRED to the HQI sockets anyways, making ANY and all repairs I had done to the light MUTE at this point. He also knew that the fixture needed to be rewired and that it was a BIG DIY project. This was discussed clearly

So the wiring aside the fixture was in GREAT condition I wish I had mentioned this earlier, but I was just trying to share my experience with the guy.

Bottom line he knew it was a DIY wiring project and not "plug and play" I made that clear in emails and over the phone.

Also despite what he says, thats not true about only $50..

I offered him a free $25.00 Standpipe, $25.00 worth of fragnets, and $50.00 off a skimmer I make. Not to mention I GAVE him a Free standpipe when he picked up the light at NO charge.
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Last edited by BubbleMonkeyIII; 12/18/2006 at 04:44 AM.
  #103  
Old 12/18/2006, 04:27 AM
Bergovoy Bergovoy is offline
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I made a proposal to him after he admitted he performed surgery and failed to tell me about it.

Since that proposal was an email to him from me, I am at liberty to cut and paste it here as I have not issue with my information being public. (so here is the complete text of the proposal)

[red]
So, here are the choices as I present them to you, You may in fact refuse them all, or you may in fact stand up and take responsibility for the misrepresentations of those items:

I have already paid $250 for both items, the (NEW and Working Fixture) and the New and Working Ballast

Option 1. You can take the equipment back and give me a full refund or

Option 2. I will offer or rather accept a credit / refund of $100 for the fixture and ballast. I base this on the following: The fixture is truly not operational as it is, even though you represented it as NEW and working. It is neither. The Ballast is of unknown and questionable condition. Certainly the Ballast is not worth MORE then what the ballast can be purchased for at a store.

Should you accept option 2, I will be willing to work with you by accepting some of your DIY equipment that you promoted on your website. I will supply the pump, you will supply the large skimmer with full options with injector venture and needle wheel. And a package of the 'fragnets' mixed sizes would be okay.

I base the trade value as to cover your cost for material only. As I would supply the pump, and that being the major cost item on that equipment, your costs for the acrylic and piping should be minimal, (and actually less then the $100 value

Please review this offer and let me know if you any follow up comments or offers.

I appreciate your understanding of my position of not getting the NEW (or even lightly new) items, and actually getting a broken and incompletely / incorrectly modified product.

[/red]

I expected a counter offer, and was willing to negotiate if necessary, but the counter offer I got was a discount of $50 off his $225 skimmer unit.

And since I did not want or need the pumps he includes on his skimmers, and since I did not discount my tiem or the value of what my time was worth, I rejected his counter offer.
  #104  
Old 12/18/2006, 04:34 AM
BubbleMonkeyIII BubbleMonkeyIII is offline
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Burgy how did you plan on hardwiring the power cords of the BW and the T5s to that fixture inside the light, like we discussed over the phone, when you purchased it without CUTTING WIRES???

You knew you had to rewire things inside that fixture going in. I told you this and you agreed to the deal at that point. So the ad is basically MUTE at this point. Since a total REWIRE was verbally AGREED to over the phone and through e mails. the repair is mute the broken wire is mute, You would have to cut and splice them anyways, you knew this, I knew this going in.

And you admit the FIXTURE IS NOT DAMAGED AT ALL, not one burn mark nothing....its IMMACULATE. Only the wiring was an issue because I didnt mention the repair, but if you had to cut it anyways whats the deal???

Also you have to admit, we discussed the potential and need for you to have to cut and splice the new power cords INSIDE The fixture, thus cutting everything in there anyways?? to make the fixture work. Right??

And were informed of this and agreed to this, so how can you complain about a broken wire, I didnt even know about and a wire that was fixed well enough to work even without you touching it, when it was going to be cut anyways?

The only way to avoid this internal wiring situation, would been to somehow haf azz those connectors I so kindly saved for you and spliced them to the connectors I provided OUTSIDE THE LIGHT. And I showed you the DAY you showed up and AFTER you agreed to the DIY nature of the light over the phone PMs and emails..

I told you that this splicing was anOPTION, and probably NOT safe, or the BEST way to do things since its around water. I discussed I planned on doing it the right way, telling you that hardwring it would be better, when we talked
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Last edited by BubbleMonkeyIII; 12/18/2006 at 04:53 AM.
  #105  
Old 12/18/2006, 04:47 AM
BubbleMonkeyIII BubbleMonkeyIII is offline
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E mail sent Yesterday to you Bergy...you declined it? By your response here maybe you never got it? I just resent it.. Thats what pizzed me off, I met your offer and then you declined it..

this is what I wrote to you after the skimmer offer I initially made.

