What Is/are The Best Anemone For Begginers? !!! Advice Please

[fasturtle30]

I cycled my tank for over a month and i hear all voices and some people say wait for corals or anemones and others say if you have good quality water go ahead anyways would you tell me what you think? or if you have the same qs and added some to your tank?
By now im interested in anemones, so wich ones would be hardy and good enought to do ok in a new tank? only since i have 2 clarkii clowns and want to spoil them. I have FOWLR and i have 1 yellow tang, 1 clown tang, 1 humu trigger and 2 clarkii clowns.
Besides that i have nassarius, turbo snails and blue legs.
sg=1.024
ph=8.2
am=0
nitri=0
nitra=0
Pc 130W (12K & blueatinic 50/50 )

[Mariner]

130 watts of PC lighting on a 55g is probably not enough for any anemone that clowns would host in.
If you had enough light, you'd still need to wait 6 months, IMO.
FWIW, keeping two tangs and a trigger in a 55g indicates that, to this point, you may not have been real concerned with researching and providing the proper environment for your aquarium inhabitants. Asking advice on anems here before purchasing one is good move though
Mariner

[fasturtle30]

thanks mariner for your advice. yes in fact i researched a lot before i got my fish, i understand the trigger is a fish that should be out this picture but i like it and in my tank they are doing pretty good eating togheter and not bothering each other at all i pkan to remove/exchange the trigger since is the only one that is not reef safe or move it to my 29 gl im setting up now so i can keep going with the rest os the crew, by now i plan to be Fo for maybe 4-6 months and then start lil bit reef. At the store ppl told me about the lights stuff however they told me for some type of anemomes 130w is enought, and then you got me here asking you about it. THANKS !

[fasturtle30]

please any other comment?? thanks

[OrionN]

A reef tank should not start out as FOWLR first. You really wanted a low nutrient environment for you reef. As it is, your tank will have high nutrient due to the fish load and your light is very marginal. Coral and anemone will not do well in it. Anemone in this tank is not a good idea IMO. Good luck with it.
FWIW, A. clarki will accept E. quadricolor as host. The common name for these anemones are Bubble Tip Anemone or BTA. They are one of the least difficult of the host anemone to keep.

[GSMguy]

um i dont know how to go about this.......

no clown tangs in 55 gallon tanks no yellow tangs in 55 gallon tanks either
the trigger is too agressive...where did you research before you bought?

also no wet dry filters and anemones that is a recipe for disaster.

also you are moving way way to fast.
For anemones you need to wait 6 months....

please read up some more on the tangs i hate to tang police you,

[OrionN]

I think GSMguy means wet-dry filter and anemone is a recipe for disaster (rather than no wet-dry filter).
I agree with GSMguy that reef and anemone tank should not have wet-dry filter. It put out too much nitrates for a good reef tank.

[GSMguy]

Originally posted by OrionN
I think GSMguy means wet-dry filter and anemone is a recipe for disaster (rather than no wet-dry filter).
I agree with GSMguy that reef and anemone tank should not have wet-dry filter. It put out too much nitrates for a good reef tank.

yea sorry because of nitrate build up same with biowheels if you have one of those

[Jovreefer]

I dont agree 100% with the "no tangs in a 55" rule. I think a yellow OR Kole will do ok in at least 55... the clown tang really needs to go though, that should be in a 6 foot tank min.

Every other piece of advice givin I agree with, be paitent... paitence is key to success in this hobby!

[Smokenreefer]

Wet Dry filters and Anemones are a recipe for disaster? Please explain. If you are not using wet dry filters what methods of filtration are you using? Berlin method? A wet dry filter is just a sump with bioballs or any other filter media to promote the growth of aerobic bacteria. It is true that Wet dry filters can add nutrients back into the tank if not properly cleaned and filter pads replaced.

It is not the wet dry filters that add nutrients back into a reef system but the lack of proper husbandry that adds the nutrients.

[phender]

Hi fasturtle30,

The reason that most people say to wait 3-12 months, depending on who you listen to, doesn't really have to do with the nitrogen cycle in your tank. Once established, that is pretty stable. There are other transformations that your tank has to go through as well. It will go through micro algae and micro inhabitant blooms and die offs. Sometimes they happen quickly, sometimes not. All of them affect the stability and organic pollutant level in your tank. Once allowed to go through these steps, many tanks can become so stable they are often refered to as bulletproof. If you try to rush it and artificially play with the chemical levels and have things dying, creating peaks and valleys in your water levels, it never really reaches any stablity and you end up constantly fighting something.
Sorry that went a little longer than I intended.

