Help please

[nbd13]

Hi,

i would like to ask you to help me diagnose one of my fish.

i have a school of lyertail anthias. 4 females and 1 male.

1 of the females' scales are not looking right. instead of laying down like a normal fish, they are sticking up. she is loosing some of them also.

she also has this brownish/black stuff on her head.

everything is test fine in the water and all the other fish look fine.

is the fish a goner? is there something i can do?

do you think other fish will catch it and die?

my tank is 275 gallons so its kind of hard to catch a fish let along a anthias.

i mean what do you think? the fish is still eating (well it ate this morning i am going to feed in about 2 hours again).

what do you think? is there a chance it will survive and live without intervention?

thanks

Nick

[nbd13]

should also note she is breathing alittle hard too.

Nick

[nbd13]

well another side not the fish did not eat anything when i feed about 10 minutes ago.....

i just dont want this disease to spread to the rest of the fish....

Nick

[Steven Pro]

This kind of pine-coning of the scales is usually referred to as dropsy or bloat. I have only ever seen it in freshwater fishes though.

[nbd13]

Great, will it be passed onto my other fish?

is there something i should do?

my main concern is that this will not pass onto my other fish.

also what about the browing/black stuff on its head? its like a patch consisting of a bunch of dots. actually now that i look more close, its starting to progress all over its body.

what should i do here Steven.

what do you think about adding more fish? is it safe or is this disease contagous?

thanks

Nick

[Steven Pro]

I don't know what the cause is, so I can't tell you what to do. In freshwater fishes the cause can be poor diet (like in African cichlids) or from a bacterial infection.

[nbd13]

Thanks for the help.

Nick

[Steven Pro]

Sorry I could not be more helpful.

[nbd13]

No problem.

hey one more thing. another anthias i have just has that black/brownish covering on it, BUT not the "pushed" up scales.

do you know what that is and if that is contagous and treatable?

i will take some pics tomorrow to better assit you, my lights just went out or i would do it now.

Nick

[Steven Pro]

I would like to see the pictures before commenting.

[nbd13]

Thanks i will take some tomorrow and post them here for you.

i will take some of the sick female lyertail also just incase you can see something too.

they other fish i am talking about with the black/brown all over is a different type of anthias that was sent to me by mistake by live aquaria.

anyway thanks again

Nick

[nbd13]

Ok i took 4 pictures of the other fish, NOT the lyertail. i think the lyertail is staying the the rocks and think he might be dead or will be soon. i am so sick of healthy fish dying!

anyway here is a picture of the OTHER anthias i am talking about with the black/brownish stuff on his head/lips and body.

let me tell you whats been going on in depth more. you may remeber i started a thread awhile ago here it is,

http://archive.reefcentral.com/forums/s...threadid=678942

well to make a long story short i did not do anything with the 3 remaining fish (2 clowns and foxface). i added a small chevron tang and he seemed to be doing fine. about 2 weeks went by and everything was doing fine. so i added a school of lyertail anthias (4 females, 1 male). they were doing fine so about 2 weeks later i added a school of bimaculatus anthias (4 females and 1 male) they came in great and were doing real well eating the first day. then my chevron got sick and did not eat for 2 days. he looked like he was going to die! he was missing about half of one of his front fins. and had some white marks on his body, not ick though. then he started eating though and is now FULLY healed and fatter than ever!

BUT i lost 2 female bimaculatus anthias and 1 male, they all stopped eating and developed white patches on their bodies started loosing scales and were breathing very heavy. then they all died! BUT BUT 2 female survived! well acutally.....

now i got the bimaculatus anthias online from liveaquaria.com and they sent me 1 male, 3 females AND 1 WRONG ANTHIAS the one in the pics you will see later. so 1 female bimaculatus anthias survied and this other anthias survived.

so everything was going great after loosing these fish and i added a interruptus angel. she is about 5" and doing GREAT! eating everythign in sight and real fat!