This was a second COUNTER OFFER...send via e mail at 4pm yesterday, and just sent again to you.

"Ok now, heres my counter offer, I will throw in an a 12pack of MED sized fragnets (mounts 6 frags)" ($25.00)

"Finally, Will also kick in ONE 1.5" Standpipe for you so you can show your friend how it works, OK? Just tell me what size you need." ($25.00)

this is what was offered to you ONTOP of the $50.00 off the skimmer.. Didnt you get this??
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Last edited by BubbleMonkeyIII; 12/18/2006 at 05:07 AM.
  #106  
Old 12/18/2006, 04:55 AM
Bergovoy Bergovoy is offline
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clarification

Some would say I love the drama, and that I would bring anything or everything here.

I did not think or chooose to bring tot he forum the issue I had with Benny as believe it or not, I decided to let that one go...

I had / have issue with Benny as he told me he would sell me something. And then he sold it to someone else.

I did not think or chooose to bring this to the forum as believe it or not, I decided to let that one go...

But since Benny seems to feed into the drama and contribure something that is not relative to this specific topic, I will try to do a quick clarification...

I offered to buy something Benney was selling. He seemed to have difficulty getting a buyer, and lowered his asking price, and when he did, I responded, and from what I can read (as you can read for yourself too, as it is still listed in the fs section), no one else responded.

After several messages back and forth, where I agreed to his asking price, and to come to fountain valley, and [blue]he replied that he would go for that[/blue], I asked for his address.

he did not respond for 30 hours, and when he did, he indicated that is was already sold to someone else
.

I had during that time bought other items, not from this forum... and had a chance to buy the same item benny was selling. (it was out in Oxnard where I was picking up a chiller, (that was new, but was advertised as in 'possibly' new as he did not test it out) I had to decline as I had already told Benny I would buy his barrel.

When I came back home, and later that night at 11pm, benny posted a message indicating that he sold the barrel to someone else.

When I questioned him on it, he replied by insultingme, and calling me names. He indicated that I lowballed him.

I offerd to pay him exactly what he was asking for the barrel, he had lowerd the price prior to my replying to him.

He asked for me to show him where he agreed to sell it to me, and I quoted the thread, (where you can read for yourself) where he agreed to the deal.

There were no other potential buyers messages's on the thread, there were no messages from benny indicating a pending sale, nothing...

Was I upset, yes. Can he choose who he wants to sell it to, yes, can he change his mind, certainly.

But why would he or anyone do so, then insult the potential buyer. I think ther eis a lack of understanding of what the other party is understanding or expecting. and with that, a defensive action to become offensive to try to justify or somehow feel good about his decision to change his mind...

Either way, the issue was not that big of a deal, and as some might think, no need for me to make a drama out of that issue, (until benny decides to bring it up in an unrelated thread)

But as some have pointed out, some people will attack the accuser of being the magnet to crime or issues, rather then focus on the actually problem or source.

do I need to be more careful, certainly, do I need to drop issues after being wronged, depends on the issue and the valuation and the potential repercussion of perpetuating it

Bottom line, I have no control of what others do to me.

If you or anyone chooses to not report or to to not tell others of your misfortunes that would be your choice.

I chose to bring up the light fixture issue after haveing the Benny issue, and then Bubbles issue the very next day...

Seems like the pattern is not necessarily me, but rather REEFCENTRAL, as they are a magnet to those that have no sense of common courtesy or respect

AND BENNY??? My comment to you in my last message still stands... It is apparent, my word and honor means more to me then yours. (and all for $20.)

And even if it were for $1, I do what I say I am going to do. My name is on everyting I do.


Quote:
Originally posted by bennyinca
First of all, let me say that I read the thread and do not see phatphisher or ginasofia making excuses for the seller. I am not going to either, but I believe this needs to be handled by themselves, it is not going anywhere here. They each have their own side of the story, and buyer and seller should be responsible for their actions. As a seller you should ad your product honestly, and a seller you should not buy anything unless you are comfortable with it. I also think that as a buyer, if you want a new product and warranties that go with it, then you ought to be buying from a retailer.

