Help!!! They Are Going To Dump 200 Million Gallons Of Toxic Wate Into The Gulf

[Tpareefer]

Has anyone heard? In Tampa Florida, starting tomorrow, the government is going to dump 200 million gallons of toxic waste into the Gulf of Mexico, 120 miles off the coast. How can this be allowed? I am furiuos that this can actually happen!!! The waste is coming from an old phosphate plant's retention pond. They are saying that there is a danger of the waste water pond overflowingand IF the pond over flows, it would be catastrophic to the land, water supply and the fragile Tampa Bay eco-system. So they alternative is dumping the toxic waste into the Gulf?????

Does anyone know some hardcore Green Peace people that would be willing to get in front of the tanker leaving port? I am serious about this!!!!!!!!:mad:

[JazzMan]

This happens all the time.

[inwall75]

Originally posted by JazzMan
This happens all the time.

I hope you are exaggerating!!!

[leykis1o1]

i know its a bad thing and im not approving of dumping it all in the gulf but why couldnt they dump it out in the middle of the ocean over a long distance kinda disperse it..that way it wont be so bad!! and contained in a Gulf!!

[AcroSteve]

"toxic Waste" is a pretty broad term.

What exactly are they dumping?

What about the time frame? All at once, or is this some sort of 20 year permit?

Think about it.

Still, 200 million gallons of anything is a lot.

[WaterKeeper]

Originally posted by inwall75
I hope you are exaggerating!!!

Just one of many articles on the subject--

Ocean Dumping (http://www.oar.noaa.gov/spotlite/archive/spot_oceandumping.html)

The EPA's Ocean Dumping Ban Act of 1988 limits Ocean Dumping but it still goes on.

The "Dilution is the Solution" attitude I'm afraid.

[Divetime]

Just something to think about :)

You can find out more about how they are planning on doing that by going to the FDEP website at MyFlorida.com. Do a search on it. I read a few months ago that they had been cleared on the permits for this. They are actually planning on pumping it out over hundreds of miles in a grid type pattern. This is suppose to lessen the effects. This way of discharging the phosphates is actually less harmful then it overflowing out of its current holding pond and destroying the habitat of Tampa Bay. Honestly I would rather see it happen this way verse a direct discharge pointsource.

[leykis1o1]

i wish they wouldnt discharge it into the gulf..with the reef ecosystems it seams more fragile than if they pumped it deep in the mariana trench or somthing in the central of the ocean

[WaterKeeper]

Divetime
<img src="/images/welcome.gif" width="500" height="62"><br><b><i><big><big>To Reef Central</b></i></big></big>

Is that what will happen? Eventually the containment will overflow and release a point source?

I guess this is about the project in question

Piney phosphate release (http://www.dep.state.fl.us/secretary/comm/2002/02-piney.htm)

I don't see how RO will help. It cuts the volume down put increases the PO4 content of the reject water. You end up with about the same amount being dischared in less dilute form.

[Divetime]

Thanks for the welcome :D

I have discovered RC at the begining of this year and have haven't posted anything. Just have been taken in all the knowledge and learning.

I saw this post and figured I could add some insight since I knew a little about the topic.

Apparently the Piney Point fertilizer plant has been closed for some time and they have been slowly trying to remove the waste water from the collection ponds located on the site. Due to all the rain that has been recieved in this area and the fact that we are in the middle of hurricane season the ponds are about to over flow. The Florida Department of Environmental Protection asked the US EPA for a permit to dump some of the waste water in the Gulf that way it won't flow directly into Tampa Bay and ruin the eco system there. The dumping will take place about 200 miles off shore into the Gulf. It will be spread over another 150-200 miles. This discharging of the phosphates will have less of an impact because it will be quickly consumed by organisms then pouring it into little Tampa Bay. I agree it's wrong but at least this is a natural way to get rid of the waste over time instead of deep-well injecting or pouring it directly into a bay that won't be able to handle that much discharge.

[AcroSteve]

Sounds like it will be good for the algae.

[rsilva708]

It would have been better to plan for something like this when the plant opened, so that it would not have had to been just dumped.

Now that the problem is here I tink they should have to come up with a better fix. If it is just been overfilled from rain water, and the plant is not active anymore, couldn't they come up with a way to boil off the water. The water would boil out, and just leave the toxic stuff in the collection pond.

I don't know, just an idea.

[rsilva708]

Also, no matter how they dump it, it will still make an impact. anything that was not naturally there will have some impact.

Like someone above said, it will be good for the algae. true, but what happens if the algae over takes the area. It would kill off other things that would have been there.

