reef club topics

[aquafien]

what would you as local reefer like to see at a club meeting. this is the question that i would like to send out to everyone. in the club or not. lets get some idea's put together. it's your idea's that will make things happen.

[crazy4acros]

Monthly Frag swaps or sales, freebeeies to newbiees to get more and more people started in this great hobby. There is a large group here in AZ and i notice they post/give starter frags free to newbiees and is a reason why it keeps growing! I comend aquafien for his efforts of keeping this club from diminishing i also agree that dues should be dropped due to it might be discouraging to newcomers. Just a more of an informal group of people just having fun for the love of the hobby.

[El Jefe9830]

I agree with Crazy4acros....I think it should be a more informal thing. I personally like to meet people in the hobby, learn from them, and see how they approach the hobby.

I personally think that people are willing to help newbies as I have had a few people give me frags for my Nano and big tank to help me get started, and I know I will do the same when I have an established tank. I am all about helping people as much as I can.

I personally think that where we are lacking is an online site with forums for our area. We need a good working site where we can build a community of people. A site with a forum similar to Reef Central, but on a smaller scale would be a great addition to the NM reefers. I personally would like a site where I can post questions, answer questions, and basically just build an online community. Also, a forum would be a good place for people to sell and buy equipment, frags, corals, fish, etc. I know a lot of people have a lot of things other people want, but don't know how to tell people they would like to sell or buy it. I personally have purchased many things from local reefers by just posting an inquiry in this forum.

Again, I am willing to help in any way I can, and really think that we have a great number of reefers in the Albuquerque area. I know that I have personally been helped by many within the last couple of months.

Great topic, BTW, Aquafien.

[aquafien]

holy crap batman is that the notorious thor. the king of acro's, the master sps, or the only one that would put angels with $300 sps colony. it is an honor to how you responding to my thread. hell to the master sps. hey thor what's going on. how is arizona. yeah i think we need to turn the club around.

[GreenUku]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=10870339#post10870339 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by El Jefe9830
I personally think that where we are lacking is an online site with forums for our area. We need a good working site where we can build a community of people. A site with a forum similar to Reef Central, but on a smaller scale would be a great addition to the NM reefers. I personally would like a site where I can post questions, answer questions, and basically just build an online community. Also, a forum would be a good place for people to sell and buy equipment, frags, corals, fish, etc. I know a lot of people have a lot of things other people want, but don't know how to tell people they would like to sell or buy it. I personally have purchased many things from local reefers by just posting an inquiry in this forum.


What don't you like about the RC forum?

It would be nice if the NMOK site were updated regularly, but one of the best things about having a forum on RC is that random people find us pretty consistently.

I have no idea why, but meeting attendance seems to ebb and flow. There was a meeting maybe 5 months ago with like 3 people, then after that we had meeting with closer to 20 people...

I do think frag swapping (especially freebies) should be a/the #1 proirity. Close behind that should be demos/how-to's, though people don't seem to be quite as interested. Of course just getting together and talking is one of the biggest draws.

I know that one thing the dues go to is registering the club with the national marine orginization (MASNA), which among other things, allows NMOK to get a forum on RC (that's an RC requirement). You'd have to ask the NMOK officers what's happened to the rest of the dues. That being said, I think last year's dues were $15 per household and you didn't have to pay to attend meetings (?). I'm not sure the club can run completely for free and have an online presence.

[crazy4acros]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=10870872#post10870872 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by aquafien
holy crap batman is that the notorious thor. the king of acro's, the master sps, or the only one that would put angels with $300 sps colony. it is an honor to how you responding to my thread. hell to the master sps. hey thor what's going on. how is arizona. yeah i think we need to turn the club around.

:lol: thats too funny!! man you give me way too much credit but thanks hommie :D

[El Jefe9830]

There is not much wrong with the RC forum except that if you try to tell someone how to get to the local forum on RC it is very hard to find. Whereas, if we had a local forum, we would just have to give a URL. That is probably the biggest.