However, if you sense a mixed reaction in this thread, I believe it may be because some people have already dealt with bergovoy, like I have in PM. Or maybe you have heard. Anyways I think he has built a reputation for himself. His PMs are down right abusive, and for that reason I chose to cease replying to him. After my exp in dealing with him, I'd rather give away things for free than selling to him. Just my .02

btw I do hope you get your $ back. But like I said in a previous post, there was enough info in his FS post to keep an educated buyer away
  #107  
Old 12/18/2006, 04:58 AM
BubbleMonkeyIII BubbleMonkeyIII is offline
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And the offer to refund you full price, is now on the table for all to see again. Because Im thinking you MISSED MY second offer and that doesnt make me so mad now.

I just resent the email AGAIN forwarded it. Please check your inbox to verify the time and date.

If the Ballast and Cords are UNUSED and I can verify this, and no other damage to the light, I will repay totally you on MY next PAYDAY, which is the 1st. the TOTAL upon reciept of the goods in same condition as you got them. No harm no foul.

You can keep the free standpipe

I just couldnt figure out why you rejected my offer of over $100.00 worth of goods which you suggested as a FAIR TRADE? Maybe you still do reject it, and thats fine, and maybe you just didnt want to say in here. But I did offer it. Im saying this because you posted above I ONLY offered you $50.00 off a skimmer. Which is just not true. I offfered you $100.00 worth of stuff YOU ASKED for.

Heck, ill even throw in a few frags of something for ya. and some macros for your sump... I just thought you were being a jerk after I met your offer and you declined and harrassed me about it. end of story.

I will then relist it for more money as "USED" hahahah
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Last edited by BubbleMonkeyIII; 12/18/2006 at 05:11 AM.
  #108  
Old 12/18/2006, 05:10 AM
BubbleMonkeyIII BubbleMonkeyIII is offline
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Well what do you say???
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  #109  
Old 12/18/2006, 05:15 AM
BubbleMonkeyIII BubbleMonkeyIII is offline
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Quote:
Originally posted by Bergovoy
I made a proposal to him after he admitted he performed surgery and failed to tell me about it.

Since that proposal was an email to him from me, I am at liberty to cut and paste it here as I have not issue with my information being public. (so here is the complete text of the proposal)

[red]
So, here are the choices as I present them to you, You may in fact refuse them all, or you may in fact stand up and take responsibility for the misrepresentations of those items:

I have already paid $250 for both items, the (NEW and Working Fixture) and the New and Working Ballast

Option 1. You can take the equipment back and give me a full refund or

Option 2. I will offer or rather accept a credit / refund of $100 for the fixture and ballast. I base this on the following: The fixture is truly not operational as it is, even though you represented it as NEW and working. It is neither. The Ballast is of unknown and questionable condition. Certainly the Ballast is not worth MORE then what the ballast can be purchased for at a store.

Should you accept option 2, I will be willing to work with you by accepting some of your DIY equipment that you promoted on your website. I will supply the pump, you will supply the large skimmer with full options with injector venture and needle wheel. And a package of the 'fragnets' mixed sizes would be okay.

I base the trade value as to cover your cost for material only. As I would supply the pump, and that being the major cost item on that equipment, your costs for the acrylic and piping should be minimal, (and actually less then the $100 value

Please review this offer and let me know if you any follow up comments or offers.

I appreciate your understanding of my position of not getting the NEW (or even lightly new) items, and actually getting a broken and incompletely / incorrectly modified product.

[/red]

I expected a counter offer, and was willing to negotiate if necessary, but the counter offer I got was a discount of $50 off his $225 skimmer unit.

And since I did not want or need the pumps he includes on his skimmers, and since I did not discount my tiem or the value of what my time was worth, I rejected his counter offer.
Bergy I SENT an email with COUNTER OFFER AGREEING to your options at 4am 16th..., see the posts above.. I just RESENT the email to you. your rejection of the offer later that night, (when it come to me) is what made me think you were INSANE and impossible to deal with. I had given up at that point.

The fact of the matter was I Sent the $50.00 email off my skimmer BEFORE you even requested that in your first offer e mail. check the time of that e mail youll see this. I also said that in the forwarded e mail mentioned above.

From what I read in your e mails, and lack of response, that I gave you what you asked for and yet you declined it??

This is assuming you got the e mail? Did you get it or MISS it?

If you didnt get this second offer somehow, then I say the offer still stands I would be glad to meet what you requested in option 2DIY, and said so yesterday.

Also I think that pump I offered you with the skimmer, will easily overpower a 12" chamber (my stock size) as I had to increase my chambers to 16" to handle a 4100. which is the next size up. We can also talk about upgrading your exchange, but it would be more than $175.00 for that one as that 4100 pump is approx 80$ alone, and the chamber would need to be customized to at LEAST 16" H.

