I want to breed fish!

matthewdmueller · #1 10/31/2007, 01:50 PM

Well I have been visiting the fish breeding forum here for about a year now, and I am really interested in giving this a try. I think that I want to give it a whirl with some cardinals, can anyone give me some pointers on a setup. As far as what I have read so far, I think that a 20gal long and a few 10gal should be enough for tank space, with a good skimmer, a bit of live rock, a simple sump and what else? What about lighting, should I just use a standard hood and bulbs? Should I use a breeder bubble sponge and filter for the 10gal tanks? Do I have to use glass, or can I use plastic containers? Should I run carbon? What about rotifiers, what is the best way to make your own? Yadda Yadda Yadda, any advice, maybe some pictures? Thanks

yellowslayer13 · #2 11/01/2007, 12:55 AM

matt let me tag along for the ride

matthewdmueller · #3 11/01/2007, 08:12 AM

Seems strange that there have not been a lot of responses to this thread allready. I think that there are a lot of people out there that are interested in doing the same thing but its just kind of hard to get all of the pieces put together. I think that I am going to go with a steel shelf rack with a 20 long and 3 10gal to hold the fry, and a 20gal simple sump. I just have to figure out how I am going to sort out a mated pair in only 20gal. I might have to combine the 10's into a temp sump and use the 20's as a FOWLR to mix and match to try to find a pair. Once I get a pair, then I can take the whole thing apart and set it up for real. Or if I can find a pre mated pair then that will make it that much easier.
I need to figure out filtration and lighting. After I get that figured then the rest of it I will just have to sit down and work out.

ShannHell · #4 11/01/2007, 08:33 AM

I read that you mentioned cardinals, and the easiest are the banggai cardinals. So if you are doing that species, then you don't need rotifers, just bbs

tedr · #5 11/01/2007, 09:10 AM

I suspect that there are more clownfish breeders out there than cardinal breeders.

Clownfish breeders have their "bible," that being CLOWNFISH by Joyce Wilkerson. Don't know if there is a "bible" for cardinals. Have you reviewed past posts in this forum? I would bet you can glean alot of info from them.

Good luck !!!!

Evansbr · #6 11/01/2007, 11:18 AM

I breed Clowns, not Cardinals. The Wilkerson book is a must if you want to try clowns.

matthewdmueller · #7 11/01/2007, 11:28 AM

I think that I would like to breed just about everything in the long run. Right now I want to try the Banggai cardinals, from what i have read they seem to be the easiest. Food requirements and what not can drive. BRB

FMarini · #8 11/01/2007, 12:31 PM

Banggai Cards are one of the easiest--- but clowns are easy as well.
So I'd say the trickey part w/ banggais is the pairing, but on the positive the fry raising requires the least amount of experience
http://www.breedersregistry.org/Arti...ini/marini.htm
http://www.reefs.org/library/talklog...ni_020799.html

AS for a "bible" for cardinalfish, Matts Wittenrich new breeding book does a really good job w/ cardinals.
However, be aware that most other (actually it appears that all other) apogons mouth brood and release planktonic fry except Pterapogon (P Kauderni, P Mirificia), so pyjamas, orbics, blue eyes flame etc are wayyyyy harder

Steveabg · #9 11/01/2007, 12:43 PM

If you are going to use live rock, keep it to a minimum, and don't stack it to give the cards space to hide. When the male is ready to start spitting out fry (3+ weeks after he first takes the eggs), you will want to separate them, because the female will eat them. Some people build a fake long spined urchin so the male will release them into it, and they will be protected.

matthewdmueller · #10 11/02/2007, 12:43 PM

What kind of lighting should I use? Should I just use regular flourescent bulbs? I don't need anything HO just for fish, right? I know that makeing sure that the lighting is on a timer is important to getting the fish to mate, but what about light quality? What kind of photo period should I use? Also I understnad that moon lights seem to help, should I use white or blue if at all?
I'm full of questions today.

Steveabg · #11 11/02/2007, 12:49 PM

We have moon lights, and our banggais tend to hang out under the blue light at night, breeding or not, but it's also the open part of the tank, so the light color may be irrelevant.

They also spawned when they were in the quarantine tank, with the very weak lighting that comes on a $50 ten gallon tank.

matthewdmueller · #12 11/02/2007, 01:06 PM

Cool so it looks like I will be cutting a huge number out of my budget when it come to the lights. I have a ton of flourecscent lights here at work that I can retrofit on my metal shelving unit. Now all I have to do is work on getting some of the peices together. I think that I might do a DIY skimmer for this rig. That way I can build a bigger one for my application. I'm starting to get really excited about this project.
Any recommendations of tank sizes? I think that a 20 long is good for the mating pair or should I go with a 40? And I think that I have read that most people use 10gal as their growout tanks, is this correct?

matthewdmueller · #13 11/02/2007, 01:10 PM

I guess I really could start out with a 40 and then divide it into 1 20 gal section and 2 10gal sections, I could even get 2 40's and seperate them out of those like the guy in the UK did in his shed. That is 80gal of tank so I think that I would have to use another 40 for the sump. Hum, I will have to punch the number on this, I might be getting a little ahead of myself. Maybe a good way to start would be with one 40 split up and one 40 for a sump. Then I can add another 40 split up in the future. I would just have to plan accordingly. That is also starting to turn into a lot of water in the system, which means more weight. 120gal is pretty big in my little apartment.

FMarini · #14 11/02/2007, 01:24 PM

matt-
read my first article (1996), you'll see how I used a 45 long, and divided it into a few sections to bred banggais. its works fine

matthewdmueller · #15 11/02/2007, 02:42 PM

do you have a link?

FMarini · #16 11/02/2007, 03:17 PM

See above.....
link is provided

matthewdmueller · #17 11/03/2007, 01:49 PM

Thanks of the info FMarini, I will be takeing a lot of your advice here. I do have a few questions though. As far as a filter setup, I'm thinking about a sump full of LR and maybe some mud and mirco algea, but my concern is how do I get the water out of the tanks without sucking any of the fry into the sump? I noticed that you were using a spong filter, a take it that is an air driven lift type system, but I think a sump would be more effective and healtier for the fish in the long run, any recommendations? I just keep wondering how do I keep the little ones out of the overflow? Mesh? Screen? I want to make this rig effective and flexible , just in case I want to try something else down the road. I am deffinetly thinking about a 45 with dividers 25gal for the breeding pair and then 2 10gal slots for the fry, so each compartment will have to be individually plumbed. What kind of flow for the fry tanks in gph? I imagine it would have to be uber low so they don't get tossed around. Also I suppose I will have to have a separate few 5gal tanks for food growout, but I think those will be easy, just need an airpump.