The second reason that RC is difficult to use is because you have to get a certain amount of posts before you can posts things for sale. I personally have no problem buying using equipment in good shape, and actually prefer it as it is usually much cheaper than new stuff. Don't get me wrong, I understand why RC has this rule, but there are many people with used equipment, frags, fish, etc for sale that could help some of us get a better set up without spending the thousands you would trying to do it with brand new stuff. I know I am not the only one that that doesn't have $600 to drop on a new skimmer, $2500 to drop on a tank set up, $50 to $100 per corals.

Other than that, RC is great, but those are the two main reasons that I think we need our own operational site and forums together. That is just my humble opinion, though.

[moonpower]

I know that one thing the dues go to is registering the club with the national marine orginization (MASNA), which among other things, allows NMOK to get a forum on RC (that's an RC requirement).
Greenuku, I gave $20.00 at the beginning of the club being started to help with the MASNA and I believe there were others that did too, besides their $15.00 dues.
I agree with you about having the rc forum. One place everyone from different states can find us and the knowledge here is unlimited. Reef central could be the new "club house" and we just meet somewhere for some of the other things once in a while. Everyone is busy and here you can jump in check out what is going on, contribute and leave to do other things, whenever it is good for you. It would be nice to have our own website but it is failing. I do believe that we use this more than anything else.
I like the idea of a due free club with reef stuff swaps or even maybe auctions. The problem there seems to be having a regular meeting place. I really wouldn't mind having a meeting place at my house every month but I don't want to be responsible for drinks or food all the time. Especially when you don't know how many are showing up! I realize that alot of the reefers have children too so we might need a place that has a playground for kids. Like maybe a park. That would mean changing the meeting to a daytime meeting probably on a Saturday.

If dues are needed than I would like them to be uses to help the club buy things. That helps the club! Maybe some of those bergia nudibranches or special corals to share around the club members.

WE are the CLUB so we can decide.

[GreenUku]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=10873573#post10873573 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by moonpower
Greenuku, I gave $20.00 at the beginning of the club being started to help with the MASNA and I believe there were others that did too, besides their $15.00 dues.


You're right. I did that too, but I forgot.

[aquafien]

and where did it get you

[reign]

Everyone that is interested in the local club should come to the next meeting (who knows where it will be) and come together to figure out a resolution.. I mean we cant lose another club ! what this will be the third or fourth!

That would be sad!

[reign]

Rant: why have we not heard from any of the officials in the club on this forum? are they PMing everyone else or using the NMOK forum for this matter?
I am so out of the loop!

[GreenUku]

I think they are probably just not reading the forums at the moment.

The next meeting should be Oct. 19th.

I think the simple thing we need to keep momentum is just to get people to show up to meetings. Maybe easier said than done. I don't know that we need any particular resolution at this point, but we do need critical mass, so to speak :)

[Scooter12ga]

IIRC, it was foretold to everybody that the 'meetings' in the summer months would be informal gatherings because of busy schedules, summer vacations, etc... I believe the first meeting to resume an official 'agenda' was going to be the October meeting.

Besides, just because we have one meeting with low attendance doesn't mean the club is not supported. I hosted the August meeting and though I didn't count the number, I would be very surprised if there wasn't 20+ people in my home that day. July was Jen's turn and she had good turn out (10-15). Peggy hosted June, if memory serves me correctly, and had 10-15 people show up. Not bad for unofficial summer 'meeting' gatherings.

We, the club members, are the only people to be blamed for low attendance and I will be the first to admit my fault for not participating this month. I had planned to attend the September meeting, but unfortunately due to end-of-quarter workload and an insane amount of training and travel coming up I decided to work late that night instead. Frankly, I got distracted by work, forgot about the meeting, and didn't remember until it was too late to make a last-minute appearance.

[Scooter12ga]

Crud - Sorry for the double post...stupid server timeouts.

[moonpower]

Yes, we were told that summer would be informal. So here it is Oct. and WHO is hosting???? I don't like the last minute notices ( or same week).

[Mrs_Witchdoctor]

Hi Gang,
First, I would like to say that I found out about these postings this afternoon and I'm shocked that concerns are being vented on Reef Central rather being brought to me, Eric, Alex, Jason,(the club officials for those that don't know) or discussed at a meeting as a group.
Kevin (aquafien) I don't know why you thought this was ok. I'm just going to say it wasn't necessary. If you want to start your own club, don't let us get in your way. Peggy (moonpower) I know you and I have never really clicked and that's ok, what's not ok is that you continue to talk about me instead of to me. Second, I like a lot of the ideas for things we can do as a club. Hopefully, we can make them happen. Third, I feel attacked here and I have a response.....