At 16" its BARELY able to handle it. The gen Xs puts out a lot of flow. even with the NW. I will be offering the Genx smaller versions on my 22" for just this reason, and this offer and size pump change had NOTHING to do with you.

I resent the e mail so please look for it.

Be honest if you missed it, cuz it was sent.. Please, MAN UP, and if you did get it, then why not say so in here? It was sent a 4am 16th of Dec. check the time stamp

Because this is rejection and non receipt or acknowledgement on your part is what started this WHOLE THING, esp this mess in here. If you never got it, then it was no ones fault just the net.

Last edited by BubbleMonkeyIII; 12/18/2006 at 05:40 AM.
  #110  
Old 12/18/2006, 05:39 AM
bennyinca bennyinca is offline
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Re: clarification

Quote:
Originally posted by Bergovoy
I had / have issue with Benny as he told me he would sell me something.
I urge you to post where I commited to sell an item to you. You showed interest like many other and I replied to your inquiry. Never I told you an item was sold or pending to you.

Quote:

I did not think or chooose to bring this to the forum as believe it or not, I decided to let that one go...

So you let that one go, heh? After your multiple insults and abusive language PMs I see. I chose not to reply to your harrassing PM.

Quote:

But since Benny seems to feed into the drama and contribure something that is not relative to this specific topic, I will try to do a quick clarification...


Oh yeah I love drama. That is what I do at RC, check my post history. Then check yours.

Quote:

I offered to buy something Benney was selling. He seemed to have difficulty getting a buyer, and lowered his asking price, and when he did, I responded, and from what I can read (as you can read for yourself too, as it is still listed in the fs section), no one else responded.

Hmm there is such thing called private message

Quote:

After several messages back and forth, where I agreed to his asking price, and to come to fountain valley, and [blue]he replied that he would go for that[/blue], I asked for his address.

Again, I urge you to post where we agreed on anything. There were no messages back and forth on this. I only replied to your post.


Quote:

...
When I questioned him on it, he replied by insultingme, and calling me names. He indicated that I lowballed him.

Again, I urge you to post anything I said about you. I know what kind of person I am, so if you want to take at shot at me, be ready to back it up.

I'll post your insults from your PM if you'd like.

Quote:

I offerd to pay him exactly what he was asking for the barrel, he had lowerd the price prior to my replying to him.

You did not. This is your "offer", as posted in
http://archive.reefcentral.com/forum...08#post8756008 . And I do consider this lowballing.

Quote:
Originally posted by Bergovoy
So, since we are coming from opposite ends of So Cal, how about we meet in the middle, geographically and financially??


Quote:
...
AND BENNY??? My comment to you in my last message still stands... It is apparent, my word and honor means more to me then yours. (and all for $20.)
Haha what do you take people for, don't make me laugh. Honor and you do not belong in the same sentence. I would believe a shady used car salesman (no pun intended ) before I believe you. For starters, why don't you back up your claims and show where and when you were insulted?

Yeah, my comment still stands, I would rather give an item away for free, than to sell it to you. keep your $.
  #111  
Old 12/18/2006, 05:44 AM
BubbleMonkeyIII BubbleMonkeyIII is offline
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wow benny,

would you believe me? and buy something from ME now? ahhaha... I got a nice "USED slighted repaired" light and NEW IN BOX NEVER USED or touched ballast for sale... (if bergy brings it back and didnt mess with it)

Or now that its famous on here? anyone else want it NOW? Same price. $250.00 for $500.00 worth of products.. But the Extra $100.00 of free stuff is withdrawn for any new buyers.

Please do this soon, so I can PAY HIM BACK. hahaha

Just dont freak on me after the sale.. thats all I ask...

thanks

hahahaha

ps it will take some HEAVY DIY Wiring to make it work, and that is INSIDE THE fixture, I also repaired ONE loose wire I found when It first came to me.. slightly discombobulated, so check on that one BEFORE YOU CUT IT to attach the new ballast wires to it Also according to Bergy, youll need to cut the splice he made in the loose wire to RECONNECT a T5 ballast to it again. Thus cutting a cut wire 2x...before you can power it up.

There hows that..? Any takers? hehehe
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  #112  
Old 12/18/2006, 05:53 AM
bennyinca bennyinca is offline
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Location: Southern OC, CA
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Quote:
Originally posted by BubbleMonkeyIII
wow benny,

would you believe me? and buy something from ME now? ahhaha... I got a nice "USED slighted repaired" light and NEW IN BOX NEVER USED or touched ballast for sale... (if bergy dont bring it back)

Or now that its famous? anyone else want it NOW?

so I can PAY HIM BACK?

