Creating a disaster-proof reef
 

Hey all,

I'd like to hear your ideas and feedback on how to create a disaster-proof reef tank. I feel the thread would help a ton of people avoid some common problems. So lets all collaborate to create a tank that Murphy cant touch.

I would like it to go in the format of proposing a problem, then proposing one or more possible solutions, with discussion in between. I'll start off.

Problem: topoff

Solution:

Requires two topoff units, I reccomend Tunze osmolators. Run both level sensors (float valves) in the sump. Have two resivoirs, one 5g bucket and one 30g brute trash can. When the water level sensors in the sump trip (each independently), one pumps water out of the 5g bucket and into the tank. The other pumps water from the brute into the 5g bucket. The two worst case scenarios are: A) first pump sticks on, adding 5g of water to the tank B) second pump sticks on, overflowing 5g bucket and sending 30g of water on the floor. Better on the floor than in the tank, right? If you think both might happen to stick on at the same time, add another bucket and topoff unit!

Problem: Skimmer overflow

Solution:

1) This one is easy! Assuming you have a skimmer with collection cup drilled for a drain, have the skimmer empty into a collection container suspended over the sump. This has saved me countless times.

2) If that's not possible, have the skimmer drain into a collection cup with a float valve that shuts off the skimmer pump when full. Most topoff setups would work very well for this, the skimmer pump would replace the "feed" pump, and, under normal circumstances, would be running as if topping off.

Problem: Calcium reactor meltdown

Solution:

Turn the CO2 controller way down for a few days until you dial in the bubble count. See if you can get it to maintain the desired pH without the solenoid and controller. After that, set the controller. That way, if the solenoid sticks open (just happened to me), the reactor pH will not plummet and overdose the tank with ALK.


Who else wants to play?

After I get my 360 all set up and running the way I want it I am going to build a logic system to monitor every aspect of the tank. I will try to automate as many backup systems as I can.

I think its pretty hard to make a tank that mr murphy cant touch, but we can atleast try.

My simple fix of the day is ....... Secure your air line tube from your skimmer up high if it currently is not.

Problem: Tank overflow due to clogged drain.

Solution:

Backup overflow. If you have a RR megaflow tank, you can move your return to over-the-back (no need to have it drilled anyway) and use the 3/4" as a backup drain. Insert a piece of PVC tht is just barely taller than the water level in your overflow. If you have a drilled tank with an elbow, drill two holes, and put a short piece of PVC in one to raise it's level. Basically the backup overflow is a second drain but it's water level is barely higher than the main drain, so water usually doesnt make it up that high.

I did the first suggestion with my old 75g megaflow, it saved me while i was on vacation. Apparently after being setup for a few years some calcium scale buildup inside the drain piping came loose and clogged the main drain. The 3/4" backup handled most of the water, I had a few gallons on the floor, but If I hadn't had it, the sump would have run dry, which leads to roughly 876345 more problems.



Problem: Return pump failure

Solution: Another easy one, just get two return pumps each rated for 1/2 the flow.

Re: Creating a disaster-proof reef
 

[QUOTE][i]<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=10792755#post10792755 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by LobsterOfJustice [/i]
[B]
Requires two topoff units, I reccomend Tunze osmolators. Run both level sensors (float valves) in the sump. Have two resivoirs, one 5g bucket and one 30g brute trash can. When the water level sensors in the sump trip (each independently), one pumps water out of the 5g bucket and into the tank. The other pumps water from the brute into the 5g bucket. The two worst case scenarios are: A) first pump sticks on, adding 5g of water to the tank B) second pump sticks on, overflowing 5g bucket and sending 30g of water on the floor. [/B][/QUOTE]


If the tank sensor sticks "on", the 30G will keep filling the 5. So you end up with 35 gallons in the tank and then floor. I would never tie a reservoir to my tank that is bigger than the sump can handle, directly or indirectly.

The 30 will keep filling the 5, but only if both sensors independently stick on will the 5 continue to fill the sump. Two completely independent topoff units. One sensor triggers the pump to fill the 5g bucket, the other triggers the 5g to fill the sump.

So there is a chance that what you say is true, but both topoffs would have to fail at the same time.

[QUOTE][i]<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=10792857#post10792857 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by LobsterOfJustice [/i]
[B]Problem: Tank overflow due to clogged drain.

Solution:

Backup overflow. If you have a RR megaflow tank, you can move your return to over-the-back (no need to have it drilled anyway) and use the 3/4" as a backup drain. Insert a piece of PVC tht is just barely taller than the water level in your overflow. If you have a drilled tank with an elbow, drill two holes, and put a short piece of PVC in one to raise it's level. Basically the backup overflow is a second drain but it's water level is barely higher than the main drain, so water usually doesnt make it up that high.

I did the first suggestion with my old 75g megaflow, it saved me while i was on vacation. Apparently after being setup for a few years some calcium scale buildup inside the drain piping came loose and clogged the main drain. The 3/4" backup handled most of the water, I had a few gallons on the floor, but If I hadn't had it, the sump would have run dry, which leads to roughly 876345 more problems.



Problem: Return pump failure

Solution: Another easy one, just get two return pumps each rated for 1/2 the flow. [/B][/QUOTE]

You could also put a float switch near your drain. When the water level becomes higher than the drain it would turn off your return pump. If it is only a partial clog it would keep turning your return pump off and on again.

[QUOTE][i]<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=10793006#post10793006 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by LobsterOfJustice [/i]
[B]The 30 will keep filling the 5, but only if both sensors independently stick on will the 5 continue to fill the sump. Two completely independent topoff units. One sensor triggers the pump to fill the 5g bucket, the other triggers the 5g to fill the sump.