I'm sorry that there are problems here that could not be talked about person to person. The club did take the summer off from formal activities due to an anticipated drop in attendance. The plan was to hopefully get back together as a group in the fall (October meeting) to pick up where we left off. The dues that have been collected have been put in the bank for use when we needed it. We used some for our MASNA registration and some towards the pre-purchase of MASNA calendars that were sold earlier in the year. Some of us did donate an extra few bucks to get the club started. Eric and I put in an extra $30 on top of our dues, and time to get this going because there were so few of us at the time. All money not used as stated, is still in the bank. I also want to remind everyone that this club was started for a community of people who could share ideas and help each other. As far as my lack of response until now. I've not had a day off since Sept 24th and wasn't aware of this. Drama happens everywhere but we seem to be fighting it every couple of months. So here's the deal. Most of you have enjoyed our get-togethers and benefited from the exchange of ideas. Which we can continue to keep informal as the summer months were, if that's preferred. We started the club - mostly for beginners with the hopes of graduating to bigger and better things. Albuquerque is a big place, if there is support for a more advanced club I say go for it. We wanted to support people who were beginning their first tank or still needed support and ideas for an existing one and those who wanted to be helpful. Our mission is to support each other in community and knowledge. And support is exactly what we will continue to do. The next meeting on October 19th will be at our house. We will talk about the issues expressed above and all are welcome but check the drama at the door. It's not helpful to anyone.
We have always tried to do what was best for the club, with no personal agenda. These continued lashings make it really hard to want to continue to help those who want it. There are some things that need to be improved upon and there are already plans in the works to make changes for the better. My sincere appreciation goes out to those who have supported our intentions and been patient with us as we work out the bugs. I hope that we can make it as a club. We have put a lot of heart and effort into the creation of a place for people to find support. Not be the total support, but to join all of you together to support each other. I hope you'll join us in continuing to do so.
Happy Tanks, Jen

[leena]

Hey Jen, Peg, and All...

From what everyone is saying I don't think there is a problem with the club. Where the lack is in the communication. Informal gatherings or not, you need someone to keep minutes, record agendas and keep track of old and new business so things don't get swept under the table. Having where club meetings are as part of an agenda is only a part of that.

I've talked to Jason about it, perhaps the rest of the officers should contact him and talk about nominating someone new for this position. Having him as a sec. is hurting this club.

For the folks who want more out of the club, the easy way is to put more in. If you have a great idea get off your butt and make it happen. Talking about things in this thread is a great start. Keep it going and follow through.

[El Jefe9830]

I know that I am new to the Salt Water Hobby, and don't feel that I should really have a voice as of yet in anything related to the club, although I am active in several other forums for things like racing and online gaming. I am fairly familiar with online communities that is probably why you see me posting in just about every thread on RC in the NMOK section and throughtout many of the other forums here on RC. I probably have the highest post count of anyone from New Mexico, not sure though as I have done no research to support my claim :).

I am not a drama guy by any means, and I think that most of you I have met seem like people who just enjoy the hobby, and it has taken a hold of you like it has me. But in looking at the last sections, and from some of the conversations with people throughout the city, I don't feel any kind of unity within the Salt Water Aquarium Enthusiasts in Albuquerque.

Being that I am so new to the hobby, and that I have pretty much indulged myself into the hobby over the last 4 months spending almost $3500 on salt water wet and dry goods and many hours getting everything set up, I feel I need to say something, probably not a good idea. I signed up to RC in June of this year I believe. I did not start posting until August I believe, and did not find the Local Forums Section until mid-August or somewhere in there. I only found them from talking to someone at a local fish store, or else it might have taken me longer to get to them. They are under all the sponsor ads on RC, so I just thought that is was sponsor ads all the way to the bottom of that page. That is one of the reasons that a forum of our own would be a benefit in my opinion, but maybe we don't have the online traffic consistency for something like that yet.