Just dont freak on me after the sale.. thanks

hahahaha

ps it will take some HEAVY DIY WIring to make it work, and that is INSIDE THE fixture, I also repaired ONE loose wire I found when It first came to me.. so check on that one..

There hows that..? hehehe
Don't take me wrong, I am not saying that what you did is justified. But you are taking responsibility for it now and offering a refund, I think that is the right thing to do, and I applaud you for it.

Honestly, as a buyer, I would not take you lights because they have been rigged and arc'd. I am not an electrician and handy enough to fix something like it. For that reason I would not buy it. My suggestion? Fix it, and sell it as a working light fixture.

As a seller, knowing what I know now, I would choose not to deal with him. I can just imagine how he would post a complaint, about how the drums he just purchased smells too much like plastic
  #113  
Old 12/18/2006, 06:13 AM
BubbleMonkeyIII BubbleMonkeyIII is offline
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The light fixture never arced.. Only the BALLAST housing and that was probably due to something in the ballast being loose (nut screw or something else known to happen with them) Fixture is as adverstised. GREAT SHAPE.

Nothing is burned at all in the fixture, even Bergy says that, but if you had contacted me to buy it saying what you just said about NOT being handy. I would not have SOLD it to you in the first place as I KNEW how MUCH DIY work it was going to take to make it work correctly. Ask Bergy if I asked him about his "skills"
for just this reason. I did and he knows it.

The ad was wrong, after the fact, I saw that and admit it.

But what everyone in here doesnt KNOW is that in all the communications I had with him after he said he wanted it, I stressed the NEED of the fixture to rewire the fixtures with the new cords thus CUTTING everything in there to set it up. no light task!

He said he could do it, I took his word on it. Maybe he couldnt do it now, and realizes that now and wants to back out.

but blaming it on wires that were broken and repaired knowing all i know about the deal was just weak to me, as he ALREADY KNEW he needed to CUT all this anyways resplice them to the new power wires to make the thing work

I was just trying to go the EXTRA mile in my offers for free stuff to him, since the ad was misleading. But I can promise you he UNDERSTOOD that light was NOT READY TO GO... just ready to plug and play kind of thing. He knew it needed MASSIVE Electrical and rewiring work internally and externally just to make it work with the new T5 ballast (which he would provide) and the BW7 I sold him.
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  #114  
Old 12/18/2006, 06:28 AM
bennyinca bennyinca is offline
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BubbleMonkeyIII, just to clarify, I am not trying to put your light fixture down. I am saying that I would not be able to handle the DYI task. I don't doubt you would mention (the obvious) to a buyer that there is work involved before the light is operational. To me, it is logical that a buyer would be picking up your DYI project and finish it.

Well that is besides the point. I am glad to see there is some progress going on, good luck to you both.
  #115  
Old 12/18/2006, 06:34 AM
Bergovoy Bergovoy is offline
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your counter offer ??/

I have no issues with MANNING up, and if you dare imply that or anyother durogatory remark aagain, I will definately terminate our conversations as they will not be positive nor productive.

I did recieve that email on the date and time you indicate. It came at the same time as two other emails from you. I replied to that email along with the other two emails in one reply.

To try to summerize:

This 'counter-offer' adds onto your first offer where you 'discounted' a skimmer product by $50 off your advertised price. The skimmer also included a pump, which was undersized by 300+ gph, as indicated by comparing the other skimmers you show on your site. A quick search on the internet shows the difference in price for that pump compared to teh other pumps you list on your site to be less then half pricel (more then $40 difference).

So in essence, you give me a refund of $50, but give me a smaller less expensive pump. Does not sound like you are giving me anything so far...

Also, as I indicated in my original email where I asked for a settelment to be made, I dont want or need a pump, nor did I think it appropriate for you to go out of pocket to settle this issue. Except for material for the unit itself.

I figured that I would be out a couple of hours to research and fix all that was wrog with the fixture, and that you should expend about the same amount of time to construct a skimmer.

A couple of horus for a couple of hours. Should be as simple as that.

I also told you I do not want your standpipe. The device you gave me you called it a prototype and as such it was not refined, or cleaned. You cut the inlet hole in the riser with a hack saw or something, and you have the riser reduced toa 3/4" tube. I told you I did not want i but you strongly ureged for me to tatke it to show my friend. He has seen it, still likes the idea, and wuold have contributed you your something to your coffers for your concept and effort, but with all things considreed, he has since declined your services.

