Why Nets?

[RedBeard]

I totally agree that cyanide use is horrible and that netting is better as a means to collect fish. My objection to this is why not help these people set up aquaculture facilities? As we all know the oceans are a limited resource and will one day become totally exploited and devoid of life unless measures are taken and people are educated about better ways to harvest fish with the least amount of impact on the environment. Obviously there is a lot of research to be done on the aquaculture of marine ornamentals but why not take this opportunity to get the ball rolling.

For a quick fix this is great, I'm not knocking this one bit. I would just like people to realize that harvesting directly from the oceans is something that won't last forever and we, the driving force of the ornamental fish trade market, bear the responsibility to inflict the least amount of damage on nature as possible.

[Rock Anemone]

RedBeard,
[welcome]

Cyanide caught fish usually die within weeks of being kept in an aquarium. That's why net caught fish are preferred.

Also, believe me, they are working on a lot of techniques to get most fish to breed successfully in captivity.

Rock Anemone:D

[MaryHM]

Currently there are only a minimal amount of fish species that can be aquacultured. The process is quite time and money consuming to research new species. You can't just set them up some tanks and say "Here, aquaculture it". You have to have researchers involved- and who pays the salaries for years while they research and develop culture of new species? It simply isn't an option for fish right now.

[firechild]

For many ornamental species, captive breeding is not an option. Two examples of fish that are not suited to aquaculture for different reasons are surgeonfish and two spot gobies.
Surgeonfish shoal in groups of tens to hundreds and use large areas of water to release eggs and sperm. So basically this is a pelagic spawning and the volumes of water needed to successfully do this (taking into account the pelagic larval stage) is not possible.
The two spot goby breeds in a burrow with the female burrying the male with the fertilised eggs. The male allows the babies to cannibalise resulting in a single offspring surviving. This means that it is not a species that could be economically aquacultured.

These are just 2 examples but show that for a variety of reasons, it is not a matter of putting a male and a female in a large tank and waiting for them to breed (as Mary has already pointed out). For many ornamental species, the life history is not well enough known to even attemp captive breeding and others have a life history that is too complex to be replicated in captivity.
I am all for the preservation of our reefs but I don't see a quick fix. I'm sure in the future we will have the knowledge and ability to aquaculture many more ornamental species, especially given the fact that there is so much work and research going into the aquaculture of ornamental species and also the aquaculture of non-ornamental fish such as bluefin tuna which was once thought to be impossible).

[npaden]

Aquaculturing can (note the use of "can" here not "will") cause more problems than it solves. Especially in locations where there is a natural reef.

The salmon fisheries are an example of how captive breeding is actually worse for the environment than controlled fishing of salmon.

FWIW, Nathan

[DJ88©]

Nathan,

Yes aquaculture done in the open ocean can make a mess. See and hear about it all the time here in BC. You should hear how many restaraunts refuse to serve Farmed salmon. That came about as most people ask if the salmon is wild caught or farmed.

But back to the topic at hand.

I am betting the aquacultrure that would happen with species for our hobby would be farmed in a warehouse type of situation. Tanks with feeding, different ages of fish etc.

Tho my assumptions could be out in left field.

How do you see that aquacultured fish for this hobby will have a detrimental effect on the reefs?

I highly doubt the growers will feed steriods and growth hormones as is done with salmon farming operations. They aren't looking to fatten up and grow clowns at a faster rate for human consumption. ;)

[mkirda]

Originally posted by DJ88
But back to the topic at hand.

DJ88,

The species that can be captive raised are already being captive-raised...

There are always going to be species that could be CR, but are not due to the economics. If a CR fish cost $100 each wholesale, but sold for $25-$50 each, who would buy it?

Evenually, the secrets for other fish will be unlocked, and more CR fish will be available. However, I see this type of aquaculture as being a primarily first world endeavor. It is quite capital intensive to set up, and requires a certain level of infrastructure that may not be available in the third world.

This is why I don't think aquaculture will ever be a panacea to the collectors.

Regards.
Mike Kirda

[DJ88©]

Mike,

I don't quite follow what your post is saying.

I know that there are many speices that are being captive raised and captive bred. I follow this quite closely in my travels on the net.

I also understand the investment and requirements of an aquaculture set up. Have experience with this first hand. Prior to me entering into this hobby.

Was this post directed to someone else?

My back to the topic at hand note was me mentioning the wild/farmed issues people have here in BC. Not the entire post.

:confused:

[SPC]

Originally posted by DJ88
How do you see that aquacultured fish for this hobby will have a detrimental effect on the reefs?

Well IMO it could have a detrimental effect by making the reefs less valuable to the native peoples. If we keep in mind that these are their reefs, then we should think in terms of what value the reef has for them.

BTW, fish collection for the ornamental trade is not whats killing the reefs, our lifestyles are. :(
Steve

[DJ88©]

If we keep in mind that these are their reefs, then we should think in terms of what value the reef has for them.

Very true. hmmm

If it were fesable to set up a farming operation in that area that uses the locals to keep the reefs alive. Say through rearing young then releasing a %age back. As long as they aren't treated with possible contaminants etc. Fish that may have been depeted in the area.

I guess there are all kinds of options/possibilities with this topic.

Hmm a compromise of some sort. Who knows. :D

Give me a bit to think some more and I'll see what I can come up with :D

[BSAJim]

Folks,

In improving what is being done, we need to create solutions
that can actually be implemented, and are sstainable over time.

"Start where you are - do what you can"

A true story as an example.......

A small country was struggling to feed itself. The had a very
low level of technology, and their planting metod was to push
a sharpened stick into the ground to make a hole for the seed.
This slowed and limited planting capacity, as the ground was
hard, and the stick required frequent sharpening and replacement.

The US stepped in and rocketed their technology forward by
giving them tractors with multiple attachments. This would
increase their farming capacity by 10X. Unfortunately, the
tractors were all abandoned a year later. Fuel suply and the
required maintenance were to challenging.

Another country stepped in. They gave the farmers some simple
handtools and showed them how to cut up an empty can and
put a metal point on their planting stick. This eliminated the
time wasted sharpeing and replacing planting sticks. The simple
solution only increased their planting capacity by 50%, but it
was sustanable and resulted in the country being able to feed
itself.

Eliminating poisns and giving them nets is the right answer IMO.

Jim

[SPC]

Originally posted by DJ88
Very true. hmmm

If it were fesable to set up a farming operation in that area that uses the locals to keep the reefs alive. Say through rearing young then releasing a %age back. As long as they aren't treated with possible contaminants etc. Fish that may have been depeted in the area.

I guess there are all kinds of options/possibilities with this topic.

I would love to see the day come, when representatives from the South Pacific Island Marine Life Farmers Association would make a plea to the world to stop killing their reefs. :)
Steve