New treatment on inch

[White Pointer]

Hi reefers,

Care to comment, on this product chem-marin. I read about the write up by sandy cohen on chem-marin and kent RXP. Both uses pepper base treatment for inch. Did anyone uses them? There is another by salifert stop parasites.

Cheers

[billsreef]

They're not new, and not particularly effective. IME save the pepper sauce for BBQ

The Salifert one I can't comment on as I've not seen it or tried it yet.

[Paul B]

What the hell in "inch"
Paul

[billsreef]

I'm assuming White Pointer means Ich since all the products listed are aimed at treating ich

[Bass Master]

Stop parasite is "snake oil". Also it will lower your ph a lot.
It tastes like taco bell hot sauce.

[White Pointer]

Fellow feefers,



Need help urgently, 4x2x2.5 tank and 150g, no way of catching all fishes.
I think the tank are infested, and I had some corals. So what medication that are effective, and reef and inverberate safe. Already pull some of my hair out.... Ich ruin all the fun of keeping marine, and with modern technology we still cannot combat them...very sad

wetmedia had some recommendation, which I had read but the sad things is a QT. A small tank, without corals, we can just dose those copper base medication. But with 150g, with corals ,with LR and many big and small fishes....HOW...

HELP....HELP

[kenny77]

be careful with Kent Rxb. it can kill all your invert specially shrimps and seastar. i use this poduct in my quarantine tank since the day i start but many people dont have succes with it because they think they are dosing FW.

IMO&E the best treatment for ICH is providing the best quality food you can find out there. with out it your fish wont be able to creat an inmune system and will be sensitive to any disease

[White Pointer]

Hi kenny,
I will not use RXP since it have its side effect. I had feed all my fishes with formula 1 & 2, and kent platinium food. Soak all fresh food and seaweed with garlic, vit C, zoecon and zoe. I think the fishes had better food than me...

So what is the next step? had change water weekly with tropic pro marine. Water parameters are OK

cheers

[billsreef]

So far, effective and reef safe just don't exist in an ich treatment. There are effective treatments, but you need to use them in a QT. Namely copper and Hyposalinity are the most effective. It might mean pulling some of the LR out to get the fish, but in the end it is worthwile.

[wunroch]

I disagree with some of the other posters. I have used Stop Parasites on my 350 gallon combined reef (220 connected to 110). I had 3 clownfish whose eyes were cloudy and filled with parasites. The product stopped the ICH and within a week or so it was gone. AL the owner was a very helpful and a nice guy. That was 4 years ago and the clowns are still all fine and had babies many times. I have been keeping reefs over 10 years and I can honestly say this is the only ICH product I ever used that worked and worked very well. I highly recommend it. For me it is the only approach that is realistic if you have a large reef

[billsreef]

I'm glad you had luck with it, but it's none of the "pepper sauces" are known to be very consistant in their sucess rates.

[wunroch]

I am presently trying it again for the first time in 4 years for another tank and will see how it goes again. I certainly do not like the copper approach. WHenevr you start moving fish to quarantine it is usually a big problem in my experience. It is very hard to set up a quick biofilter in the quarantine tank and the copper stuff kills the filter. I often think the ammonia spike in the hospital tank causes more trouble than help. Furthermore when you return the fish to the main tank the ick is still there. Furthermroe with a hugh reef and hundreds of lbs of live rock and coral it is unrealistic. I have found however that in my older reefs which are filled with coral and excellent water conditons I have not had an ich outbreak in a number of years. It is very creepy and I do agree that continuously adding fish can get risky although healthy fish are somewhat protected with a good slime coat

[Randall_James]

Originally posted by billsreef
I'm glad you had luck with it, but it's none of the "pepper sauces" are known to be very consistant in their sucess rates.

That's for sure, I for one am really amazed at the numbers of "Panic" posts that hit here from individuals that have apparently not been told the secret of success on an ich free tank....

Quarantine.......

I have thousands invested in my tanks and can not even start to imagine dropping a $100 fish into one of them that could even possibly contain an organism that could wipe out the entire shooting gallery in a couple days.

Sure it is 8 weeks but it is still a lot better option than loosing a tank that has been up and running for a year or more without a bit of trouble.

end of rant.................

[Randall_James]

wunroch,
It is not hard to setup a qt tank at all. (maybe things have changed in the 4 years you have been out of the hobby)

The odds of introducing bad things to your tank are much higher than not.

The bio filter is not difficult to setup or maintain.
Keeping an active bio sponge filter in a sump or refuge assures one that a good bio filter is ready to go in short order.

Also resisting the urge to make impulse buys also helps. Most additions to tanks (hopefully) are researched to some extent. I have setup qt tanks from scratch and had them cycled well enough in 5 days to hold fish safely. Fortunately there are a number of products on the market that do posses synthetic bacteria strains that are more than capable of controlling ammonia while the natural population builds (Stability from SeaChem works fine if used per instructions)

I know its a hassle, I know 2 water changes a day (initially) on a tank stinks but in the long run, nothing in this hobby really is fast or easy that comes out well in the end.

I for one would never discourage anyone from using qt as the cost of 1 screw up could cost thousands...

You might be lucky with your tanks (and maybe you can afford it better than most being a lawyer and all) but if I had to tear down one of my tanks and start over, it could take me a year or more to get it back where it is now.

[White Pointer]

As the local LFS do not stock up stop parasites product, I decided to use Ecolibrium in my main tank treatment.

