Tang is looking worse

[kimmeewoo]

My yellow tang with ich is getting worse.

The last couple of days in the display tank, he was eating less and less, and his color was fading. He also started doing sudden jerks that would bang his side against a rock, which is what I assume everyone refers to as "scratching." He let the cleaner shrimp pick at him, but apparently it wasn't enough. I felt the need to kick the ich treatment into high gear, since the shrimp apparently wasn't going to be enough.

Last night I finally got my hospital tank up, filling it with water that was 1/3 from the display tank, and 2/3 freshly mixed salt water. The water in the new tank has a salinity of 1.020. The water in the display tank is 1.025.

I acclimated my fish to the change in salinity over the course of about an hour. (In retrospect, it should have been longer, but I had to make a choice to either rush things, or not do them at all. I was panicked and panic can make me do stupid things.) This morning, his color is still very faded, his white stripe is prominent, and he won't eat.

Should I stay the course of hyposalinity, and continue to lower the level to 1.009? Or is there something I should do in this situation where he is obviously stressed? Add Stress Coat? Go with copper instead of hypo? Thanks for your wise advice!

Kimber

[FMarini]

Kim:
i'll let Bill jump in on this, since he assisted intially,
But my 2 cents. hypo does work however it takes about 1 week to rid the white spots and and bother 2 weeks to ensure they're all dead. Hypo also requires you to have an accurate hydrometer.
If you feel things are going to H$ll in a handbasket, then copper maybe a choice. However copper must be used w/ caution. I prefer cupramine, and you must monitor its level in the morning and before bed and adjust your copper level accordingly. Copper will eliminate the parasite in 3 to 5 days.
The tang is obviously stressed, your fooling w/ it is stressing w/ it more. stresscoat is little more than aloevera gel in a dechlorinator, skip it...its doesn't destress much.
Lets hope bill jumps in on this....
frank

[billsreef]

Sorry to hear things are looking worse. Unfortunately this is a prime example of why I always recomend people treat imediately instead of trying other "reef safe" alternitives.

At this point I would continue with hyposalinity. Frank does make a good point about an accurate hydrometer, the large glass tube types are best or a refractometer. It is also possible to give the ich the double whammy and co treat with copper, Cupramine is also my preference. The caveat to using copper along with hypo is the need to maintain the alkalinity and pH with buffers as it tends to drop with hypo. Copper is more toxic at lower alkalinitys so it is important to watch if going this route.

As to just how bad the tang is and how aggressive you might need to treat is a call you have to make as you are the one looking at the fish. IMO the douple whammy is for cases where things look hopeless and extreme measures are called for. Otherwise better to use just one treatment or the other.

[hcs3]

and to add, or even correct :)

hypo won't kill the cysts, or even get rid of them - only sterilizes them. therefore, the parasite is going to run it's full life cycle - about 3 weeks - until it dies. what the hypo does is prevent the parasite from sexually reproducing. obviously, then, you won't witness an immediate improvement in your fish. but as days go by you notice a gradual trend towards the better.

HTH

henry

[Terry B]

Hi,
Just my two cents here, but I have a little different opinion. Both Bill and Frank are right that treatment will not remove the already attached parasites. They must grow (thereby getting worse) before they fall off the fish. I would not switch to copper and combining the two treatments is ill-advised IMO. This will not speed up the process and the copper will only serve to suppress the immune response. I do not believe that copper works any faster than hyposalinity. Quite to the contrary, hyposalinity stops ich at the reproductive stage off the fish. Copper does not work until after the reproductive stage has hatched and become free-swimming. I believe this would support the contention that hypo actually works quicker than copper. Hyposalinity has several advantages over copper and your fish will not benefit from combining them.
Stress coat works to temporarily substitute for the reduction in mucus production that stress causes. It will also attach to wounds and serve as a protective barrier. I would use the stress coat.
So what can you do that may help? Add a little stress coat. Feed the fish some garlic along with the hyposalinity and add an antibiotic such as Maracyn 2 at the double dose, because it is likely that the faded colors indicate a secondary bacterial infection. Reducing the salinity will help the fish with osmoregulation and conserve it’s energy.
HTH,
Terry B

[maroun.c]

I'll leave the treatment plan to the experts but I just have one question: Ain't this the typical and unique situation where freshwater dips are justified to help the fish make till when hyposalinity or copper treatment become effective???
I'll only give you one advice keep on checking on the water quality in the Q tank for as you said it's still new, although you added some water from the display tank, expect an ammonia spike, it happened with me a lot and killed many of my fish before I noticed it, that's why my Q tank is always runnig between treatments.
Hope ur fish will make and keep us posted.
Maroun.

[kimmeewoo]

Wow, everyone is so helpful here!

My fish, thankfully, is looking better. It's swimming more aggressively and even eating a little food. I think it has recovered from the stress of the tank change, and now I can focus on the ich treatment. I'll stay the course with hypo, and monitor my ammonia. Do I need to watch my alk and pH closely, even though I'm not treating with copper?

I think I will also use some Maracyn 2, in case he does have a bacterial infection--unless folks think it's not a good idea.