So, your second counter offer does not add anything to the mix. except a pack of magnets, which you value at $30 for 18 magnets. I would geuss the magents are about a quarter of an inch.

So, I start off by asking fo a $100 credit, and in return I get to buy a skimmer for essentially full price, (the discounto of $50 is offset by the substitution of a smaller pump), and a bag of magnets for $30, (or about $1.66 per magnet). Iactully just bought a sack of magnets from Lowes over the weekend for $5

So, as I wrote in my emailed reply, (whichis where I was when you were being so patient)

The counter offer is again not accepted as it is not the same or close to what I had originally proposed.

And for clarification to future offers: please lets remove the exchange of your skimmer equipment from the deal. That will just complicate the situation as you have now tried to swithc or substitute parts or sizes to somehow make it more palitti\ble for you...(you are trying to reduce your cost by reducing the worth or value of the equipment you are trying to trade me...

I am pleased that you are at least trying to resolve this through negotiations. that is very positive and will hopefully be productive.

And although we just concluded the original transaction last week, I understand you did not set that moey aside and is not available to you in the event we do come to satisfactory conclusion.

Should we come to a satisfactory settlement that includes reimbursing me th full or partial amount of money, I will be willing to work with you to defer the payments to either your next payday or until next year, after the holidays.

(although I am positive you owe me money, I am not without heart during the holiday season. I mearly will want whatever agreement we make to be documented and signed.

And with the availability of funds being an issue, I would strongly suggest you take my offer for a partial refund of the money I have already paid you. That way you do not have to come up with the full amount, and have to wait to sell it again before you get more money.

Please let know what your intentions are so I may anticipate and evaluate my options.

sincerely,


bill


Quote:
Originally posted by BubbleMonkeyIII
Bergy I SENT an email with COUNTER OFFER AGREEING to your options at 4am 16th..., see the posts above.. I just RESENT the email to you. your rejection of the offer later that night, (when it come to me) is what made me think you were INSANE and impossible to deal with. I had given up at that point.

The fact of the matter was I Sent the $50.00 email off my skimmer BEFORE you even requested that in your first offer e mail. check the time of that e mail youll see this. I also said that in the forwarded e mail mentioned above.
  #116  
Old 12/18/2006, 06:58 AM
BubbleMonkeyIII BubbleMonkeyIII is offline
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Posts: 164
refund

Bergy,

Ya there was a mix up in the e mails causing that misunderstanding, no ones fault, no worries there just didnt understand your responses about it being $50.00 only in your posting above is all, when I KNOW i offered you $100.00 worth of stuff in good faith.

I dont trust HOTMAIL anyways, stuff gets lost with that account, people never get stuff sometimes...I noticed it was sent via my hotmail account vs my more reliable pop mail.

As for the skimmer ALL my skimmers will have the smaller pumps on them from now on, Im changing that out when I realized just a few days ago they made a smaller pump that should work great with the stock size 22". Though the site doesnt reflect this it will shortly. if you doubt me visit it later this week.

No thanks on the $100.00 off..

I really sold it too cheap anyways to be honest.. I paid over 400$ for the light itself with ballast, and basically $300.00 for the ballast if you include the cords. Throw out the junk ballast I pitched and its really about $600.00 worth of eqiupment if NEW. hehe. (not going there now) Granted its used so its not worth that much, but I think its worth more than the price of the ballast for both.

Even though I veiw it as UN-USED, I will have to list it as USED because of my repair and being given to you now too, though its never been USED for over 5 min on my end at least. And I dont think you powered it up at all have you???


Now I will try and resell it, as U S E D DIY PROJECT or something.

Might even wire it up myself to that HQI ballast. and sell it as HQI TESTED READY TO GO or something at least as far as the HQIs are concerned. Not sure what to do with the T5 ballasts, I might put them in the light fixture, I donno.

I would have done that connection months ago, except I was trying to get a refund on the Ballast until just a week ago and didnt want to use that ballast(Sunligh supply refused even though it was not used due to the time frame)

One thing is for sure I will list it's HISTORY and WIRING NEEDS in the AD, vs over the phone on e mails. Then there is NO argument.

See you on the first and thanks for giving me some time to get ALL the funds ready for full refund.

But you havent answered one other important question before the deal is sealed, have you POWERED UP or used that BW7 BALLAST and used those wires for bw7 I sold you?

If not please reply with this infor and you got a deal, no hard feelings I hope sorry for the misunderstandings.

merry xmas to all and all a good night!

peace out
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To say that there are no absolutes, is, in itself, and absolute.....

