Moorish Idol keepers

[Jaffo_botz]

I've kept a Moorish Idol successfully for over two years now. Fat and happy and king of the tank w/my Emperor Angel. I believe the success I've had has a lot to do with luck of finding an individual that received proper handling....and introducing and 'training' it to eat foods that us hobbiest can offer.

I'm looking to discuss with others, if any, that currently have an Idol flourishing.

These guys whither away quickly, hence any length of time in a holding tank / fish store, where they don't eat, add to their demise as they will not eat when stressed. Mine also did not eat foods out of the water column, but rather 'grazed' at foods which, it's my understanding, is the natural eating method for these fish.

When my LFS accidently received shippment of three juv. Idols, the owner, a friend of mine, challanged me to try to keep one (as I had success with a scribbled boxfish he accidentally got in a shipment). The individual I selected was picking at the substrate periodically (this was key). The others were stressed out and had that 'deer in headlights' look about them. (Needless to say they did not make it past two weeks in the store as they never ate).

By introducing the Idol to a tank by itself (130G) with a very efficient eater (in my case, a juv. Naso Tang) worked for me. 3 times a day, I offered algae (along with romaine and spinach) on a rock (via rubberband) as well as periodically: fresh clams opened from the grocery store. Over a 2-3 week period, the Idol learned from Naso that this was food. I began wrapping frozen foods: (VHP, Formula II, Angel Formula) within the algae...once again...the Naso seemed to 'show' the Idol that this was food.

During the first month, the Idol got very skinny....so much so, I doubted he would make it. During the second month, which I began wrapping the frozen foods and during which the Idol began accepting the offered foods, he fattened up some. (The Naso, by this time, looked like a 'canned ham with fins' :-) ....it was eating so much because I was making food avaiable at all times for the Idol)

I added several other fish I had: Purple Tang and Emperor Angel to the tank and sometime over the month afterwords, the Idol began eating foods out of the water column. It seemed as competition arose for food and the fact that the 'floating foods' were the same as what I was wrapping in the algae, it was able to adapt and eat out of the water column (rather clumsily I might add).

So combined with a juv. that was picking at substrate (and subsequently obtaining some nutrients); introduced to a rather large (130G) low stress environment...which enabled me to offer a varied diet and allowed the Idol to 'learn' what food (in captivity) is...seemed to lead to success for me. Luck ? of course. Something we can learn from? maybe.

Anyone else out there keeping a Moorish Idol (and have been for more than a year)?

[Mr Nasty]

I have kept saltwater fish for sometime and have always wanted to try Moorish Idols but because of their poor record in captivity stayed away. Then 2 months ago at a meeting of my local reef club(TCMAS) I discovered a pair of large ones for sale at Shauns house, he said he had them 6-months and that they were doing very well. But because he was relocating out of state he would be willing to sell them. Since I figured this was my best chance to buy a pair that were large,fat, happy and adjusted to captive life I would give them a try. And I must say I am sure glad not only are "George" and Gracie" doing well but they eat like pigs! I feed them dried seaweed along with spirulina for greens, then they also eat squished up shrimp, clams,squid and angel formula.
all of this food they get several times a day and they take it right from my fingers. Over the years I have kept Angels, Tangs, triggers, puffers you name it , but I have never had fish with such pleasing personalities. Also they are in my 125 reef and have not even nibbled at any of the corals (not yet anyway). Skimmer works overtime to pick-up the heavy bio-load from the heavy feeding. But everything in the tank looks great.

look forward to hearing from you!

[KCombs]

I had a very similar experience, they said it could'nt be done, yet I bought 3ea and fed them on Formula II and frozen brine for 2years in a 90gal along with 1 Emperor Angel. Sadly they got too big and I got 1/3 in trade in. I got no clue what worked except that my water was almost perfect and the tank already contained a greedy yet peaceful fish. My Idols turned out to be pretty hardy, but then again I had excellent filtration.
BTW, they grow relativley fast

[Gary Majchrzak]

I wonder if anyone is brave enough to share failure stories as well.I think the day is nearing when MANY marine fishes that were previously thought impossible are routinely kept in reefs or FOWLR aquariums.