[Tpareefer]

I have the read the above mention articles. I do understand that this solution is the lesser of two evils. From what I have read / heard, the environmentalists are saying that the release could trigger another massive out break of Red Tide. Long story short, no one knows what impact this will have. If we are dumping waste off shore now, whos too say that the Gulf wont eventually become a giant waste tank for future solutions to "problems" like this one. Why not open off shore drilling and bring our gas prices down.:rolleyes:

Thats another thread for another day:smokin:

I have enjoyed living in Florida my whole life (fishing, surfing,...). Its a shame that we as a society accept "a liitle pollution" every now and then. What we forget is that all this is adding up and it is going to be our children who are going to suffer. It is a shame... we all are living on borrowed time and leased land and we are not doing a very good job of keeping mother earth healthy.

[Agu]

I've been following this since last winter. Basically they're choosing the lesser of two evils. If the retention ponds overflow the water, and I believe it's closer to 700million gallons, it will devastate Tampa Bay. The water which is "slightly" acidic with "low" nitrates could cause a huge algae bloom the would kill off most life in Tampa Bay. By dumping it out in the Gulf the dilution will lessen the environmental impact.

For those who bemoan this action I suggest you go down to the shore and count the stormdrains leading into the Gulf. That water isn't much better coming off asphalt driveways, fertilized lawns, and pesticide treated areas. 200 million gallons won't make the Gulf much greener :rolleyes: .

btw, I'd sure like to know the definition of "slightly" and "low"....

Agu

[kazzoo3]

Dilution is the solution in this case, and is unfortunately the case in many other situations. Paracelsus, considered by some in the toxicology field to be the father of toxicology, said that "the dose makes the poison. There is nothing that is not a poison." Regardless of the compound, it will be toxic given sufficient dose. Water can be a poison, so can oxygen. The point is after considering the alternatives, dumping it into the gulf is likely the best solution. Yes they should have engineered their retention ponds to better handle the increased volumes during the rainy season, and they will probably look into ways of avoiding the same situation in the future. It is easy to be a monday morning quarterback. But they have a real problem that needs to be dealt with right now. Assuming what they are dumping into the ocean is reasonably close in density to the saltwater and is readily soluble in it, it should disperse and dilute fairly rapidly leaving an area in the gulf that will temporarily have elevated phosphate levels. This will become more diluted over time as a result of currents and wave action. What has happened is they have decreased the dose below a point where it won't present as much of a hazard. The fortunate aspect of this is the compound is phosphate, not a persitent, hazardous chemical like an organochlorine such as DDT, PCBs, or dioxins. It is a compound that will eventually be utilized by the aquatic life.

[Toby Thompson]

You even had me ****ed off. Sometimes things get blown way out of porportion. I think what they are doing sounds like a good solution especially since I dont have to pay for that 650,000,000GPD RO, Mine is only 35GPD would take me a long time to treat the water.




Check it out for yourself

Info on treatment by state of Florida (http://www.dep.state.fl.us/secretary/comm/2002/02-piney.htm)

[kazzoo3]

Ok. What does it say about the state of the environment when they start making annual predictions like this:

http://www.noaanews.noaa.gov/stories/s2004.htm

The volume of waste water that would have been dumped into the gulf is minor compared to the outflow of the Mississippi and Atchafalaya Rivers. Maybe they can put a massive RO unit at the outflow of those rivers? ;)

[Toby Thompson]

I wouldn't worry about the algae in that area too much I used to work offshore on boats going to the oil rigs, and I'm sure the pollution from pumping the oil/fuel from the boat bilges will kill off any algae, especially if you throw some soap on it and make it sink to the bottom.

[AcroSteve]

Originally posted by Toby Thompson
I wouldn't worry about the algae in that area too much I used to work offshore on boats going to the oil rigs, and I'm sure the pollution from pumping the oil/fuel from the boat bilges will kill off any algae, especially if you throw some soap on it and make it sink to the bottom.

:D

[Agu]

News is that they've dumped 33 million gallons and recent rains have added 54 million gallons to the storage ponds :rolleyes: . Another 10 million gallons have been dumped into Bishop Harbor. Now they only have a billion gallons to go :confused:, I think there may be a flaw in their plan ??

Agu

[WaterKeeper]

:lol: Methinks that started with the idea to use RO for clean-up. You clean one gallon while producing an additional 2 to 3 gallons of RO waste. Not likely to stop the "leak in the dike" I would think.

[Mako]

Originally posted by kazzoo3
The volume of waste water that would have been dumped into the gulf is minor compared to the outflow of the Mississippi and Atchafalaya Rivers. Maybe they can put a massive RO unit at the outflow of those rivers? ;) There is so much nitrogen flowing out into the gulf from those rivers it makes the Piney Point project look like a pimple on a giants butt. :(

[Scuba_Dave]

So an aquarium DSB may fail after 4-5 years. How many years before we pollute the oceans enough for a crash? 1,000? And what happens then? But I guess we won't be around to worry about it.

[Gus]

That's pretty nuts. If the waste is phosphate based, then I bet algae will increase and then so will be amount of herbivors - don't you think???
You'd think they'd want to dump that further out to sea if not at all.