2.5 gallon nano compatibility questions

[cjm033]

hey im starting a 2.5gallon nano this month and i was wandering if these would do ok together 1 neon goby,1 chocolate chip star,1 tube worm,1 feather duster, and 1 flame scallop, 1 coral band shrimp, 3 turbo snails, and then ill have about 4 or 5 lbs of live rock and 1 or 2 lbs of live sand with some dead under it i will also have a small powerhead with a spong on the end (itll be a diy job) thanks for your help,Chris:D :smokin:

[chess_wizard]

most of those animals shouldn't be kept in a 2.5 gallon tank.

A chocolat chip star will grow way to big.

A flame scallop will starve to death, and have very, very poor records in aquariums.

A large tube worm could starve to death, especally if in competition with a flame scallop.

A problem with turbos in nanos is the tend to knock your rock over, I've had some minor rock moveing problem with astreas in my 5g.

PS: CJM, I am Grand1Master1

[cjm033]

heres wat i can do for feeding i can take the flame scallop out of the tank and put it into a small bucket or something with some tank water and feed the scallop separetly and feed the tubeworm in the 2.5 original tank i know the flame scallop will be hard to take care of buti dont think it will be if im devoted like i am willing to be. the thing about the chocolate chip star is they have one at the lfs in a 3 gal hex . about the turbos im not sure if theyll move the rock if i have bigger pieces and dont stack it very high if the turbos will give me trouble i can always change my mind because the tank isnt up yet im still tryn to think of more inverts that dont need light all suggestions will be appreciated thanks ,Chris:):smokin: :uzi:

[chess_wizard]

CJM, do a serious search on every animals you want in that tank, read all the information then deside. The problem with taking the flame scallop out of the tank often is, every time you move it, its foot can be damaged leading to death of the animal and the stress of moveing is not good for the animals heath. the star will grow to way big for the tank.

[Twilight]

Nano reefs, especially 2.5 gal nanos, really require a lot of prior reef knowledge and experience. I checked your profile, and it says you have 8 years experience, but I couldn't help but notice that you've just turned 14 years old. Hmmm...

[cjm033]

yes twilight i am 14 and have had 8 years of expierence so that means i started when i was 6 when i was 6 i got my first tank it was freshwater ive had different size freshwater tanks throughout my fish keeping life i started to look into salt water about a year ago because i wanted to try something new so now that im am serious and have joined a few forums suck as this one and the one at nano-reef.com i havent been on the forums very long for the fact of my only getting the internet this past december i have looked into these inhabitants very little untill now i am starting to research them more i picked a small nano reef (a 2.5 gallon all glass tank) for my first saltwater expieence i plan on doing a water change everyother day and about the feeding chess you brought up a good point about the stress so what if i fed it regularly in the tank everyday and 1 time every week i could feed him separetly just to make sure it will get enough food? thanks for your help keep the questions comments and suggestions comming,Chris:) :uzi: :smokin:

[Twilight]

Changing water every other day will make for a very unstable system.

[clowdy]

i'd avoid the scallop like the plague!! the success rate on those animals is minimal even for the most advanced reefer. remember that our primary concern in this hobby should be for the animals and their well being. it is our responsibility to keep only the animals that we know will thrive in our systems.

i do agree that the star will out grow the system eventually but you could certainly keep him for a while if you feed him well.

just a piece of advice, you might want to start with a slightly larger nano, try 7g for your first attempt. it will give your animals more room to grow and will be a more stable system. but if you think you can pull off a 2g then more power to ya! we will all anxiously await pictures when you have it up and running.

[ophiuroid]

IMO, there is no point in doing the choc chip and the scallop. The choc chip would find it very tasty! It would be a major stress on the scallop to remove it to feed...they will close up for awhile each time, so it might get a brief period of feeding and then be stressed by going back into the tank, etc. This is assuming you can remove it, because they tend to 'tie' themselves down to rocks, glass, etc.