[gfish]

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[GreatBarrier52]

I have heard that it depends on where they are taken from. Either Hawaii or the caribean one is a better place to get these guys

[Fishwife]

I purchased 2 young Idols about 5-6 weeks ago. I put them in a 75 as a temporary home and added a small Kole tang to try to help them learn to eat. Every day I put in a variety of foods including some hitchhiker sponge from another tank. They really loved the sponge and I believe it helped get them though the first week in that tank. During that week the one Idol learned that the veggie clip held good food and started nosing some of the food I put in the water. Both of them were grazing the substrate and rocks and were constantly pulling at the macro algae that I had stuck int he tank. Neither was losing weight and they were eating more and more aggressively, following the Kole's lead.

About a week ago the more aggressive Idol started picking on the other one. I had heard that when you had two of them there was a chance of this happening. I had to pull the timid one from the tank and stick him in with my seahorses and cowfish for a few days until I found him a new home. He was fine for the first couple of days, eating spirulina and picking at the rocks and sand. Then he started going after my cowfish. Once again I had to move him. He was going to a new home within 36 hours so I wasn't too concerned.

Unfortunately, the next morning when the lights came on in his temporary tank they tripped the GFI. I didn't realize it and went to work. My daughter called around 10 hours later to tell me that the Idol plus a pseudochromis was dead. It's a shame, a nice new home was waiting for him in a well established tank. He was fat and healthy and had a good chance of staying that way.

I am happy to say that the other Idol is loving life. He is now eating anything and everything right out of the water column. it's really funny because if he grabs something he is not familiar with he will shake his head a few times, let it go, then grab it again and swallow it down. His favorite food by far is the 95% real spirulina flake that I bought from jehmco.com. Great stuff and all of my herbivores and omnivores love it. I have tried putting some OSI in there for the Idol and he turns up his nose at it. I guess the smell and taste just aren't there.

His tankmates are the 2" Kole, a 2 1/2" porcupine puffer, and a cleaner shrimp. The porky is a messy eater, especially with frozen krill, and the Idol and Kole swoop in and snatch whatever he spits out. The Porky and Kole now share a cave with the shrimp at night. The Porky is leaving the shrimp alone, I guess because he is a pretty big shrimp, and the Pork actually seems a little afraid of his feelers. The Idol doesn't hole up at night like a lot of fish do, just swims slowly.

We are saving up for either a 150 or a 180 for these guys. We will probably add a racoon butterfly and maybe our cowfish and call it good.

Anyways, even though it has only been a little over a month and I certainly can't claim success yet, I am feeling pretty confident right now. This Idol has gotten quite round in the belly, shows no sign of stress, and swims quite happily with the tang following closely behind.

Like some other posters have said, I believe the key is in finding a healthy fish. A fish that is full in the body, has no damage to body or fins, and is picking at the rock and substrate in the tank probably has a chance. This is not a fish for a beginner or for a person who's idea of feeding is to throw a bunch of flake in the tank. You have to be willing to try anything and everything to get them eating and keeping up a varied diet is likely a key to people having success. I still make sure mine gets some sponge in his diet every day via angel formula and the occasional bit of that hitchhiker sponge I mentioned before.

This is a beautiful fish and I hope that some day someone will come up with solid guidelines for keeping them so that more people can enjoy them.

Laurie

[Mr Nasty]

Congratulations fishwife, I am in total agreement, once you get Idols started on several different foods and are willing to work at keeping them fed they are no more difficult to keep than angels, etc. Even though its only been a month or so it sounds like you are over the hump and your Idol is on its way to long healthy life in your tank.

[Aquaman]

I kept a Moorish for well over a year, closer to 1.5 but lost him one day to a rather large brown hairy crab :mad: I may get another after upgrading my tank either this year or next. Now to find that damn crab. He just got my 4 year old flame hawk a few weeks ago.

