Calling all younger reefers

[LeftCoast]

I actually have cried when I found a dead fish in my aquarium...my sister said "it's just a fish". I said she was stupid and that she would've cried if one of her cats died (this was probably when I was ten/five years ago).

[kyman_33]

She is right. They are just fish. I mean, I like my fish, but not enough to cry over the death of one.

A cat is a quite a bit different from a fish. Cats have much more intelligence and show far more affection than fish. Do you ever pet your fish? Do your fish sit on your lap? Do your fish sleep with you?

Much easier for people to become attached to a cat. Therefore, much easier for them to become sad over the death of the cat.

But a fish. You just look at it and feed it? I could do the same thing to a plant. And I don't cry when plants die.

Sorry, I think it is "sad", but no to the extent to be affected in a way such as to cry.

Also, sorry for your loss. I bet he was one cool cat. I mean fish.

[tsquad]

Actually, my fish do show affection. My Foxface recognizes me. If I come near the tank alone, he will swim out and follow me. Whenever anyone else comes around, he'll go bezerk. And as a matter of fact, I have pet him. Took me a while to learn how to do it, with his spines and all, but he lets me touch his head when I'm feeding now. I mean, yeah, cats are A LOT more personable and affectionate than fish, but fish aren't just creatures that swim in your box and get fed. At least in my case.

[kyman_33]

Just look at the difference in brain size. Even if you pet your fish, it's not like he enjoys it. Does your fish purr (sp?) when you pet it? I don't think that fish can recognize "one" person, either. They just realize the human presence and act accordingly. They do so because they associate us with food. Why do you think ducks and seagulls return to beachs? It is survival for them to come to their source of food.

[LeftCoast]

I agree with Tyler. That and my sister's cats ate fish out of our fish tank. They have personality, but there are both positive and negative sides to cats having "personality".

[kyman_33]

A plant almost has as much personality as a fish. Especially carnivrous plants.

[FalsePerc]

Originally posted by kyman_33
A plant almost has as much personality as a fish. Especially carnivrous plants.

Do you have citations/sources to back up this statement? Because I have plenty to disprove it.

http://www.aquahobby.com/articles/e_intelligence.php
http://www-psy.ucsd.edu/~jgoodson/GoodsonHB2004a.pdf
http://www.learner.org/discoveringps...e04expand.html
http://bio.classes.ucsc.edu/bio137/p...s/Behavior.ppt


And books:

Burgess, Warren E. 1974. The real Oscar rediscovered. TFH 2/74.

Kullander, S.O. & H. Njissen, The Cichlids of Surinam (Teleostei: Labroidei). E.J. Brill. The Netherlands. 1989.

Leibel, Wayne S. 1993. A Fishkeeper's Guide to South American Cichlids. Tetra Press, Blacksburg, VA.

Loiselle, Paul V. 1985. The Cichlid Aquarium. Tetra Press, Melle Germany.

Loiselle, Paul V. 1998. AFM 7/98. and Loiselle, Paul V. 2001. 10/01.

[tsquad]

Kyle, brain size has nothing to do with anything. A dolphins brain is larger than a humans, yet we are much more intelligent/"personable." http://dubinserver.colorado.edu/prj/jbes03/brain.html

[kyman_33]

Nerd.

I am sure there are plenty of studies and professional opinions to back it up. I'm just to lazy to research it because this is a pointless argument. It's not as if I am going to change your guy's mind on the issue.

But I can still laugh when you cry over a fish. Not that I should since that would be coldhearted.

[FalsePerc]

Cry over the death of a fish? My fish don't die, so I'd not know.

[kyman_33]

Originally posted by tsquad
Kyle, brain size has nothing to do with anything. A dolphins brain is larger than a humans, yet we are much more intelligent/"personable." http://dubinserver.colorado.edu/prj/jbes03/brain.html

BUT.....

Brain size does matter in the sense that if a brain were so small it were to be non-existent there coudl be no intelligence. Therefore, there would have to be some brain for intelligence to exist.

[tsquad]

I don't cry. I feel no pain

I mean, yeah, fish die. [expletive] happens. But to say that a fish is similiar in personality to a plant is just stupid.

[FalsePerc]

Originally posted by tsquad
Kyle, brain size has nothing to do with anything. A dolphins brain is larger than a humans, yet we are much more intelligent/"personable." http://dubinserver.colorado.edu/prj/jbes03/brain.html

But yet dolphins are more "dolphinable."

[tsquad]

Right. Fish have brains. Thus intelligence. As does a cat. And like I said/showed, brain size is irrelevent.

[FalsePerc]

Originally posted by kyman_33
BUT.....

Brain size does matter in the sense that if a brain were so small it were to be non-existent there coudl be no intelligence. Therefore, there would have to be some brain for intelligence to exist.

This could be translated into an argument about body size...

Tyler: Body size does not matter. There are bugs and there are human,s both carry on life functions, and, therefore, live.
Kyle: But it does matter in the sense that if a body were so small it would be nonexistant!
Mike:

[FalsePerc]

Originally posted by kyman_33
I am sure there are plenty of studies and professional opinions to back it up.

I doube there have been comparative analyses of fish vs. carnivorous plants in terms of personality.

[kyman_33]

Originally posted by FalsePerc
This could be translated into an argument about body size...

Tyler: Body size does not matter. There are bugs and there are human,s both carry on life functions, and, therefore, live.
Kyle: But it does matter in the sense that if a body were so small it would be nonexistant!
Mike:

Way to slaughter re-quoting me.

[kyman_33]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brain_to_body_mass_ratio

That's all the research I'm doing on this.

[tsquad]

I love how CAYR has been slightly revived by us debating about fish personalities

[kyman_33]

Well, one more link from the same site:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neurosc...d_intelligence

This does state that brain size doesn't matter in intelligence, BUT larger brains tend to be more intelligent. It says TEND which means most of the time. So in a rare case such as the Dolphin you are right. But most of the time such as an Ant compared to Human, I am right.

So we are both right....

[tsquad]

Yes, we are both right. But back to the original topic...to say that a fish has as much personality as a plant is slightly ridiculous.

[kyman_33]

No it's not, but I have to go shower right now. When I return, I shall defend my analogy.

[tsquad]

Ok, please do so.

[Kamko]

Originally posted by tsquad
I'm proud of my position


Actually I manage with three girls, two of them being good looking.

Nothing to be proud of...now, if you managed the girl's cheerleading team...

[tsquad]

The girls cheerleaders are very very ugly. All the hot girls are: field hockey players, soccer players, jazz dancers.