Go real slowly with this, 'cause you've got a list of animals which require lots of food, and not much water to dilute the waste. Diets for filter feeders can pollute the water pretty quick...the choc chip will need some nice hunks of food now and then, etc etc. Water quality could turn bad pretty fast. Good luck!

[cjm033]

ok i dont think the choclate chip star is in the picture ant more does anybody have a request for a star fish that will stay small no bigger than 3 inches in diameter at max? also how often should i change the water? would 1/2 of a gallon every 2 days like i do one sunday next one wednesday next one saturday and so on? do you think that would be too much? i know i will have at least a cup a day water change for the fact of the feedings for the flame scallop so i hope that wont get in the way thanks for your help,Chris:D :smokin: :uzi:

[chess_wizard]

any starfish in a tank that size is not a good idea. they are very sencitive to salinity and the fact that it has a small water volume increases the salinity variation due to evaporation, and the fact that there wont be enough food in a tank that size for any star.

Again the scallop is not a good idea and wont live long in those conditions.

[Rock Anemone]

I've had my flame scallop for about 3 months now... :D They are very easy to take care of if your reef tank is well established. Personnaly I think they will fare well better in larger aquaria. Tube worms, "Feather Dusters" would be a excellent choice for your tank. I would also think the neaon goby will do well. I would choose some small astro snails, the big turbos will knock stuff over. Also, try a small lettuce nudibranch. I would pass on the choc. star, they are bad for DSB's and will slowly starve. Also, your syetm would be to small for one. Also, pass on the CB shrimp, they will eat your bristle worm population and will probably kill your goby. Another choice would be a cleaner shrimp or a Blood Red shrimp...

Hope This Helps!
Rock Anemone

[cjm033]

i found a few new stars today when i was looking for inverts in one of many books i have i found a couple oof small stars that were small and colorful they are 1 the cushion star it sid they get to 2 inch max and 2 and orange star it said they get to a 3.5 inch max i was wandering if anyone had any info on these stars thanks i really appreciate it,Chris:)

[cjm033]

thanks for the tips rock i was iffy about the cbs actually i really dont care if the bristle worms are there or not ( i just dont like them) and the chocolate chip star is totaly outta the picture thanks for your help,Chris:D :uzi: :smokin:

[chess_wizard]

Those stars are preditory. Only 2 kinds of stars known to be less-preditory/not preditory and those are stars from the linkia and fromia genius. Both these stars are not suitable in a tank as small as 2.5 gallons.

[ReefCorner]

cjm033,

I am glad that there are young nano reefers. My son is 8 years old and he has 3 years reef experience. He recently started a 7 gallon nano reef from Nano-Reef.com.

We started other 2.5 gallon 3 weeks ago. Beware a 2.5 can be very differcult . Within the past 3 weeks we have had other share of problems. Ammonia spike from an anemone that got caught in the internal filter and died. Heat problems.

But since the tank is so small the problems are easy to fix.

The 2.5 gallon nano we call our frag tank. The tank is compose of one larger rock . We have attack frags of mushroom and polpys to it.

One fish a baby yellow watchman goby. A pretty pseudochromius that died within 24 hour after he went to in that tank.

The we encounted a flatworm problem from a frags from a LFS. The tank at the LFS had flatworms. We forget to freshwater drip the frags, before putting them in the 2.5 gall.

So we recieved a baby green mandarin from Marine Depot yesterday. And the mandarin is cleaning yo the flatworm problem.

We have a cleaner shrimp and peppermint shirmp. Some bublbe bee snail. Turbos snails. hernit crabs. two anemone crabs.

And a baby 1 inch red starfish.

Good luck with you new nano

HTH

Ileana

[ophiuroid]

I really hope that mandarin will be on its way to a much larger home soon. Gosh, there is a lot of stuff in such a small tank that is so new! Good luck with it.