Second, I read through all the posts on here, and I don't believe that anyone was attacking Jen, maybe I am wrong. I posted in a different thread that I knew Jen has been busy with real life things as I had talked to you on the phone after a PM on here. I didn't feel there was any drama until that last post, but again I am new. Kevin, I believe had good intentions with posting this thread, but he has since been banned for trying to selling things without having 50 posts (Another reason why a local forum would be nice, IMHO).

There have been so many people that helped me so far with things being as much as a Newbie as I am. Jason at Emporer's Ocean and the guys at Coral Island are probably the most specific example of this. I have not even spent tons of money at either location (like I am sure some people do), but they still seem to love to help you out. (Jason did sell me my 300 gallon at a hell of a deal, so can't beat that). After that, the most help I have received has been from Kevin and Peggy. Kevin hooked me up with a lot of his used equipment at great prices, and everything has worked like brand new. Between the used tank that Jason got me, and the used equipment that I have purchased from Kevin and others, I have managed to start a pretty good set up without spending a small fortune.

I know as a newbie trying to join the club, it is near impossible, and I have pretty much given up. Most of the links on NMOK don't work, I sent mails with no response whatsoever until I posted here, and was sent directions to the last meeting on Thursday or Wednesday before. I own two businesses, have a family, a house I am remodeling, two cars I am building, and a Salt Water Aquarium System that I am trying to get all set up, last minute notice does not work for me.

It seems that the outcasts of the club, Kevin and Peggy (Just from Jen's note, I got that impression), have been the ones that contacted me, allowed me to come by their houses, see their set ups, etc. They both gave me frags, and Kevin sold me equipment. Jason at Emporer's Ocean and the guys at Coral Island have done much of the same, shared their knowledge, showed me how they plumbed their tanks, what the best processes are, etc. I am a customer at Coral Island and Emporer's Ocean for life just because of the help they have given me from day one of walking into their stores.

Anyways, as a beginner, if I wasn't so involved in other online forums and familiar with things, I would have gone through RC and NMOK, and moved on without ever talking to anyone, but the people at the LFS. I by no means want to be part of drama, as life brings enough of that to us as it is. I just wanted to meet people who like the hobby, share their experiences, and help me get the right ideas and equipment to give me the ability to keep from killing any fish or corals.

Damn.....That became a book, guess I just wanted to share all my experience so far. Not to start drama, scold anyone, or any such things. Just that I am the most active new person on the forums, and wanted to share what I felt when first coming to the Albuquerque Community and RC/NMOK. I think we have a great community, and I have been helped by many people and many LFS owner's and employees.

Corban

[El Jefe9830]

LOL.......BTW, I lied about the highest post count. Moonpower has 481 posts, that is some major posting. Keep up the good work Moonpower.

:)

[El Jefe9830]

Another thing, I forgot. Membership fees of $15 a year per household is MORE than reasonable. It costs about $15/mth for any decent shared hosting to keep a website online. Not to mention the costs for MASNA, and other things.

I have hosting that runs almost $500/mth, so that gives you an idea of what it can cost if you need high end hosting.

[moonpower]

Thanks for the kind words Corban and leena.
I never attacked anyone... what I attacked was:
The last minute notices of where the meetings were and
the lack of communication and lack of involvment.

I am for this open discussion. Not everyone can make it to every meeting.

[reign]

all the meetings are at the same time every month I just think alot of people lose sight of that...As far as where they are going to take place is a different story..not knowing if your driving to the westside or the foothills can make a difference... I think more notice would help...
as far as active members is concerned there are many lurkers or longtime members(rc) that read articles and post little who are very experienced aquarists ( i can think of a few: ahman,crazy4,red?)... I agree with moon!

You have many aquarists who were in RC and RL ten years ago ...who also go to WWM
that just dont speak or see the need to

[asfullax]

Hey all,

Well. I think most of us felt that this would come, and it is later then I anticipated. Unfortunately, most of the comments here are right and wrong.

First off, I was trying to keep my personal life out of this but here goes. I apologize for not being around lately, and I have tried to get to each meeting but last meeting was too much. My mother had a severe stroke followed by a Heart attack a few months ago which has kept me from doing many other things that I wanted. On top of that my father was diagnosed with cancer very recently, thus my no-show at the last meeting.