I turn off the skimmer and remove carbon and start dosing. I dose on the 1st, 4th, 7th and now already in the 10th day. 1 last dose on the 13th will complete the course. My purple tang look good and my blue tang had no more white spot. All other fishes's fin and tail show no sign of white spot.

I do not know whether the medication works? but at least it bring relieved for the fishes. I had consider of setting a QT, but how to put all 15 fishes big and small inside? What about ammonia spike and if treat with copper, I can't use carbon or any filter.

I need a big tank, where can I create such space. I need to check on water parameter at all time, to reduce stress for the fishes.

What about new fish in future, do I need to quarantine them for 2 weeks or more? I understand that if the new fish do not show any ich, it does not mean that it is ich free. The parasite and the host may co exist and may break out once immune system is down.

I think we can't live in a free environment without bacteria and virus. They are all around us, we get them once our immune system is down, just like fish. We eat good and healty food and try to minimise stress. I think we can apply all these on our marine.

Cheers

[Randall_James]

QT period really should extend 6 to 8 weeks. Yes you have a problem when you have such a large inventory of livestock. In most instances qt is only on 1 maybe 2 fish at a time and so is not an issue. QT can be used for prophylactic treatments but that would depend on species being introduced. Copper or hyposalinity might be an automatic treatment for a tang for instance.

There are some fish that just do not qt very well such as Mandarins. As they have such a specialized diet and it is almost impossible to provide it in a sterile qt environment. At this point with such a large inventory, it might be easier to remove your corals and liverock instead of the fish themselves.

It is possible to maintain a pretty clean safe tank but it does take a lot of work. Most aquariums (public) qt all stock for 12 weeks or longer just because of the problem like yours.

Ich is not always present fortunately. However some fish are resistant to it and seem to coexist with it just fine. The better option I think however is to keep it out of the tank in the first place. The old school believed that ich was always present and this has been proven to be wrong. QT just helps keep it out of your main display.

[billsreef]

It's best not to think of ich as being like a bacteria or virus. As a parasite, it would be a better analogy to compare it to fleas and ticks

[Saltz Creep]

Ich is a protozoan. The classic treatment for protozoan infections in mammals is Flagyl (metronidazole). It is also available commercially as an aquarium treatment for ich. Can anyone answer if it is reef safe and how effective it is?

[Randall_James]

Tried and true treatment for Ich is actually
1) Copper
2) Hyposalinity

one or the other and some even use a combination of both. Copper is probably more reliable but both require strict water conditions to be effective

Neither is reef safe. At present I know of no reef safe treatment.

Fish need removed, treated and the reef lay fallow of fish for 8 weeks to break life cycle.


Other treatments have incidental reports of success but........

[BradL.]

Keep your water pristine,PH at 8.3 and feed heavily.Your fish will pull through naturally.

[billsreef]

Originally posted by Saltz Creep
Ich is a protozoan. The classic treatment for protozoan infections in mammals is Flagyl (metronidazole). It is also available commercially as an aquarium treatment for ich. Can anyone answer if it is reef safe and how effective it is?

Flagyl is for internal protozoan's. It works best on deep tissue infections. Not very effective on surface infections and definately not very effective on ich. It's effect on a reef could be very problematic to the benificial protozoans in the tank. Again something that should be used in a QT.

[BillyFSU]

Flagyl (which is the brand name for metronidazole) is also prescribed to treat intestinal protozoans as Saltz Creep suggested. If it works in the intestinal tract, I'm sure it has potency dissolved in the water. I also know for a fact that one large scale public aquarium uses it in their QT tanks. Its yellow hue is unmistakable. If it was available for home use, it would be the only drug I'd consider using as a treatment besides hypo.


Anyone who boards their dogs on a regular basis and has had the misfortune of having that dog come down with a case of diarrhea has probably given this to the dog after picking it up as well. It dyes yours hands yellow.

[billsreef]

Flagyl is readily available. It is good for intestinal protozoans, however it mixes clear in water. The yellow your seeing in those QT's is not from metrondiazole, but most likely antibiotics such as tetracylcine or one of it's derivatives.

[Paul B]

I know that this thread is for a new treatment for ich but I will give you an old treatment that is "almost" reef safe.
It is really a medication for cryptocaryon but I believe that many people think their fish have ich when in fact they have the former. I have also used it on ich many times with favorable outcomes but if you mix it with copper you will get a cure in about two days, but of course you can't put copper in your reef.
I am talking about quinicrine hydrocloride 10mg/gal.
the quinicrine alone is safe with most inverts except corals and anemones. even gorgonians and sponges are not affected but I would try to remove them. The only problem is that it is hard to get in the US because it is a malaria medication and not too many Americans get malaria. It is very common in other parts of the world. I used to get it from a Veteranian. It turns the water flourescent yellow and can be removed with carbon, the water does not have to be changed. Primethamine (7 mg/gal) can also be used alone, or better in conjunction with the quinicrine.
Good luck
Paul
Hello there Billsreef

[sixpackrt]

Originally posted by billsreef
They're not new, and not particularly effective. IME save the pepper sauce for BBQ

have you done test on the stop parisites? and have proof it doesnt work? have you ever used it?
from what im getting at it just seems to me you are going by what people say and no proof to back you up. your all talk i want to see proof im sick of you people like you saying something that doent work and it does i use it and works and is reef safe i never lost anything in my reef from it ever

Ron