I agree that no starfish is really suitable for the tank. The cushion star is big and predatory (the only cushion I know is very large). The small stars in the genus Fromia and Linkia are much worse than a chocolate chip star. They are very delicate when it comes to salinity changes, need very long acclimations, and feed on algal/bacterial films. You will not have enough in a 2.5g. This includes the orange seastar. I do not think they are a good choice at all. If you want a seastar, you need a tough one that is easy to feed, IMO, like the chocolate chip and general, etc. Basically, if you want a starfish, I would recommend a larger nano. Photosynthetic things like polyps and mushrooms, etc are better for this type of situation. IMO, predatory things are not a good choice because of lack of water volume to dilute wastes.

[cjm033]

ok so no star fish does anyone have any suggestions for inverts in this tank? i would love to hear some ,Chris:D :uzi: :smokin:

[ReefCorner]

Originally posted by ophiuroid
I really hope that mandarin will be on its way to a much larger home soon. Gosh, there is a lot of stuff in such a small tank that is so new! Good luck with it.



The mandarin will probably die, before it get big. We only purchase him for the purpose of eating the flatworms. Which he is going a great job. Once he eats all the flatworms the mandarin will probably die.

[cjm033]

no offense reef corner but thats horrible i know better than to buy a fish for that reson seriously you should think things through before you do something stupid like that its just horrible to kill suck an awsome fish because you have flatworm problems,Chris:D :smokin: :uzi:

[Ananda]

Please sell or trade the mandarin in the livestock sale/trade forums here or return him to the LFS when he's eaten all the flatworms.

LFSs should have a "rental" policy for this sort of thing.

[ReefCorner]

Originally posted by cjm033
no offense reef corner but thats horrible i know better than to buy a fish for that reson seriously you should think things through before you do something stupid like that its just horrible to kill suck an awsome fish because you have flatworm problems,Chris:D :smokin: :uzi:

I am sorry you are offended. But you should read some of the threads on the RC forum. Mandarins are known to eat flatworms. And are the safest way to treat a flatworm problem.

The mandarin is a beautiful fish and I would hate to know that is dies. But mandarins generally do not live long in unestablished tank. I am not being cruel. But that is law of nature.

People buy peppermint shrimp for apaistia problems, Emerald crab for bubble algae.

And Marine Depot sells and nudibranchi that eats flatworm for $50. And the survival is worst than the mandarin.


NOW I AM OFFENDED. BECAUSE IS NOT A STUPID MOVE. IT WAS WELL THOUGHT OUT AND SUGGESTED BY MANY ON THIS FORUM AND MY LFS.

Most important is that the mandarin has just about cleaned up the the flatworm problem. If I see the mandarin getting skinny or when the flatworm problem eradiated. I will try to caught him take him to my LFS. Or to a tank that is well established.

[Twilight]

LAW OF NATURE??? You took nature from the ocean and put it in a glass bowl. If you're going to disrupt nature as such then you have a responsibility to do everything in your power to give it the best life possible. Peppermint shrimp and emerald crabs don't die once they've eaten the apaistia andbubble algae, because they will eat other things. Your "law of nature" crap just doesn't hold up. It would be like taking innocent people, who were just minding their own business, and throwing them in jail. Now they're confined to this tiny space where they CAN live if they're treated properly. But if the jail caretakers don't feed the prisoners something that will sustain them then they will die. Sound ethical?

[staticx1134]

not to add to this bonfire, but do you really think that that fish thought that "Gee im gonna eat worms and when im done i will die" nope.....he most likely expects to live but any hoo.... thats like cycling a new tank with a damsel just so you can get it cycled even though you had the intensions of him dieing.....:(

ill b quiet now.....:beachbum:

[chess_wizard]

ok guys cool it! were here to learn and not to flame each other

[ReefCorner]

Originally posted by staticx1134
not to add to this bonfire, but do you really think that that fish thought that "Gee im gonna eat worms and when im done i will die" nope.....he most likely expects to live but any hoo.... thats like cycling a new tank with a damsel just so you can get it cycled even though you had the intensions of him dieing.....:(

ill b quiet now.....:beachbum:


I think my post is being taking out of context. It is not my intend for the fish to die. I hope the fish lives. It is a beautiful. But it was bought for specific reason. To eat the flatworms.