BUT about 3 days ago i noticed one of my female lyertails getting sick with the symptoms above. and like i said i think she will die soon. it is REALLY making me mad!

so at this moment i have, 2 ocellaris clowns (tank raised), 1 foxface, 1 chevron, 4 female lyertails, 1 male lyertail, 1 female bimaculatus anthias, 1 WRONG anthias, 1 female interruptus angel.

now all these fish are doing well except one female lyertail which i think i will loose, and the wrong anthias that was sent to me. now that i look though the female bimaculatus anthias does have some of this black/brown crap on her forehead too.

anyway here are the pics,

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v608/nbd13/lhasdflsdjf.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v608/nbd13/kjjhjjujj.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v608/nbd13/khbgkhgisuhiou.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v608/nbd13/hhukihoid.jpg

so what do you think? i mean what should i do?

is it NOT safe to add anything?

should i just wait and see what happens?

i am going to try and catch the anthias in the picture and give him to my LFS so they can try and cure it.

BUT what about the fish in the tank? you know how expensive that interruptus angel is because i think i saw you had one.

anyway should i just wait and see what happens with the current fish in the tank and go from there?

also now that i look more close another one of my female lyertails has that black/brown stuff on her and a couple (3-5) of her scales are white and they look like they are going ot fall off.


I guess the main thing is Steven do you think this can be transmitted to the other fish in the tank?

oh BTW the female lyertail just passed away..... it really sucks!

thanks again

Nick

[Steven Pro]

It does not sound like you quarantined any of these fish. And, you are talking about some very expensive fish to learn the lesson of proper quarantine,
http://www.reefkeeping.com/issues/2004-10/sp/feature/index.php

It is likely you will have to remove all the fishes to be sure to rid your tank of whatever is in there. There are removal tips here,
http://archive.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=707656

As to what they have, I can't be certain from your blurry images or description. There are numerous possibilities like Brooklynella, Uronema, Amyloodinium, bacterial, stress, or a combination. I would probably begin with a formalin bath on the way to quarantine and then follow that up with nitrofurazone.

[nbd13]

Thanks for the help.

now after i quartine and treat how do i know the fish will not have the bacteria/virus/fungal infection still?

so basically you think this will keep picking off my fish 1 by 1 until there arent any left?

its weird that the clowns and foxface have never shown any symptoms. do you think they are immune to it?

anyway thanks for the help!

Nick

[Steven Pro]

First you have to properly ID the 'bug'. The answers to all your questions flow from that starting point.

[nbd13]

how do i go about IDing the bug?

thanks

Nick

[Steven Pro]

Better pictures, a more detailed description of the symptoms, comparing your fish to other images and descriptions of sick fish in articles and books, etc.

[nbd13]

Hey Steven another quick question for you.

Today i finally had some time to sit down and really look over all the fish.

i noticed that my small chevron tang has a patch on his front fin, i think its called a pectoral fin maybe?

anyway its a patch not a dot like ick. He is swimming fine and eat real well. He is constantly picking at the rocks and nori and eats 2 times a day when i feed the tank.

now if you remeber previously he started to loose his fins but then all of a sudden bounced back and slowly his fins healed.

there are also a couple blotches of dis-coloration that i noticed right before his tail on the bottom. when he "flares" his fins open you can see it.

i am not sure if its just normal and him changing into adult, but he is small at about 2". he did loose some of his skin right before his tail when he lost his pectoral fin awhile ago.

not sure if he is just going through it again or not.

anyway what do you think? is it fin root? or something else? he is acting normal though, eating, swimming, not scared of me ot his tankmates.

just wanted to see what you thought about it.

thanks Steven!

Nick

[Steven Pro]

First of all let me say, I don't mean to be rude. But, what do you want me to say? You describe this as a "patch on his front fin" and as a couple of "blotches of dis-coloration". That could be most anything. Please be much more descriptive (color, texture, shape, etc.), post better images, or even find something that looks similar for comparison.