Palytoxins from zoanthids IS harmful!! Pics included

[surfnvb7]

i was talking with a zoanthid researcher over in japan, who visited this forum and another forum a couple of times to share some diving pics of his zoanthid harvesting.

his primary research on zoanthids is just taxonomy based. but his assumptions as for the reasoning behind very little research on palytoxin, is that theres just no money in it.

in todays world of medical research.....the actual research is VERY expensive, and unless there is some sort of monetary benefit down the road from the research......then the research really isn't worth the time (since time is money).

the reasoning why you see all kinds of research that was done in the 90's, is that I believe it was being studied as a possible biological warfare agent. i used to have links to all kinds of army research done on the subject, as well as other neuro toxins. (gflat, do you remember that link?)

due to the HUGE chemical structure of palytoxin, it was found that the molecule is just not viable enough to be transfered into a warfare agent, or any other useful agent for that matter.

therefore, you have a chemical structure that is extreamely difficult and expensive to synthesize, has no known medical, industrial, or uses in defense. and its very rare for anyone to come in contact with this type of toxin.

thus.....the reason there is no more research done on it.....b/c its just not worth the cost in todays research world.

sure there are probably a couple of scientists out there who still study it, but i imagine its only at half a dozen universities that specialize in the toxicology of marine organisms.

[audio101]

Wouldn't palytoxin kill you even if it just made contact with your eye? I don't see how something so deadly would only give you a little eye infection..

[akrimmel]

keep on fraggin, just wear protection.

[gflat65]

I think this thread has the link you're talking about, Al. It won't let me view it anymore, though (asks for a password, etc.). I remember using a linear relationship to the levels required to kill a mouse and coming out to somewhere around 15 grams for a 200 pound person (not at all correct, as the relationship would most likely not be linear and the method of delivery from the hobby -squirts, etc.-would not at all be an apples to apples comparison to intravenous, etc.).
http://archive.reefcentral.com/forum...ight=palytoxin

[surfnvb7]

LF50 rates are virtually never linear, they are exponential.

[gflat65]

In a recent Coral magazine, my favorite reef writer (read as extreme sarcasm-if he could keep non factual additions out of his writings, no problem-opinions coming from someone with the clout of an 'expert', whatever that means, cloud the sense of many who read and respect said person-enough on that old rant) mentions how 1/1000000 of a gram would kill a 220 pound person. If the number I posted I the linked thread above is correct (.15g/kg), it took a lot more than one millionth of a gram to kill a mouse...

[Azurel]

I had the same injury about 3 months ago after fragging and went to the doctor and did iodine test and some other stuff to my eye and diagnosed that it was in fact a bacterial infection. He prescribed me some Tobramycin and it cleared up in about a week with no ill effects. That was the 2nd time I had that happen, it does hurt like hell and fells like your eye is full of sand. Hope it gets better.....I would go to the Dr. and get a prescription of an antibiotic or it will take for ever for your natural antibodies to get rid of it.....

[ACBlinky]

You poor thing! Just looking at those pictures makes my eyes sore. Best wishes for a speedy recovery

I'm not sure if you can get this in the US, but in Canada our pharmacies have acetaminophen with codeine available over the counter. It's a milder painkiller than Tylenol 3 (I believe it's 1/3 the amount of codeine), but stronger than extra strength Tylenol alone. If you can't get this, a pharmacist might be able to recommend something helpful to reduce the amount of discomfort you're in.

[crazy_reefing]

ACBlinky - thank you for your concern and advice.

Today my eye is doing better. I'm able to open it more now and I can type

[Racktacular]

I'm an eye doctor, and as someone else said you gave yourself either an abrasion or an ulcer on the cornea. Either way, treatment is the same (topical antibiotic- namely Vigamox or something in the same class ie Zymar etc...).

And it is impossible to "melt" the sclera from something like this. "Melting" of the sclera is called scleritis and treatment certainly isn't topical antibiotics. Worst case in your situation, would be horrible scarring that adheres the bulbar conjunctiva to the palpebral conjuntiva. This would decrease mechanical lacrimal function and thus leads to permanent dryness and potentially a loss of BCVA (best corrected visual acuity). However, that is more than unlikely and possibly even improbable in this circumstance. Good luck to your recovery, you should be just fine.

[crazy_reefing]

It didn't "melt" my eye but the blister that I had made it look like it was melting. The blister area has spread and when I move my eye, the whole eye appears to be wrinkled.