Last edited by BubbleMonkeyIII; 12/18/2006 at 07:24 AM.
  #117  
Old 12/18/2006, 07:16 AM
BubbleMonkeyIII BubbleMonkeyIII is offline
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Posts: 164
Quote:
Originally posted by bennyinca
BubbleMonkeyIII, just to clarify, I am not trying to put your light fixture down. I am saying that I would not be able to handle the DYI task. I don't doubt you would mention (the obvious) to a buyer that there is work involved before the light is operational. To me, it is logical that a buyer would be picking up your DYI project and finish it.

Well that is besides the point. I am glad to see there is some progress going on, good luck to you both.

Lol I wa kidding bean,

Ya I understand, actually the light is built pretty good. Very solid case and nice looking, My figurings were that the ballast were crap but how bad could the WIRING be in the actual fixture?.. I guess I learned that lesson the hard way.. hehehe...

I also figured in my head, if it was bad, I would jus gut it. Still cheaper than buying the individual parts by my calculations even doing that. Other lights in this category are about 800$. Granted with better reflectors maybe, but with that Ballast it was comperable to a TEK light with new bulbs and such. The ballasts, bulbs, reflectors make the light. The case is just the case but it should be build well, and look good, which this one is.
  #118  
Old 12/18/2006, 07:44 AM
Bergovoy Bergovoy is offline
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Re: Re: clarification

Quote:
Originally posted by bennyinca
I urge you to post where I commited to sell an item to you. You showed interest like many other and I replied to your inquiry. Never I told you an item was sold or pending to you.

[/b]
[BLUE]laverda got me these 55g drums at his cost, and I am willing to pass the same good deal to another club member.

that said, I understand the challenges in this hobby, especially when you are starting off. I am more than willing to help on the cost of it, after all we are not talking about bank breaking $ here. But if you want them you must be willing to come by pick it up yourself.[/BLUE]
Quote:



Oh yeah I love drama. That is what I do at RC, check my post history. Then check yours.
No need to check, I only have to read this thread to see where you create the drama by bringing your issue with me into a thread that has nothing to do with you at all. If you believe you dont do drama , how is it that you bring up our issue and think you wont get a reply and or perpetuate it
Quote:


Hmm there is such thing called private message

Funny, how it is ettiquette to let someone know that you send them PM in the open forum, and then if you agree to a sale, that you send out a notice in public forum that there is a sale pending.

And if you did recieve a PM during the time that you say you did, then you would have seen my message to you which I sent less then 1/2 hour after you stated that you agreed to sell me the barrel for the same price as SCMAS members. Did you choose to just ignore my message then?
Quote:



Again, I urge you to post where we agreed on anything. There were no messages back and forth on this. I only replied to your post.


http://reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&postid=8756008#post8756008
Quote:
Again, I urge you to post anything I said about you. I know what kind of person I am, so if you want to take at shot at me, be ready to back it up.

I'll post your insults from your PM if you'd like.

[/b]
Funny, I gues you are the only who can trade insults then, for if someone else replies with an instult then they are the one out of line and or innapropriate. You can post what ever you want. As I stated previously, I am not afraid of or ashamed or anything I say or do. Does that mean I would not take back some things or apologize sometimes, NO IF I am wrong,I would apologize. How about you???
Quote:
You did not. This is your "offer", as posted in
http://archive.reefcentral.com/forum...08#post8756008 . And I do consider this lowballing.

[/b]
The one thing I learned early on in life is that anyone can interpret anything anyway they like. If you want to think that my giving you the exact same amount of money that you ask for, and for me to pickup from wherever you want me to to pickup is lowballing then by all means, go ahead and iterpret that to mean lowballing.

Oh, and for future edification, when I say Hello BennyInca, you should interpret that to mean '... Go eff yourself ...'
Quote:

Haha what do you take people for, don't make me laugh. Honor and you do not belong in the same sentence. I would believe a shady used car salesman (no pun intended ) before I believe you. For starters, why don't you back up your claims and show where and when you were insulted?
You have already admitted to calling me a lowballer. Is that close to an insult in your interpretation of insults???

Then you turn around and tell me you are trying to sell the barrel for $15, when I already offered you $20. I am not sure you can understand your own logic/
Quote:


Yeah, my comment still stands, I would rather give an item away for free, than to sell it to you. keep your $.
My comments stand as well. And like before as I stated to another poster, I will refrain (again, I know, sorry), from replying to those that are not here to contribute to this thread. I may be eating out of the drama plate, but it seems it is you that is serving it up. I need to go on a drama free diet, and let you all choke on the drama that you must be purchasing from some bulk warehouse where you seem to get bulk rate prices
  #119  
Old 12/18/2006, 08:17 AM
Bergovoy Bergovoy is offline
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Re: refund

I have not turned on, or plugged in the BLue Wave.

