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  #51  
Old 06/28/2007, 11:52 PM
token token is offline
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Quote:
Originally posted by ReefArtist
After talking to Joe - the plan would be to have a Tee at the input to the skimmer - one going into the skimmer and the other as an overflow that would go directly into the sump. Any other ideas on this?
The only consideration I would have is flow to the skimmer; what happens if...? The inside diameter of plumbing gets smaller with age and this will affect the flow to the skimmer. IME, this is one reason to use flexible PVC, as it can be more easily "cleaned" internally. weatherson documents this rather well on his site, weatherson.com.

I, too, am inclined to gravity-feed and if I do I will be sure to install either a grossly oversized drain line to minimize flow restriction or install flexible PVC, as I have now. My only hesitation is that it seems that gravity-fed skimmers could be more susceptible to flow irregularities.
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  #52  
Old 06/29/2007, 06:14 AM
ReefArtist ReefArtist is offline
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Token - very good advice, I haven't started the stand or purchased the materials, so I have no problem revisiting the design. I'm always open to suggestions (I maybe an engineer but wood/plumbing is not my forte ) I’m going to take a look at your suggestions and see if I can decipher – we’ll see what I come up with. Later today I’ll have a new design and we’ll see if it can withstand hurricanes .
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  #53  
Old 06/29/2007, 06:19 AM
ReefArtist ReefArtist is offline
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Also, something that I did not mention - I plan to use either screws or bolts to hold this stand together. I very seldom us nails for anything.
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  #54  
Old 06/29/2007, 08:37 AM
maxalmon maxalmon is offline
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Thats going to be one heavy tank, are they using 3/4 starfire?
  #55  
Old 06/29/2007, 08:47 AM
token token is offline
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Something occurred to me as I read your reply; the grade change from garage to viewing will make a 2 x X at the bottom (to stop the splaying) all but impossible. Three-quarter plywood could be used on both ends, cut to the shape of the end (37" x 40", garage side; 37" x 34" viewing side). With this application, all you would need to do is shorten the other long-side horizontal members by 1.5".

In fact, the more I think about it, it's probably much easier too.

Good luck!
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  #56  
Old 06/29/2007, 09:21 AM
ReefArtist ReefArtist is offline
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Also this is going to be framed in not just open in my living room. Two bookshelves built in and connecting to the stand, with built in cabinets also connecting to the stand. To me this is not going anywhere but . . . I am looking at all angles of your message to be sure. My only thought is on the garage side but I can frame it out with 2x6's at the bottom and if need be frame it out - which as I think about it would look nice and finished.

My original plan was to sandwich plywood between the 2x6's - but I really didn't understand the reasoning for this and dismissed it. I'd noticed this in a number of builds - but they never really explained the why's. The 4x6's will be flush with the 2x6 and then bolted together.

Thanks for all your input!
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  #57  
Old 06/29/2007, 05:31 PM
token token is offline
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Quote:
Originally posted by ReefArtist
Also this is going to be framed in not just open in my living room. Two bookshelves built in and connecting to the stand, with built in cabinets also connecting to the stand. To me this is not going anywhere but . . . I am looking at all angles of your message to be sure.
I would tend to agree but where I don't is that the side walls of your bookcases may not provide anything to which to, securely or easily, attach your stand.
Quote:
My only thought is on the garage side but I can frame it out with 2x6's at the bottom and if need be frame it out - which as I think about it would look nice and finished.
This works for me, if I understand it correctly.

Quote:
My original plan was to sandwich plywood between the 2x6's - but I really didn't understand the reasoning for this and dismissed it. I'd noticed this in a number of builds - but they never really explained the why's. The 4x6's will be flush with the 2x6 and then bolted together.
Sandwiching, often, is just plain overkill but it can accomplish one nifty trick; when the plywood in application is .5", the finished "sandwich", typically referred to as a "header", is the dimension of the four inch side of a 2 x 4. Sandwiching plywood between two 2 x X's is a very effective method of re-inforcing the 2 x X for vertical stress; it helps prevent sagging. Plywood will flex but it won't sag on its face. (What happens, instead, is that the header can roll on one edge or the other; this is why something must be incorporated into the plan if a header is going to be used to span a very long run and the 2 x X is of minimal depth.)

IME, face application of plywood yields a better finished product. The bulk of the "leg" is much stronger yet thinner, won't sag (in general), and provides very straight edges to join. When used in conjunction with screws and an appropriate glue, one would be hard-pressed to find a more cost/time-effective DIY method.

Quote:
Thanks for all your input!
You're most welcome! I will try to sketch something and link to it for a better visual.
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  #58  
Old 06/29/2007, 06:48 PM
ReefArtist ReefArtist is offline
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Quote:
Originally posted by maxalmon
That's going to be one heavy tank, are they using 3/4 starfire?
Yes - it will be heavy and I do believe they do use 3/4" and yes it is starphire glass. I'm really hoping for that real clear look that I'm after, we'll see. I've figured from the time I start to the time I first get water flowing it will be around November/December time frame. I have a lot of local guys that want to help and that will definitely cut my time down. All the framing, finishing and glass art inserts that will be incorporated will be done by me and I'll be taking my time.
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  #59  
Old 06/29/2007, 07:26 PM
token token is offline
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Pardon my poor perspective?

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•Imagination is more important than knowledge.
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  #60  
Old 06/29/2007, 08:25 PM
mflamb mflamb is offline
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I understand!
That makes sense.
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  #61  
Old 06/29/2007, 08:51 PM
ReefArtist ReefArtist is offline
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token - That looks great and is just what I meant by "Framed". I think I'll go further and frame in the back and sides (garage side) and add doors. This will give me a little storage area and it would look nice. I had the opportunity to check out our LFS today and see how they build their stands. This is right in the ball park and will hold up nicely.