Aside from that, my life is hectic. but I am not willing to let the club drop. I firmly believe that much good can come of it. Although here are some problems I see:

1st, Communication SUCKS, period without excuse. I have been working on the new site for some time and finally, this weekend, I plan on going live with the new web server with many features such as updated content, calendar, revised forums (Mostly as an informational resource.) I sincerely hope that this thread provides many ideas, and shows that it only takes a few to change.

2nd, Member feedback is GREATLY lacking. Numerous times we have asked members for feedback and ideas, rather then the board stuffing unwanted content down everyone’s internet connection. Every improvement request such as "less formal" has been implemented thus far. and I want to thank greenuku, leena, and moonpower for their input.

3rd, MY feeling is that we need a structured location. Visiting each others house is fun but stressful for everyone. Trying to figure out where it is, when, availability and the hosts have to worry about feeding or not feeding everyone. I know for one, I can't afford $100+ on food to have people over. so we need to change this structure to better suit everyone. If we do change locations each time, we need to have the locations communicated at least 3 months out.

4th. I know the entire board apologizes for NOT executing any events lately, the events we had planned fell through and was taken as a lesson learned to seek alternate ideas. and I want to stress everyone that the dues / reg fees that all members have donated are being held onto. I for one have been paying out of pocket all server and hosting fees for the website. This translates into about $30/month. This will not change and I do not want it to.

5th, we have a good club, but most of us are into the reef hobby < 2-3 years. this means that frags are not as bountiful as other national / large city clubs. I think we all now have Jen and Eric’s mushrooms and Xenias. I have fragged my Monti > 20 times and usually come back home with the frags I bring.

Purchasing items such as rare frags, berghia's, etc is risky due to tank crashes, environment and club dynamics. Lets talk about this at the next meeting.

I hope everyone understands that open communication is something that needs to happen, we need to figure out what we want. If the club wants to change, the best way is to ask. As always, I am VERY happy to answer e-mails, PM's, Calls, etc...

Finally if there is no location already provided, I will welcome the meeting to my home this next meeting, although, last time it was at my place only a small handfull showed up. I am assuming it is because I live in Rio Rancho, so I have stopped offering due to the low number turnout. If everybody is OK with it, lets plan it. Also, if we need to change the day / time, lets talk it it out.

[moonpower]

Alex sorry to hear about your parents.

Jen has said the meeting would be at her apt. Personally, I just would like it to be a place everyone can come to and be comforable.

[asfullax]

I talked with Rob at southwestreef today and he is still offering the store as a meeting location spot. I would like to reccomend that we take the offer over the next few months since it is a neutral spot and fairly convienent for everyone.

If anybody has any other ideas, please let me know asap, I am about to update the site with the new information.

[israelnajar]

Man that really sucks. I have to be out of town all week and I wont be back until Saturday. I really enjoy the LFS meetings, even though we only have had one so far. Anyway I hope everything goes well.


Edit: I have 650 post count :) But that is probably mostly due to the fact I was unemployed for 5 months and didn't have much to do. But they are probably split between the club forum and the other forums on RC.

Corben I still have frags available for you but I have been extremely busy the last week and this week I will be out of town. But like I said the frags are still available.

[El Jefe9830]

Israel......Thanks man. I would like to get them from you at your convienence. I know you are busy, working too hard. LOL

Just let me know, no hurry though, so don't stress about it. I just appreciate the help.

That post count is mind boggling. :). Keep up the good work.

[reign]

if you want some frags Ive got lots of green shrooms, grn sinularia, gold spaghetti leather, grn monti caps.. just let me know if your interested.

[reign]

well at least that clears up the confusion next meeting Jen and Eric's pad time? what 6-7 ish?

see ya.

[asfullax]

Yeah, it will be at jen and erics tonight areund 6ish.

see you all there

btw: site updated

[reefey]

asfullax although i think i would be great to have the meeting at southwest reef but there are two things with that. one, is it really any bigger than jens and erics apartment and second i know that there are members from other lfs and i don't know how it would be with other competitors in each others stores. there might be some hostility there. although there shouldn't because i know that we are all in the same hobby and suppose to be a fun hobby. but i also understand that a business is all about making money though. if the club is just asking southwest reef it might also look like the club is favoring southwest were as the club should be favoring all lfs.