I would be never buy a mandarin for an unestablished tank.

I bought a yellow damsel over a year ago. to cycle my 20 gallon tank. It was the oldest living fish in that until recently. When the damsel meet with an unfortunate accident. Unless it would be still alive.

Ananda said it is like rent a fish. Once the flatworms are eradiated I will trade him at the LFS. Chances are he will not survive once all the flatworms are eaten.

In the past year I have trade many fish and inverts that for some reason was a problem or not suit for my tank to my LFS.


Please every one cool it. MY INTEND IS NOT TO BE CRUEL TO ANY LIVESTOCK THAT I HAVE PURCHASED.

[staticx1134]

my bad.....i didnt want to get you mad, but i wanted to say what i was thinking.....

no more:p

[kryptonite]

I challenge everyone on this site to STOP THE FLAMING!!! Everyone is not a newbie. There are some things that are meant to be taken for granted in some peoples posts. What I mean is people that know what they're talking about don't always post every detail. This makes for the occasional misunderstanding. You all should have known that Reefcorner's intent was not to intentionally starve the mandarin. You have to admit that it would take more than a sharp eye and a lot of hours staring to make sure all of the flatworms are eradicated. Much less being able to visibly notice a BABY mandarin goby getting skinny. I am sure that Reefcorners ultimate intent would be to take the goby out when the job is finished but you, Reefcorner and I all know that the goby isn't going to swim up, tap on the glass and say, "Hey dude, I'm done." So cut Reefcorner a little slack and be smart enough and courteous enought to read between the lines a little before you get your panties in a twist. Remember this is a hobby, not a competition.

Thank You & PEACE!!

Nate

[pnosko]

Folks, please don't confuse flaming with responsible advice and blunt comments.

ReefCorner, I certainly hope you intend to trade the mandarin once your flatworms are eradicated. I can't blame folks at all for speaking up as your initial reply ("Once he eats all the flatworms the mandarin will probably die.") was plainly callous and didn't suggest your intentions for a trade. You go on to say that your intentions are to not be cruel to any livestock you purchase, yet cycling a tank with any fish is very cruel. I would hope that you can accept constructive criticism and teach your son some newer methods of cycling that don't involve making fish suffer.

[kryptonite]

I believe you can agree with me that some people on this site can go a little overboard with their "constructive critisism". It gets a little out of hand some times and creates a snowball effect. One flaming post makes another member angry and his makes another member even more angry and so on. Thats just what I'm trying to say to everyone here pnosko. Keep your critisisms constructive. Don't let it get too emotional. Don't include hints of sarcasm and superiority in your posts along with the "constructive" critisism. Just be constructive and go on.

Thank you & PEACE!!!

Nate

[ReefCorner]

Originally posted by pnosko
Folks, please don't confuse flaming with responsible advice and blunt comments.

ReefCorner, I certainly hope you intend to trade the mandarin once your flatworms are eradicated. I can't blame folks at all for speaking up as your initial reply ("Once he eats all the flatworms the mandarin will probably die.") was plainly callous and didn't suggest your intentions for a trade. You go on to say that your intentions are to not be cruel to any livestock you purchase, yet cycling a tank with any fish is very cruel. I would hope that you can accept constructive criticism and teach your son some newer methods of cycling that don't involve making fish suffer.

I am sorry if it sounded callous. But I was speaking from past experience. Recently I had a mandarin is my larger tank. He too eat all the flatworms. When I notice that his was getting skinny. I made several attempt to catch it. I was unsuccessful. He just disappear between the rock. I have not seen him since. So I presumed he die from starvation. That is why I made that comment. Hopefully this mandarin I am able catch. Since the tank is much smaller.

I really hope that this mandarin does not die. Because he is so cutie in the tank. Right now the mandarin is actively nipping on the rocks. he seems quite content.