Thank you for taking the time to explain and draw out your design - pictures are worth a thousand words - always with me!
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  #62  
Old 06/29/2007, 08:53 PM
mflamb mflamb is offline
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Quote:
Originally posted by ReefArtist

Thank you for taking the time to explain and draw out your design - pictures are worth a thousand words - always with me! [/B]
That's why I'm always saying "DUH" until you draw me a picture!
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  #63  
Old 06/29/2007, 10:33 PM
token token is offline
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Quote:
Originally posted by ReefArtist
Thank you for taking the time to explain and draw out your design - pictures are worth a thousand words - always with me!
Honestly, it's nice to be able to help; I have learned so much on this board that I am happy to help with a quick drawing. And I am more than confident that this will yield very satisfactory long-term results, especially if coated well and fully after construction.

"Build a stand" is about as much as I am sure I know how to do with this hobby.... When it comes to anything else, I am not nearly as good with the help.
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  #64  
Old 06/30/2007, 04:03 AM
Ithreeputt2 Ithreeputt2 is offline
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I am learning alot from everyone here....thanks

steve
  #65  
Old 07/01/2007, 06:42 AM
brucem brucem is offline
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Hey Carol, Do you have a plan to notch out those 4x6's. I may be hard to get a nice square mounting surface. You might want to do what checkinhawk did on his stand corners. They should be plenty strong glued and screwed.
  #66  
Old 07/01/2007, 12:47 PM
ReefArtist ReefArtist is offline
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Yes I did went to notch the corners out. I have a VERY nice band saw that is made for this type of work. It will cut 10" thick wood and of course using one piece is much stronger than glueing/screwing them together and easier if you have the right tools. I from the start had disigned the stand this way - notch and not put lots of 2x6's and 2x4's together for the legs. I know lots of people do it that way and it holds up but I have the proper tools to give a very nice surface - that's way you buy these cool tools .

On the inside it will give it another area to attach to the 2x6 which again will give it more strength. Thanks for the suggestion and I did see a few others with larger tanks (240+) doing it that way - but by far more seem to use either 4x4's or 4x6's for the legs.
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  #67  
Old 07/01/2007, 03:32 PM
RocketEngineer RocketEngineer is offline
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ReefArtist,

You are right, notching the 4X6 using the right tools would be stronger then trying to attach a bunch of pieces together. Putting the facing like Token depicted would prevent things from going out fo square. As you plan on using six legs, I don't feel that 4X6s would be required especially in the middle. I would place the a 4X6 in each corner, using the notches to place it fully under each corner of the top frame, then put a notched 4X4 in the middle of each side.

Other then that, it looks like the design is coming together nicely
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  #68  
Old 07/04/2007, 07:36 PM
ReefArtist ReefArtist is offline
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Just wanted to give everyone a little update on the build. A friend of mine and his son came over to give me a hand. We had a great time and finished framing out the stand. This weekend or the beginning of next week I'll get the legs and the bottom framing finished and then take a few photos.

We also were able to get me 65g tank moved to a different wall which was about 7 - 10 feet away. We just drained the sump/refuge completely and drained the main tank down to less than 1/2. I removed some of my large colonies and one large rock that I knew would fall. I moved some of my corals to the bottom of the tank - just in case. We then very carefully moved it in a zig-zag fashion. That was a job I was really afraid of - my friend Stephen made it look easy! Thank you Stephen and Austin, I don't know what I would have done without your help - thank you!
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  #69  
Old 07/04/2007, 07:42 PM
token token is offline
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Grats on the progress!

Can't wait to see pics!
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  #70  
Old 07/09/2007, 07:28 PM
ReefArtist ReefArtist is offline
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Well I thought it was time for a little update. Here is the frame Boydx6, his son and I built.


Frame


I've been using the band saw to cut the legs to size - so far it has worked great.


This is the tool I alway use to make pocket holes to screw at an angle. This is the portable part of the system.


This is the garage side of the stand - this is not finished - need to added framing to prevent splaying.


This is the living room side and same as above it's not finished and I'll be adding the framing to prevent splaying tomorrow.
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  #71  
Old 07/09/2007, 08:06 PM
token token is offline
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Beautifully done!
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•Imagination is more important than knowledge.
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  #72  
Old 07/09/2007, 08:39 PM
ReefArtist ReefArtist is offline
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Thanks Token, I have a lot to do to make it stable for a tank but this is a good start. This weekend I'll be picking up my tank so I wanted to get a good jump on it. Once I put the frame through the wall it was a rush to get it closed up because of the heat from the garage going into the house. It does look awesome - thanks again for all your help!
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  #73  
Old 07/10/2007, 01:31 PM
ReefArtist ReefArtist is offline
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OK - I just finished the garage portion of the stand. I just used PT 4x6's that were left over from the legs. I'll still cover this up with nice plywood and add either two or four doors then seal and paint. This will be just a little storage area for me and of course plumbing for the tank (output/returns). here is what it looks like - please let me know what you think - the good and bad!

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  #74  
Old 07/10/2007, 05:10 PM
mflamb mflamb is offline
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Where did you buy that pocket hole setup?
The structural work looks great. Should be trouble free.
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  #75  
Old 07/10/2007, 06:30 PM
RocketEngineer RocketEngineer is offline
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That should last for the life of the tank, and the tank after that, and the tank after that..........
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