no water changes?

[ravenmore]

Ran across a website of a hobbyist who propogates and sells his corals. When reading his website, he claims to not do water changes! He says that he gets by on HEAVY skimming and using B-ionic to replentish elements. Here is his website:

http://www.drmaccorals.com/sys-tmpl/door/

He seems to have success doing this. Do you guys think it's feasible to run a reef long term in this manner? He noticed (frankly as I have also) that water changes stress his corals.

Thanks,
-Mike

[bmw]

I dunno if is ok to post here--I guess someone will yell if it is not.
I have used b=ionic from the start of my 90gal, my 30 gal, and now my two 10 gal(yes, I am moving in the opposite direction of most).
I have not seen "stress" in any of the above--I do 20=25% water changes, from 2 weeks to a month in all.
Near as I can tell, the water changes in regard to b-ionic actually are a benefit--they reduce some chemical components that could otherwise be detrimental in the long run.
Just my interpretation of others thoughts-and my limited experience.
b.

[rshimek]

Hi Mike,

The artificials sea water in our tanks is well over dosed with most of the trace elements. Additionally our food adds more.

My feeling is that any replenishment of anything other than calcium is a waste of time and money, and may well be detrimental. However, if you do do this, then periodic water changes should be done to reduce the dissolved solid load.

Water changes, if done properly, should not distress anything.

[PghReefer]

Ron,

I was wondering about the effect of not doing water changes on the grow of the organisms in the tank. Do they release any factors into the water that, without regular changes, would retard their growth?

Thanks, Paul.

[Agu]

Just a comment on commercial facilities not doing "water changes". Every time they ship out a coral they're removing water and have to replace it with new water. Every time they get a shipment in they should be discarding the shipping/acclimation water, and replacing it with new water. In essence they're doing small daily water changes. Every time I swap corals with other reefers I end up replacing two to four gallons of mixed saltwater.

Agu

[Dr. Mac]

Dr. Ron,

Forgive me for barging in on your territory here, just responding to this as ravenmore had referenced my website. I appreciate your advice and have learned much from you over the last few years and respect your views very much and thank you for helping me and so many hobbyists. I recommended your book to a hobbyist that called me just last night that had gotten some very bad advice from a LFS--told him to keep corals at 1.019 SG because they die at higher levels of salinity and to use crushed live rock as a substrate---YIKES!

As far as water changes, I in fact do not do water changes except when I sell corals which is from one particular large system and at that are relatively minor. Maybe my wording is somewhat misleading when I say that the water changes stress the corals, this may be the case, but I actually find no need to do them. I have been in the hobby for many years and water changes where just the way it was done and there was not really much questioning it for years. Fossa and Nilsen in there book series, The Modern Coral Reef Aquarium (see page 264 vol 1), and in personal conversation, also do not recommend specific regular water changes and this caused me to think about going a bit further and that maybe I could get by without them or at least reduce them significantly. After having already followed your advice on establishing active DSBs and knowing that I had no measurable nitrates and no problems with any algae blooms in my established tanks, I simply began to lessen the water changes and eventually just didn't do any in SOME of my tanks. That was some time ago and those tanks are just going along better than ever and the practice became standard operating procedure in all my tanks which have been running for years. They all have DSB, lots of fish that are fed very well and lots of rapidly growing corals. So, while I do not mean to presume to tell someone else about water changes, I am just relating my personal observations and experience as it is often asked how I run my tanks (as it is of any hobbyist by fellow hobbyists)and I personally see no need in my established tanks for water changes. Others have, and I fully respect, their differing opinions and experiences on this and any other issue in this hobby, and some tanks and hobbyists may find a need to do water changes. In my larger coral grow-out systems I use large skimmers and refugiums that do have small macro algae beds lit 24hrs and also an active DSB. I use activated carbon on my systems for 2-3 days a month in a canister filter rotated on all my tanks to clear any yellowing of the water. So possibly with water changes, as with many aspects of this hobby, there are different ways to reach the same end--rapidly growing healthy colorful corals. I also have several species of clownfish, neon gobies, and orchid dottybacks that spawn regularly and are being raised in these systems. My experiences are with well established tanks and new hobbyists should certainly follow your advice for water changes, once they have established tanks they may then decide from their own personal experince to take a different approach.

Thanks, Mac

[PghReefer]

Actually, I'v been thinking about this a little more.

When we all discuss "water" changes, what are we really talking about? It seems to me that we are actually referring to "salt water" changes. When we replace our evaporation on a daily basis....then we are actually doing partial "water" changes all of the time by evaporation and top-off.

Now, the question remains whether there is a need to do "salt water" changes, and I suppose that would be up to the aquarist...however if you don not do "salt water" changes do you then need to be more careful about trace element and other additions

[rshimek]

Hi Folks,

While I think that regular changes of sea water can be over done, and Mac's points are well taken, I think that many hobbyists will find such changes beneficial.

I think the primary benefit is to reduce the accumulation of trace elements and organic constituents. Our artificial sea water mixes are well over-concentrated with trace elements and as we feed we add more in the foods. Many of these are toxic in relatively low concentrations. I think, but cannot prove, that many of the mysterious "tank wipe outs" are simply due to the over accumulation of some toxic substance or metabolite.

So... I use regular small changes as a prophylaxis in my systems. :D



[Edited by rshimek on 01-27-2001 at 07:55 AM]

[Sashimi]

This is a whole new prespective to me, Dr. Shimek. I thought water change is to suppliment depleted trace elements. I have never consider it the other way round. :) Thanks!