[bensenvill]

I guess I'll be honest enough to share my success/failure moorish idol story. I've been busy trying to setup a 125 for the past 6 months but as of now it is still an unfinished project. Anyways, I came across an amazing moorish specimine about 4-5 months ago. So I temporally put him in my 46gal reef tank, and well he's still there today. So here's my dilema, My 125 is still about 2 months away of being able to accept the moorish and my 46g is small even though he's still a juvinile. Now his blessing point is he will eat any sort of food, all the time (been like that since the day I took him home). And he is still in perfect health, I'm just worried it may be too stressful until I can move him to his bigger home. Anyone in the Milwaukee/Chicago area interested in saving a beautiful moorish idol before his space gets too small? I have photos of him too.

~Terry

[Breef]

Bought my first Idol about a month or so ago. I wouldn't have bought one either except for the way I found him. What I mean from that is as I walked into the LFS where I go,and it is a pretty good one,I was passing his tank and noticed him {great fish} he followed me down the front of the tank as I pasted and looked real friendly like a real hungry fish. He didn't look skinney or anything but in perfect health. I asked the person working there to feed him and I would see how he would do. Well he went after frozen shrimp out of the water column like he was real hungry. Needless to say I bought him in a hurry,as I think he is one great fish. They are not as colorful as some fish,but the overall shape and addition of the three colors they do have,actually four if you count the orange on the snout,or mouth, combine to make them one of the best looking fish available. Suprisingly they aren't that expensive either,actually they are cheap! Mine did something the other day that took me by suprise. I was just sitting in front of the tank and watching him and he just turned upside down,stayed that way for about a half minuet and then turned back and went on his way like it was a normal thing! Strange fish and always doing something interesting. Mine kind of likes to do little dances in one area and then go to another and do it again,real freeky. I like the way when he is eating he will wiggle his anal fin. I've seen fishes in the ocean do this he is one healthy dog. He is the first fish I have ever had that I was inspired to give a name to. I call him Sam. I am so inspired by this type of fish that I am going to try to get a pair of them some way. I would like to see if it is possible to get them to spawn. I thnk my three hundred should be big enough. If not then I may even build a larger tank! I play with acrylic at work all the time.

[Breef]

I thought I would bring up this thread and see how the rest of you are doing with your idols. Personally mine is doing fine except I must mention the fact that I have lost a number of fish in this tank and am not sure if the idol might not have had something to do with their lose. The last one that I had to take out isn't dead yet but is so badly cowed by one of the other fish in the tank(the M.I. is by far the largest)that I cann't seem to get him to eat.He is a small(maybe three inch)blue angel. Strange he seemed to be doing his best just the last month before that evening that I found him hovering in the back corner of the 300.I took him out immediately. He was even starting to look as though he was getting more of his blue color in. This may have had a lot to do with it. Anyone with any comments on this or maybe how I could get him to eat again would be helpful. He is in my 58gal with only one other fish a small copperbanded butterfly. He hangs to the back of the rocks and is just withering away.

[AttackDonut]

The pet shop I go to (strickly a salt water shop) got one in by accident (I was there when the fish was unpacked.)

The owner of the store is (or was) of the opinion that these fish are better left in the sea, and figured this one to be a write-off.

He put the Idol in a tank with some other tangs, and offered some food (shredded squid/shrimp/etc.) and much to our delight, watched the Idol eat it all.

For grins, the owner dropped some *dried fish flake food* in to see what would happen. The Idol *ate it all*, shoving other fish out of the way to get at it.

I know little about Moorish Idols,and would not have believed this story except I was there when it happened.

[ReefGeekster]

I had a great Moorish Idol for about a year and lost him due to a Fungal disease, Now I'm setting up a 150gal. FOWLR and have a baby clown trigger and wonder if it grew up with a Moorish Idol they'd get along. If so what other tank mate would be ok? Dwarf Lion?