I have not turned anything on.

Teh only thing I did was to open the fixture to try to figure out which connector went to which lamp as they are not labeled.

I did repair the T5 wire that was caught and broken in between the end cap and fixture body.

Do you want to draft up an agreement to refund the equipment and money, or do you want me to do that?

You do not need to explain about your finances, just let me know when and what payment arrangments you wuld like to make.

All that can be done via regular email channels.

Quote:
Originally posted by BubbleMonkeyIII
Bergy,

Ya there was a mix up in the e mails causing that misunderstanding, no ones fault, no worries there just didnt understand your responses about it being $50.00 only in your posting above is all, when I KNOW i offered you $100.00 worth of stuff in good faith.

I dont trust HOTMAIL anyways, stuff gets lost with that account, people never get stuff sometimes...I noticed it was sent via my hotmail account vs my more reliable pop mail.

As for the skimmer ALL my skimmers will have the smaller pumps on them from now on, Im changing that out when I realized just a few days ago they made a smaller pump that should work great with the stock size 22". Though the site doesnt reflect this it will shortly. if you doubt me visit it later this week.

No thanks on the $100.00 off..

I really sold it too cheap anyways to be honest.. I paid over 400$ for the light itself with ballast, and basically $300.00 for the ballast if you include the cords. Throw out the junk ballast I pitched and its really about $600.00 worth of eqiupment if NEW. hehe. (not going there now) Granted its used so its not worth that much, but I think its worth more than the price of the ballast for both.

Even though I veiw it as UN-USED, I will have to list it as USED because of my repair and being given to you now too, though its never been USED for over 5 min on my end at least. And I dont think you powered it up at all have you???


Now I will try and resell it, as U S E D DIY PROJECT or something.

Might even wire it up myself to that HQI ballast. and sell it as HQI TESTED READY TO GO or something at least as far as the HQIs are concerned. Not sure what to do with the T5 ballasts, I might put them in the light fixture, I donno.

I would have done that connection months ago, except I was trying to get a refund on the Ballast until just a week ago and didnt want to use that ballast(Sunligh supply refused even though it was not used due to the time frame)

One thing is for sure I will list it's HISTORY and WIRING NEEDS in the AD, vs over the phone on e mails. Then there is NO argument.

See you on the first and thanks for giving me some time to get ALL the funds ready for full refund.

But you havent answered one other important question before the deal is sealed, have you POWERED UP or used that BW7 BALLAST and used those wires for bw7 I sold you?

If not please reply with this infor and you got a deal, no hard feelings I hope sorry for the misunderstandings.

merry xmas to all and all a good night!

peace out
  #120  
Old 12/18/2006, 09:22 AM
bennyinca bennyinca is offline
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Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Southern OC, CA
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Re: Re: Re: clarification

Quote:
[b]Originally posted by Bergovoy
Oh, and for future edification, when I say Hello BennyInca, you should interpret that to mean '... Go eff yourself ...'

There you go doing what you do best.. you go boy.

Quote:
Originally posted by Bergovoy
... You have already admitted to calling me a lowballer. Is that close to an insult in your interpretation of insults???
Your initial offer to lowball me to meet you halfway on cost AND distance was never accepted. Never said sold to you. If I must spell it out to you, I said you should be willing to pick up items yourself when you want to buy something.

So, I AM STILL CALLING YOU TO BACK UP YOUR WORDS. When did I ever call you names or insult you. Or your admitting to your lowballing really hurts your feelings?

Do you want me to post your PMs filled with harrassment?
  #121  
Old 12/18/2006, 09:30 AM
gtrestoration gtrestoration is offline
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To heck with Dr. Phil, lets get action.

SteveU
  #122  
Old 12/18/2006, 09:45 AM
mhurley mhurley is offline
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Join Date: Oct 1999
Location: Naperville, IL
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Quote:
Originally posted by Bergovoy
Certainly it is between me and him.
Exactly correct.

I simply cannot believe that this drama has gone on for 5 pages.

Resolve this issue between the two of you, the police department or small claims court. RC is not your dispute resolution venue.

I'm moving this to the Feedback Forum where it should have been in the first place and closing it.

Move on.
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Last edited by mhurley; 12/18/2006 at 12:41 PM.
 

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