If every one knows at when I should remove him let me know. I guess if he could talk He would say no more flatworms, I need a new home :)

And the mandarin was not used to cycled the tank. The tank was already cycled. It was establish from my main tank. My son knows very well that a mandarin is not a cycling fish and should not be put in a tank that is not well established.

And my son could teach many on this forum about cycling techniques. And why is the fish suffering?

I can accept constructive criticism. But it seen everyone for flamed about me using the mandarin to eat flatworms and then dying.

I learned this technique from this forum of using mandarins or six-line wrasse to eradiate a flatworm problem.

Thank you kryptonite for coming to my defense. I will post a photo soon of this mandarin that has flamed this thread.:rolleyes:

I hope I have explained enough to calm the waters

Peace. I do repect every ones viewpoint. But sometimes you think one thing in your head and another comes out on paper that is just not too right. I think this what happen in the case.

[ReefCorner]

My cute baby mandarin.:)

[kryptonite]

That is a beautiful baby mandarin ReefCorner. I hope your able to catch this one. Good luck.

Nate

[Ananda]

That mandarin is adorable! Maybe you could order 'pods for him to eat. And as he's this little, maybe you could train him to eat frozen mysis....?

[ReefCorner]

Originally posted by Ananda
That mandarin is adorable! Maybe you could order 'pods for him to eat. And as he's this little, maybe you could train him to eat frozen mysis....?


I am open to suggestions. I have frozen mysis. I will try some. I am not familiar with pods:confused:.

What are pods. I have heard of them. I am willing to learn how I can keep this cute little mandarin alive in my tank.

:)

[pnosko]

ReefCorner, I hope to have a mandarin one day and have been "eyeballing" posts that talk about them. One "rule" I recall seeing was that one mandarin needs about 70lbs of LR (actually the pods on them) to survive. I'm not sure if this is accurate. I haven't myself begun looking into more detailed information as my tank is still waay too immature for a mandarin. I'm in the process of setting up a 25g display refugium for my 55g tank in part because I hope it helps me grow the pods that a mandarin needs for food.

If you're really interested, I suggest opening a new thread in the appropriate forum. I seriously doubt that any nano could be adequate based on my limited knowledge of mandarins. I suspect your mandarin will be out of food in a matter or a month or so, if not sooner. I also read that they've been know to live only about 4-5 months before starving to death in inappropriate environments.

[ReefCorner]

pnosko,

I think you are right about well established tank for mandarin. But on the whole their survival rate are low in a enclose system.

I do know a friend of mines that has a long surviving mandarin. But his tank has but running for years.

I have a refugium on my 7 gallon. I wonder if the mandarin will survival better, if transferred to that tank.

Again what are the pods:confused:

The mandarin I had in my larger tank lived about 3-4 months.
And that tank has 100 lbs. of liverock. And is running for 2 years.

[pnosko]

Originally posted by ReefCorner
Again what are the pods:confused:Do a search on "copepods mandarin" and you'll get a decent amount of relevent reading material.

[ReefCorner]

Thank you
pnosko,

I will do the reach.

[absolutc]

Im sorry, but my fingers are just itching to reply.

ReefCorner -

You should be shot for buying that mandarin and placing him in a 2.5 gallon nano. Plain and simple. Why do I say this? I say this because you stated that you had one in your larger tank that died because you could not catch him. Whats different now?

You are NOT a responsible reefer.

[Timbo]

It is my opinion that a mandarin is a fish that should be kept in large tanks only. This has been gone over on the boards time and time again. Mandarins require an enormous amount of life forms for food only found in the necessary abundance in a large and well established reef. Given the proper environment, they are capable of living long lives and therefor, I do not suggest keeping one in a nano where a short existence is probable

Now, while I may feel this way, it is simply not acceptable to criticize someone without offering any kind of feedback; this has been occuring too often on this thread.

This thread is no longer constructive. Thread closed.