Secondly, a Bubble tip anemone (BTA), E. quadricolor is your best bet for a beginners anemone. Selecting a healthy one in the first place is very important, so make sure you know what a healthy one looks like in the first place.

The bad new is that 130 watts of pc lights is only about half of the minimum light that you will need to keep even a less demanding anemone like a BTA. More is better, but 260 watts of pc light over a 55 gal tank would be about the minimum that I could suggest.

[phender]

Originally posted by Smokenreefer
Wet Dry filters and Anemones are a recipe for disaster? Please explain.

Almost all succesfull reef keepers have eliminated wet dry/bio-ball filters from their tanks because they are too good at what they do. They turn ammonia into nitrate faster than the anaerobic bacteria can turn the nitrate into nitrogen gas, so nitrates builds up in the water at levels that are harmful to many invertabrates. Bringing down nitrates to zero simply through water changes is almost impossible. By using live rock and protein skimming, a large portion of the organic pollutants can can be removed before they begin to break down and the portion that is left can go through the complete nitrogen cycle by using the aerobic and anaerobic bacteria on and in the live rock.

[Smokenreefer]

Almost all succesfull reef keepers have eliminated wet dry/bio-ball filters from their tanks because they are too good at what they do. They turn ammonia into nitrate faster than the anaerobic bacteria can turn the nitrate into nitrogen gas, so nitrates builds up in the water at levels that are harmful to many invertabrates.

I do not see the logic in this statement because any saltwater reef keeper wants to rid any free ammonia as quickly as possible because free ammonia is much more harmful than free nitrates in a reef system. In most reef systems, there are always more nitrates than anaerobic bacteria can convert into nitrogen gas, hence the need to do water changes to aid in the reduction of nitrates, phosphates, as well as other DOC's and adding essential elements such as calcium, magnesium, iodine, etc. Excessive nitrate buildup has plagued reefers for years thus the current trend is to employ a refugium to house macroalgae to consume nitrates and phosphates. However one can use a DSB or a plenum to provide an environment for anaerobic bacteria to thrive to aide to nitrate removal.

By using live rock and protein skimming, a large portion of the organic pollutants can can be removed before they begin to break down and the portion that is left can go through the complete nitrogen cycle by using the aerobic and anaerobic bacteria on and in the live rock.

It is understood that for successful reef keeping one must employ live rock and a good protein skimmer. One would be foolish to attempt to set a reef tank without employing both LR and a good protein skimmer.

I agree that for a successful reef one must have 0 ammonia, 0 nitrites, and an immeasurable level of nitrates. What I disagree on is that the use of a wet dry produces more nitrates. Nitrates can only be produced by having ammonia, thus no matter what method of filtration you employ the ammount of nitrates for system produces is a direct correlation to the ammount of ammonia that your system creates.

[GSMguy]

Originally posted by Smokenreefer
Almost all succesfull reef keepers have eliminated wet dry/bio-ball filters from their tanks because they are too good at what they do. They turn ammonia into nitrate faster than the anaerobic bacteria can turn the nitrate into nitrogen gas, so nitrates builds up in the water at levels that are harmful to many invertabrates.

I do not see the logic in this statement because any saltwater reef keeper wants to rid any free ammonia as quickly as possible because free ammonia is much more harmful than free nitrates in a reef system. In most reef systems, there are always more nitrates than anaerobic bacteria can convert into nitrogen gas, hence the need to do water changes to aid in the reduction of nitrates, phosphates, as well as other DOC's and adding essential elements such as calcium, magnesium, iodine, etc. Excessive nitrate buildup has plagued reefers for years thus the current trend is to employ a refugium to house macroalgae to consume nitrates and phosphates. However one can use a DSB or a plenum to provide an environment for anaerobic bacteria to thrive to aide to nitrate removal.

By using live rock and protein skimming, a large portion of the organic pollutants can can be removed before they begin to break down and the portion that is left can go through the complete nitrogen cycle by using the aerobic and anaerobic bacteria on and in the live rock.

It is understood that for successful reef keeping one must employ live rock and a good protein skimmer. One would be foolish to attempt to set a reef tank without employing both LR and a good protein skimmer.

I agree that for a successful reef one must have 0 ammonia, 0 nitrites, and an immeasurable level of nitrates. What I disagree on is that the use of a wet dry produces more nitrates. Nitrates can only be produced by having ammonia, thus no matter what method of filtration you employ the ammount of nitrates for system produces is a direct correlation to the ammount of ammonia that your system creates.

who has a wet dry with zero nitrates?

[phender]

Originally posted by Smokenreefer
..............
I agree that for a successful reef one must have 0 ammonia, 0 nitrites, and an immeasurable level of nitrates. What I disagree on is that the use of a wet dry produces more nitrates. Nitrates can only be produced by having ammonia, thus no matter what method of filtration you employ the ammount of nitrates for system produces is a direct correlation to the ammount of ammonia that your system creates.