[asfullax]

Reefey,

Although I understand the concern, we have been through this and quite frankly, something has to change. Meeting at peoples houses is very frustrating for everyone because it is always a new place, and, well, I think I stated the items above. :)

Rob from SWRC was asked, and by no means is Rob involved in the club hierarchy, if he is there, it is strictly because he is a visitor / speaker. I have NO problems with other LFS involvement, but honestly, SWRC is the only one that has volunteered the space.

On to space, some of the meeting grounds we have been to are large, some small. Many meetings I have felt like a sardine and I feel that can discourage many prospective members. If the club was to stay with only a few people, I would not worry, but we have seen membership spice and decline and during the strong points, a house just doesn't cut it.

Here are some reasons I would rather use a LFS:
Access to salt water utilities
Access to materials for demonstration
Livestock to show
fraging utilities
Water checking
Space (which is larger usable space)
Convenience knowing where / when it is.

Like I have said at just about every meeting, ANYBODY who wants to volunteer space for our meetings is welcome to and we will probably accept. Rob is the only one who has actively and passively agreed to our usage.

I am hopeful that we will address and resolve this issue once and for all as this has been a sticky point from the start and I fear our growth / abilities are being severely limited by such conflicts. After all, we are a nonpartisan club and will always be so.

:D see you all in a bit...

BTW: The meeting agenda is now online and I will bring copies for the first 20 people. :rollface:

[reefey]

well the meeting was a sucess. wish more people would have shown up but we went over some good issues. great job everyone.

[Rackyrane]

This has been a very enlightening and depressing thread.
As a relative newbie to the hobby, I never knew there would be so many politics involved. I have read about problems other clubs around the country have, but never thought our club would be like that. I think we have some really great people in our club and I feel our officers sincerely try as hard as they can. They volunteer time, resources, etc without getting much back in return. I appreciate all that they try to do.
Personally, I look at the club as a place to learn alot more about I hobby that I have come to love and unfortunately have become severely addicted to---Reefers Anonymous anyone? :).
As someone said above, life gives us enough drama.
It seems the officers are more than willing to try and enact reasonable suggestions.
I am glad that I joined the club although I rarely get to come because I usually work late on Friday evenings.
I think that I could come to more meetings if they were held on a Saturday.
I don't really care where the meetings are held. I really enjoy looking at others tanks. It would be alright to have them at one of the LFS also--would probably end up buying more stuff though.
I never even knew that people were swapping/giving away frags.
Since I really don't know many people, I guess that is to be expected.
Hopefully, the dust will settle and the club will only get better.

[reefey]

well rackyrane alot of stuff got sorted out in the last meeting and it looks like we are going to have some meetings at some of the lfs. you should introduce yourself and i dont know where you live but i live in the hieghts and your more than welcome to come by and check out my tank. there are some of my friends over here that would welcome you also. but any ways thanks for the post.

[Rackyrane]

Thanks alot reefey. It's always great to look at others tanks. I hope to be able to frag stuff in the future and give it away. Right now, I don't have much in my tank. Am working on it though!
I am going to try and make it to the next meeting.

[reefey]

i think its going to be at southwest reef.

[El Jefe9830]

Rackyrane, welcome. I am probably just as new as you. I signed up to RC a while ago, but didn't actual find the NMOK forum until about August or something.

My tank is set up yet, but my 55gallon is. You can come by anytime. I live in the Heights, Eubank and I-40 area close to Los Altos Golf Course.

[reefey]

wow it seem that there are alot of people in the heights. we should have a tour of the heights group. i don't know if anyone know how a poker run works but instead of bar hoping we could reef hop what would people think of this. i know of atleast five or six people in the heights. so who's up

[Myrddraal]

I'm in the heights too, but don't have any water in my tank yet.

[reefey]

myrddraal would you still be in.

[moonpower]

so what is the area of " the heights"?

[reefey]

i don't know i we have to see who will be in. it might have to be something in January. i think im going to start a new thread about this.