Baby Goniopora

graveyardworm · #1 03/04/2007, 07:38 PM

Here's a picture of the newest additions to my tank. I found them today at an LFS, they had recently dropped from one or two of the larger coral heads they had. I've read alot so hopefully I can keep them happy. I placed them on the tiles rather than the sand cause I was afraid my conch would trample them.

John Kelly · #2 03/05/2007, 04:02 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by graveyardworm
I placed them on the tiles rather than the sand cause I was afraid my conch would trample them.

That's a good idea. Everything will trample them. If you have the chance, make a Baby Pen for them and put the tiles in it. It will cut down on a lot of hassle. It looks like they are starting out in good health

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graveyardworm · #3 03/05/2007, 04:34 PM

That baby pen idea is great, i think waht I'll do is get some slightly larger pieces of tile ( They wont stay on the ones in the picture ) nip the corners so they arent so sharp, and I have plenty of PVC pipe so I can easily make some pens. As long as the conchs dont jump in they should be fine.

Or would I be better off just to let them sit on the sand in the pens?

Thurge · #4 03/05/2007, 05:21 PM

An old tymer told me that one of the problems in keeping Goni.'s is that the flesh reaches around and under the skeleton and can be abraided by argonite. He told me that if you get them up off the gravle they do much better.

John Kelly · #5 03/06/2007, 09:31 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by graveyardworm
Or would I be better off just to let them sit on the sand in the pens?

Since the ones you have are a "free-living" species, they will be fine on the sandbed; it would be best. If you have a rocky/rough substrate, like what Thurge brought up, it would "probably" still be fine because the pen is used to contain them and keep them from blowing around; while also keeping the conch snails and hopefully the larger hermit crabs from dragging their shells across them.

graveyardworm · #6 03/06/2007, 10:01 AM

Will a free-living living species attach to subastrate? Right now they are sitting on a piece of LR I took out of my sump, If they'll attach it might be cool to have them eventually grow together.

Do the free-living ones ever stay put? I would assume that they would prefer a slower flow, and that these are areas which they eventually get moved to by the currents.

The current they are in at the moment is slow and random. Just enough to move the polyps around.

John Kelly · #7 03/06/2007, 11:52 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by graveyardworm
Will a free-living living species attach to subastrate? Right now they are sitting on a piece of LR I took out of my sump, If they'll attach it might be cool to have them eventually grow together.

Yes, eventually; except for sand. It will take months for them to attach though. They will probably get knocked off multiple times before then; especially if you have any fish. When you feed the corals the fish will swim by and blow them off, and hermit crabs will knock them off too.

Quote:

Do the free-living ones ever stay put? I would assume that they would prefer a slower flow, and that these are areas which they eventually get moved to by the currents.

No. That is the reason for the pen. They do prefer a slower flow area and I imagine that is the only place they would settle in the wild, unless they got wedged in a rock somewhere.......but then, if they did that, they would attach to the rock and wouldn't be considered "free-living" anymore. You could also glue the bare area of the bottom side to a rock. If you do that, use a rock that is heavy enough to keep them anchored somewhere, but small enough to be able to move in the future.

Quote:

The current they are in at the moment is slow and random. Just enough to move the polyps around.

Perfect.

vijaym85 · #8 03/06/2007, 02:16 PM

I have had problems keeping Goniopora clean when placed on the sand as sometimes grains would become stuck on the coral and cause it to die. What I am doing now is placing it on the dead skeleton of a plating acro on my rockwork. It has responded well and seems to prefer a very gentle current as it remains closed when I power up my wavebox and pumps. It has ample room to expand and the acro skeleon its on top of is semi porous so it keeps detrius at a minimum. The skeleton of my flower pot if very flat so it rests nicely on the acro skeleton.

John Kelly · #9 03/06/2007, 03:46 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by vijaym85
I have had problems keeping Goniopora clean when placed on the sand as sometimes grains would become stuck on the coral and cause it to die. .....
The skeleton of my flower pot if very flat so it rests nicely on the acro skeleton.

A healthy "free-living" stokesi species does not have a problem keeping sand off of them. Several reasons why some Goniopora do not do well on a sandbed are:
- They didn't originally come from a sandy substrate (many do not) and were broken or cut off of a larger colony.
- Too much water current continually blows sand on them (especially in a new tank).
- Larger fish continually stir up the sand around them (especially territorial fish).
- Sand sifting fish dump sand on them (goby).
- They are not healthy enough to fully inflate, so they can't move the sand off of them (most common reason).

jamielind · #10 03/07/2007, 12:13 AM

i have the goni in your avitar does that species like sand or rock?

John Kelly · #11 03/07/2007, 01:17 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by jamielind
i have the goni in your avitar does that species like sand or rock?

They usually have enough of a base that they can set either place as long as the tissue down around the lower perimeter doesn't get buried in the sandbed.

vijaym85 · #12 03/07/2007, 02:08 AM

what about the green variety. I have heard people say that is the hardest form. What placement is ideal for this form as it is what I have?

vijaym85 · #13 03/08/2007, 12:09 AM

bump

John Kelly · #14 03/08/2007, 07:23 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by vijaym85
what about the green variety. I have heard people say that is the hardest form. What placement is ideal for this form as it is what I have?