You are right, you need some source of nitrogen to be turned into nitrate. The problem is that in most cases the water hits the wet/dry filter before it hits the protein skimmer. The dissolved organics get processed into nitrates by the wet/dry before they can be removed by the protein skimmer.

BTW: There are a lot of reefers who have no trouble keeping their nitrates at unmeasureable levels without refugiums, DSB or frequent water changes.

[Aaarrrggg]

I feel your pain, I'm going crazy waiting 6mths for a BTA. I *almost* cracked the other day when a beautiful red one came up on ebay... but I resisted, and I'm proud of myself. Time passes quicker than you'd think. Distract yourself with some brightly coloured zoos and ricordea... they are like tiny beautiful anemones, and they look amazing under blue lights.

Good luck!

edit: forgot to say, check out: http://www.karensroseanemones.com/

[RightWinger210]

Almost all the reef tanks I know of have a wet dry, the reason is, if you have live rock and a protein skimmer, there is no need for the bioballs & other bio media found in filters, which everybody said about the aerobic bacteria, yadadada, would increase the nitrates. The 210 Reef at my school employs a wet dry, but it only has filter pads to filter out the water, and by using a wet dry, that enables us to run a protein skimmer, hook up a 'fuge, and a bead filter, and all of that being pumped through an inline chiller and back into the tank. Without the wet dry, we'd be kind of screwed, as for the nitrates, very low with infrequent water changes.

[GSMguy]

Originally posted by RightWinger210
Almost all the reef tanks I know of have a wet dry, the reason is, if you have live rock and a protein skimmer, there is no need for the bioballs & other bio media found in filters, which everybody said about the aerobic bacteria, yadadada, would increase the nitrates. The 210 Reef at my school employs a wet dry, but it only has filter pads to filter out the water, and by using a wet dry, that enables us to run a protein skimmer, hook up a 'fuge, and a bead filter, and all of that being pumped through an inline chiller and back into the tank. Without the wet dry, we'd be kind of screwed, as for the nitrates, very low with infrequent water changes.

im not following you why does a wet dry allow you to run a skimmer?
you dont need biobals to run a skimmer.

[RightWinger210]

Wait im confused too, around here I guess, wet dry's are also known as sumps, are you guys talking about wet drys as in like bio wheel type filters? And I never said that you need bioballs to run a filter, I just said you don't need them at all if you have a lot of live rock and a skimmer in an established system.

[OrionN]

Wet dry filter is a type of filter where there is a large surface area (like bioball or plastic mesh and the like) that water from the tank flow over while exposed to air and oxygen thus wet-dry. This type of filter quickly oxidize ammonia to nitrite then nitrate.
A sump is not a wet-dry filter but just an area where water overflow to (usually under the tank) then got pump back up to the tank. Sump is where lots of equipments and additive are add in so that the display tank can be free of equipments. The overflow action also oxygenated the water as water overflow to the sump and then pump up to the main tank.

[GSMguy]

Originally posted by OrionN
Wet dry filter is a type of filter where there is a large surface area (like bioball or plastic mesh and the like) that water from the tank flow over while exposed to air and oxygen. This type of filter quickly oxidize ammonia to nitrite then nitrate.
A sump is not a wet-dry filter but just an area where water overflow to (usually under the tank) then got pump back up to the tank. Sump is where lots of equipments and additive are add in so that the display tank can be free of equipments. The overflow action also oxygenated the water as water overflow to the sump and then pump up to the main tank.

what OrionN said

[RightWinger210]

Yeah I know what a sump is, I was just saying that I've heard sumps being called wet drys because of the area that houses the bioballs isn't submerged and water just trickles onto it, so its a wet-dry system. In these systems where it is used with lots of live rock, the bio balls are removed, b/c of the high nitrates they produce.

[smatter]

Take out the bio balls and one has a sump. I haven't used a wet- dry since the late 80s, no need with live rock and good water movement.

[OrionN]

If the bioballs were removed than it is no longer a wet-dry filter system. Wet-dry filter produce too much nitrates for a good reeftank is what we (phender, GSMguy and myself) are saying.
I just use a small tank devided to three chambers for the sump. The first chamber is where the water poor down from the main tank. The middle chamber is there I have my lighted refugium and the last chamber is the pump chamber where I pump the water back to the main tank. This is a whole lot cheaper than buying a wet-dry filter then remove the wet-dry media. Lots more usable water area too.

[RightWinger210]

Exactly what I was saying, thank you. I like how you have a fuge in the middle of your sump, too.