[Breef]

I have only had my M.I. for maybe a bit over 6 or more months,and in that time frame I have noticed that they can be a bit aggressive if the situation warrants it.By this I mean that if the other fish in the tank are going through a phase where they are turning more aggressive (such as puberty)then the M.I. at that point may overeact to the situation and cow the other fish as in the case of my blue angel that was turning color and then one day I found up in the back corner so cowed that he hasn't eaten since although being in another tank with no other inhabitants that would do him damage.I am fairly certain that this is what happened although I didn't see it for myself. I have also lost a few other fish to some unknown aggessor and they were far larger than anything in the tank with the exception of my M.I. ? I would not suggest putting into a tank the possible aggressive combination of fish that have any possibility of becoming a problem without being able to accept the consequences with no regrets! A Clowntrigger is a very aggressive fish and there is always the possibility of something bad happening with them and any larger tankmate that they may come into conflict with for any unforseen reason. Albeit this again is conjecture as I have never owned one but just from what I have read and observed. I hope this is a bit of help in your decision. I believe that a saltwater tank can best be kept with no problems with fewer of the large contenders to create problems.I must honestly add that my personal experience is by far not the rule as to what is possible and with enough experience many combinations are possible in aquaria. Its all a learning experience!

[Mad Scientist]

It's great to hear some MI success stories. I've never kept one, but, I plan on trying at some point.

Anyone have some nice pics of their idol?

[Reefs_Rock]

GreatBarrier52

I have heard that it depends on where they are taken from. Either Hawaii or the Caribbean one is a better place to get these guys

They are not found on the Atlantic side or in the Caribbean. They are found in Hawaii and the Indo Pacific.

It matters most how they are treated once in captivity. Most collectors couldn't care less about feeding and taking care of their catch because the sooner they get rid of it the sooner they get paid. Since the general feeling is they (all fish) should not get feed before shipping they are not offered food while in holding tanks.

Even wholesalers on this side of the oceans rarely feed their fish, plus they also want to ship them to customers asap, they rarely feed them. Add to that, that the Moorish is a poor shipper and you have the formula for disaster.

Years ago when I was shipping fish into the midwest from LA, it was nearly impossible to get healthy Moorish Idols.

When we get the greenhouse set-up in FL it will be my goal to offer MIs that are healthy and eating. Although I may not offer to ship them. Just keep them for local fish customers.

I did have success way back in the seventies when we could get some healthy ones. As you can see my Avatar is a pair of MIs in silhouette. They have long been my favorite fish. This is also my logo at my web site for the business once we get to FL. If you'd like to see the web site click HERE (http://www.theculturedreef.com).

Congratulations to you guys and gals keeping them successfuly. These are some great stories.

Can you imagine have them breed for you? Well, I'll be working very hard to do just that in the greenhouse. So, stay in touch.

[Mad Scientist]

Good luck trying to breed MIs, I've heard their larvae won't touch rotifers and that the only real 'hope' is to culture ciliates for them, which has got to be pretty tough to do at the commerical level.

Still, what a beautiful fish....I think alot of people shy away from keeping them because of the "impossible to keep" label, but, a gaurentee of a healthy fish would convince alot more people to invest in the proper setup and give it a try.

[dgasmd]

Funny I saw this. I have been thinking about getting one of these fish lately, but never posted anything in fear of being cannibalized by the mere thought of getting one.
I really don't know much about them, but they do look great.
*What is their natural diet?
*Are these fish reef safe?

Would love to put one in my reef tank with my powder blue and yellow tang, true percula couple, bicolor dottyback, and black "eyelash" blennie. I mostly keep SPS, but want to go up big time in the softy population as well. Is this a bad combo??

Alberto

[gfish]

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[Breef]

To be absolutely truthful,I cann't say for sure that my M.I. is the one that has caused any of the deaths that have happened in my tank. I only know that he hasn't been afraid of anything in there so far(which I think is a good thing),and I do have a two and a half to three inch dominoe damsel in the tank that harrasses anything that he can.:rolleyes:

[bensenvill]

Just got word from the guy who took my MI that he's still doing great. I've lost track already of how long we've had him but between the 2 of us, I believe he's just at the one year mark now. woo Hoo!

~Terry

[bensenvill]

oh wow, I didnt even see the date this thread was started, talk about back from the dead. It was my previous post that found someone to keep my MI. Now I know exactly how long he's been kept, 11 months. Anyone else have updates?

~Terry

I'm saving a bundle now that I dont have to buy all this expensive food for him anymore

[Breef]

If you look at the numbers it is a lot of people looking and very few responding. Guess there really is only a few of us keeping them.:D