There are some "green" goniopora that are naturally "free-living" in the wild. These will work fine directly on the sand bed. There are other green goniopora that are cut from a base or larger colony. These will work fine on the sandbed as long as the tissue around the lower perimeter doesn't get buried in the sand; otherwise, the tissue will die off and cause a brown jelly infection. Also, gripping the coral by it's tissue, which is usually down around the lower perimeter, will damage the tissue and potentially cause a brown jelly infection; especially after the damaged area is then placed on the sand.

It's not that the sandbed is a bad place for Goniopora, it's that the tissue around the lower perimeter is delicate and gets damaged easily in several different ways. Numerous "Experts" have been recommending to place Goniopora on the sandbed for years, and for years Goniopora has been notorious for contracting brown jelly infections, which usually begin down around the lower perimeter of the coral. The sandbed is actually a good place for Goniopora. It is the way they are handled and placed there that is bad for them.
Read the "Placement" section here for more info:
http://www.goniopora.org/acclimation.htm

JokerGirl · #15 03/08/2007, 09:43 AM

I think the green ones have a higher propensity to bleach too?

vijaym85 · #16 03/08/2007, 11:58 AM

Thanks for the info John Kelly,
the specimen I have has a very thin base and it seems like it could easily become enveloped by sand should the sand get blown about or a fish swin by and so on. I have seen the green ones placed on the sand and have tried in the past myself with no luck. I decided prior to buying this one that the sand was a no go. So far this has been my best luck. Another really difficult thing about the particular specimens I have had past and present is the dificulty in handling them. Since the base is a bit small It's easy to incidently touch the tissue which of course is bad news. I pretty much set and forget this new one.

There is one other thing I was curious about, do they grow from the base or in all directions or from the top up?

graveyardworm · #17 03/08/2007, 12:21 PM

Quote:

Since the base is a bit small It's easy to incidently touch the tissue which of course is bad news.

Touching them shouldnt be a huge deal depending on whats on your hands at the time. Wearing gloves would help eliminate any potential risks.

Quote:

There is one other thing I was curious about, do they grow from the base or in all directions or from the top up?

They grow in any direction where there is tissue.

G.SMITHII · #18 03/08/2007, 01:00 PM

about a month ago when my lfs got a new shipment of coral, one of the larger colonies they got dropped a baby right infront of me. every time the two LFS in boulder get new stuff i literally spend hours looking in the depths of their coral tanks for frag scores.

(i have a small tank, so i just put tiny pieces of stuff in and watch it grow, grow grow)

i found another baby in the back of the same tank (they're the brownish red variety), and i also got 3 heads of these crazy zoo's, but i got it all for $5!!!

initially i had it on the sand bed, but then someone moved it way up on my rock work where it got lodged in a hole.

cool thing is, the rock is all porous, so half the heads stick up out of the whole, (the top of the skeleton if flush with the hole) but the other heads have all found there way out the holes in the rock. neato huh?

but is that ok to keep him there?

vijaym85 · #19 03/08/2007, 01:17 PM

Not 100% sure what your placement is like but If part of the tissue is kept inside the hole in the rock then it wont likely get light and will probably become irritated by the roughness of the rock as well. It will then loose the section of tissue and the whole coral will likely die IMO. But if just the very base is in the hole then I guess it would not be a huge problem. I would like to see a pic of it to get what you mean.

I personally have mine on an open ledge so there is no obstructions or surrounding rock or coral so its not limited in its expansion.

Good luck

G.SMITHII · #20 03/08/2007, 01:25 PM

darn. looks tight there.

all the heads do get light, some just have to snake through holes in the LR to get it.

when i first got it, there were about 8 heads, now there is like 13

it seems to like its spot, how can i tell if the tissue is irritated?

vijaym85 · #21 03/08/2007, 01:42 PM

See the thing is for me this coral is considered one of the harder to keep LPS so if its got to struggle to get light by snaking its way around i would be a bit worried. But if your confident in its spot then hopefully it will be ok. Hopefully it will have ample area to grow into as well. I personally have not seen any pics of them winding around in a rock so I dont know if that is really a natural setting. But I am not 100%

When I say irritated I mean are the polyps extending nicely or are they retracted or very short. . When mine extends its extremly long. The goni's I had prior had poor extension. If you have a pic I am sure somebody could advise you better.

Good luck.

John Kelly · #22 03/08/2007, 02:43 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by JokerGirl
I think the green ones have a higher propensity to bleach too?

True.

That's another can of worms.

JokerGirl · #23 03/08/2007, 02:46 PM

Hehehe

vijaym85 · #24 03/08/2007, 03:37 PM

2 very poor quality pics, but hopefully you can see it is extending ok. Pics don't do any justice.

http://reefcentral.com/gallery/showp...p?photo=205908

http://reefcentral.com/gallery/showp...t=1&thecat=500

G.SMITHII · #25 03/08/2007, 03:57 PM

man those things are sweet when they get bigger.

i really like the green ones.

my lil guys could fit on a nickle, but they extend their heads about an inch.

is that long enough to be healthy?

also, how important is flow? they're kinda gettin blasted.