how many fish per gallon?

[Puffer22]

just wondering if anyone had a general rule of fish per gallon. we have a cycled 56g tank complete now with live rock (about 70-75lbs), live sand (with other sand, about 5" deep), all the works. we're thinking about
2 clowns
3 chromis
1 blenny/goby
1 gramma
1 hawk
1 or 2 cleaner shrimp
1 or 2 peppermint shrimp
handful of small hermits
few handfuls of small snails

the hermits and snails are already in, all kinds of tests have been done and are perfect. temperature is right on too. does our plan have too many fish? also, as far as shrimp go, will peppermints and cleaners agree with each other? one cleaner or two for the tank?
one more... we know that the fish need to be added a few at a time, and that some are territorial. the order we were thinking was
shrimp
chromis
gramma
blenny/goby
clowns
hawk

sorry for so many questions in one thread, but we want to do this right!

[SeaSwag]

I am pretty sure the rule of thumb is 1 inch of fish per 5 gallons I might be wrong. On the shrimp question I have heard others who have had problems with keeping peppermint shrimp with cleaner shrimp but I have 1 of each in my nano cube and they have been fine for the last 3 weeks. I don't know if it makes a difference but my cleaner shrimp is larger than my peppermint shrimp. To answer your main question I think if the size of the fish on your list are small I think you will be fine.

[sir_dudeguy]

imo that "fish per gallon" rule is terrible...for saltwater fish anyways. Freshwater, its ok...But for example, tangs. A yellow tang isnt really that big, but i wouldnt put one in less than 70 because they are too active and need lots of room.

However, i think your stocking list is fine. I've never heard of anyone having problems with the 2 shrimp together (altho if you do get 2 cleaners, i hear they breed like crazy) so i wouldnt worry bout that. But you might have trouble with the hawk and the shrimp. Some people get lucky, some dont. It all depends on the fish.

That 5 inches of sand kinda takes away some space, but i think your list is fine. You'll need a bunch more snails down the road, but they're fine for now....what kind do you have?

[JENnKerry]

You should really take into consideration the adult size of the fish you want to keep. Plus how much waste they will expel.

[pony_killer]

actually ive had my yellow tang in my 46 gal since june and he's been running like a champ. he's actually the controller of the tank, punks all the new fish, and is very active.

[sarduci]

A puffer vs a tang vs a lionfish vs a clown are all different rules.....

Puffers and messy eaters, and you really can't have many without huge filtration of the water. Tangs need space to swim, and are aggressive to other tangs unless you have a huge tank. Lionfish will eat anything that'll fit in their mouth, are messy eaters, are poisonous and need plenty of space to just hover since they ambush their food. Clown fish are hyper territorial, and will chase anything away from their home, be it an ends of your tank, the middle or an existing fish's home.

Most people say 1" per 5 gallons. I say 1" per 10 gallons if your fish have any "special" requirements, and some fish just require a minimum size tank (i.e. 90+ gallons) regardless of anything else.

[nmprisons]

the hawk will eat your peppermint shrimp (and maybe your cleaners) eventually. otherwise, you have planty of room for that stuff.

[ACBlinky]

Originally posted by nmprisons
the hawk will eat your peppermint shrimp (and maybe your cleaners) eventually. otherwise, you have planty of room for that stuff.

My pixy hawk is a beautiful, fascinating fish, but he kills for sport. Shrimp, crabs, hermits, and I'm not certain, but I think he's the one that's been killing off the snails. Absolutely forget about the shrimp if you want a hawkfish (though a longnose might be okay). Honestly though, given the choice I'd much rather have a hawk in my reef than cleaners -- I used to have a pair of shrimp and they were neat, but made it very difficult to spot-feed the coral.

[sir_dudeguy]

actually ive had my yellow tang in my 46 gal since june and he's been running like a champ. he's actually the controller of the tank, punks all the new fish, and is very active.

i knew someone would say that lol. Of course theres going to be people with tangs in smaller tanks, and sure they're gonna live if the water and everything is good. And if they're small (like a baby or something) then of course its ok to keep them in that for a while...i personally dont think they should be kept in anything smaller than a 70 gallon tank, but again, thats just my opinion. Half the people are gonna say you shouldnt keep them in there, a quarter will say you can, and the other quarter of the people will say for young ones its ok.

[ChunksInClemson]

pony_killer, You said since June you've had the tang in the 46. Thats only 3 months, in other words thats not a long time so dont make it seem so easy. In a year or a more, its gonna grow, and probably hasn't grown much in 3 months so dont think its just gonna stay that size forever.

[edwar050]

Glad everyone finally got away from that 1 inch per 5 gallons of water rule!

[Puffer22]

as far as snails, sir_dudeguy, we have a few astreas and a few turbos right now. getting 50 smaller snails (forget what kind, he ordered them, i didn't) in the mail soon. i should probably look at more hermits if i can't amicably keep a hawk and shrimp.

[Puffer22]

starting out our fish today! getting 3 chromis or a gramma. hope everything goes well.

[sir_dudeguy]

well i wouldnt add hermits and snails. Snails are much better cleaners than hermits are, and i've got 3 dif. types of them, and they've all killed off a cerith snail or 2, because they're all using the ceriths shells.

Go for the gramma. Chromis get pretty big (not that big tho) but prolly around 3-4 inches. And they will likely pick on the weaker ones, so if one is weeker than the other(s), it will prolly end up dead.

The gramma's are a peacefull fish tho, so i would personally say go for that instead.

And chunks had another very good point about the tang in his(or her lol) last post. If a tang is only 2 inches long, then of course it can be in a somwhat smaller tank for a while...they do grow slow i believe, but they grow large, nonetheless.

[Puffer22]

not at all interested in a tang.. i know they take up a bit of room and get large. we added 4 green chromis and a cleaner shrimp yesterday. no problems yet and they're all about the same size. i'll keep an eye out though in case one gets picked on..we'll take him out and give him his own tank. as of now, everybody is eating and the fish look really good. they schooled a lot at the dealer, but it seems they aren't doing that much now. waiting a few weeks for a gramma.

[b0wenj]

Originally posted by sir_dudeguy
well i wouldnt add hermits and snails. Snails are much better cleaners than hermits are, and i've got 3 dif. types of them, and they've all killed off a cerith snail or 2, because they're all using the ceriths shells.

I know I have seen alot of opinions about putting snails and hermits together. Alot of people say the hermits will eat the snails but I still see posted on many sites of people having more than 10 years experience saying to do this for a good cleaning crew. I currently have alot of both in my tank and have not had any big issues once I found out what to keep in the tank. It seems to me that if you do not provide enough of the right size shells if you introduce a snail with a shell the size a hermit wants it will kill it for the shell. So to avoid this have many types and sizes of shells in the tank and this will not be a concern. At least it has not been for me. If you look at my list of what is in my tank you will see I have plenty of both snails and hermits good luck!!

[puffer21]

ya I also dont belive in the 1' per 5 gallon rule. It really matters on your tank. Just think about it that means in an 80 gallon tank you could have a porcupine puffer if it got to be 16inchs when people know you need at least a 125(better would be a 180). Hopefully i said that right i just woke up

[b0wenj]

Originally posted by puffer21
Hopefully i said that right i just woke up

Must be nice

Enjoy that while you can!!

[Sk8r]

My own rule [and I understock a bit] is [if you dumped all your fish into a measuring cup] 1/3 cup of adult fish per 50 gallons.

[dc]

I love Grammas, that was my first fish. Behavior is a big factor in choosing fish, I'd probably skip the Hawk, and go with a smaller type clown also.