So there is a chance that what you say is true, but both topoffs would have to fail at the same time. [/B][/QUOTE]

So both the 30gal and 5gal pumps need to come on at the same time, right? If I'm understanding this correctly, the 5gal is topping off and the 30gal is refilling the 5gal at the same time. It sounds like it may be a challenge to adjust both float valves so that both pumps come on and off at the same time... or do they even need to? I like this idea, I just need to understand it a little better.

[QUOTE][i]<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=10792857#post10792857 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by LobsterOfJustice [/i]
[B]


Problem: Return pump failure

Solution: Another easy one, just get two return pumps each rated for 1/2 the flow. [/B][/QUOTE]

You read my mind. I just did this last week. I hooked up two return pumps running in parallel and ito a "Y" valve creating one return line into a Seaswirl.

My main contribution, rather obvious, is to use a microcontroller. I use Aquacontroller Jr which enables me a number of safety features:

1) Temp control - it plus the heater's own thermostat is redundancy against over temp. Its very hard for me to imagine an undertemp happening with my set up. Also it will turn on a fan, turn off lights, and finally turn on an alarm, if the temp exceeds limits.

2) Ph control - I dose Kalkwasser on an ATO. The AC Jr will turn off the ATO pump and the skimmer if the Ph gets too high. Still higher or lower and an alarm goes off.

3) Skimmer overflow - hey I have a Coralife SS I HAVE to worry about this one :) Plus it is HOB. I have a bucket underneath it with a cheap water alarm, battery powered. So if it overflows or drips (because I didn't tighten it properly :rollface: ) the alarm goes off. I also program it to turn off when nobody is in the house. Also again Ph protection - since overflow could cause kalk overdose - but AC Jr will turn it off (that's why the skimmer gets turned off when Ph is high).

3) I also have a float switch which will turn off the ATO if the tank gets too full. It is this one
[url]http://www.marinedepot.com/ps_ViewItem~idProduct~UL1111.html[/url]

I'm an engineer in a safety-related industry so I have thought about this alot. Of course the final defense is having somebody monitor the tank.

My biggest open issue is, loss of power. I'm pretty exposed there ...

Re: Creating a disaster-proof reef
 

[QUOTE][i]<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=10792755#post10792755 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by LobsterOfJustice [/i]
[B]

Problem: topoff

Solution:

Requires two topoff units, I reccomend Tunze osmolators. Run both level sensors (float valves) in the sump. Have two resivoirs, one 5g bucket and one 30g brute trash can. When the water level sensors in the sump trip (each independently), one pumps water out of the 5g bucket and into the tank. The other pumps water from the brute into the 5g bucket. The two worst case scenarios are: A) first pump sticks on, adding 5g of water to the tank B) second pump sticks on, overflowing 5g bucket and sending 30g of water on the floor. Better on the floor than in the tank, right? If you think both might happen to stick on at the same time, add another bucket and topoff unit![/B][/QUOTE]

Why don't you have 2 or 3 float valves in series, so that all of them must be on at the same time to run the unit? 1 trash can, 2 (or 3 if your really paranoid) valves, no problem. You need all these parts plus more with your current system anyway, just to put 25 gallons on your carpet (your wife would be thrilled). Multiple valves in series means no leak to begin with.

For my ATO, I have a 10 gallon garbage can for my RO/DI water and the double float switch from ATO dot com. Instead of plugging this directly in to the power center, I have it on a timer so it runs 5 minutes per day maximum. This prevents overflowing if both switches are stuck, and also prevents the pump from burning out if there's no water in the RO/DI container.

Those are both good ideas. That is why I posted this :). Titus, I knew there was an easier way out there, but I have no experience with rigging up my own float valves - I have only ever had the "plug and play" topoff units. So I worked with that.

TIP: Don't use siphon break holes. They clog. Just have your return line end *right* below the surface.

[QUOTE][i]<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=10793005#post10793005 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by FB [/i]
[B]You could also put a float switch near your drain. When the water level becomes higher than the drain it would turn off your return pump. If it is only a partial clog it would keep turning your return pump off and on again. [/B][/QUOTE] The little water proof box fills up and closes the switch which turns off the return pump if the water level gets close to the top of the tank. This prevents cycling of the pump.

[IMG]http://i112.photobucket.com/albums/n172/jmait769/Overflow01.jpg[/IMG]

Jay

Re: Creating a disaster-proof reef
 

[QUOTE][i]<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=10792755#post10792755 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by LobsterOfJustice [/i]
[B]Hey all,

I'd like to hear your ideas and feedback on how to create a disaster-proof reef tank. [/B][/QUOTE]

Ha, Ha, Ha, --- "Disaster Proof Reef" --- Good Luck.

Don't forget bullet-proof glass. ;)

Eh, I still prefer the second overflow. I'd rather continue water circulation through my sump if at all possible (that it where the skimmer is, the GFO and carbon, the heaters, calcium reactor, etc.).

Two good articles
 

[url=http://reefkeeping.com/issues/2006-05/gh/index.php]Safeguarding Your System From Meltdown Part 1[/URL]

[url=http://reefkeeping.com/issues/2006-06/gh/index.php]Safeguarding Your System From Meltdown Part 2[/URL]

These are both insightful.

For power considerations, UPS and a generator that is quiet enough to be run all night without keeping the neighbors awake in the event of an extended outage. This one comes from personal experience!