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buffalobunch
07/17/2007, 09:58 AM
Well, I had been looking at a female lineatus wrasse at ATR for a few months now. When I bought my pair at AT I went to ATR and was going to buy another female so that my male would perhaps have better color. I wanted to introduce them at the same time but the ATR female decided to go carpet surfing the day I was going to buy her. So I waited. After frag on Saturday I went down and decided to buy her. I brought her home and put her in the tank Saturday night. I did not QT fish because she has been there since November, which is a big reason I bought her as well. On Sunday morning, my female from AT seemed cool with her. Almost like "woohoo another girl in the tank", then suddenly it was like a switch got flipped. The female from AT went over and communicated with the hippo tang, the flame angel and the male lineatus to corner the ATR female. Once she was cornered the female from AT proceeded to try to beat the poop out of her. Luckily my husband was standing there to see all of this. He yelled that I'd better come do something. So I got out 2 nets and was going to corral her into the big one with the smaller one. Didn't need to. I put the big net in and she nearly jumped into it. I think she knew what it was and that it was her only way out. So, long story short. I will be taking her down to pets inc today. Andy said they are getting some males in today and one is on special order and the other was for the store to sell. Hopefully these males come into today and they can pair her up with the extra male. AT has a male but will only give me 30% of what she is worth. Which I think is ridiculous. I would think she'd be worth more than that since they already have a male. So any one wanting a pair, keep checking at pets inc. Here is a pic of her.
http://reefcentral.com/gallery/data/500/147411100_1066.JPG

Philwd
07/17/2007, 11:18 AM
Sorry to hear that. Fairy wrasses should be acclimated to a tank that already has fairies.

Here's what I do. I learned this from the wrasse experts. I bought a couple acrylic containers with slits and suction cups on ebay. THey have a sliding top. about 12" long. I put a pvc pipe in there along with the wrasse. Then I let the wrasse stay in there for 2-3 days. Let's the other fish get used to the newcomer. Dramatically reduces the aggression when the new fish is released. I have not had a single wrasse introduction issue since I've used them.

I have the containers still in my tank as temp frag racks. The wrasses I acclimated this way often go back into them. Sometimes to get away from another fish. Sometimes to get out of the flow. The other fish don't go near them. Thought it was interesting the fish remember their safe haven.

buffalobunch
07/17/2007, 11:41 AM
I really just want her to be happy. I thought I could provide that for her but I can't. I would rather her have a mate then add undue stress to my tank. I was rather bummed about the whole situation.

aztbs
07/17/2007, 12:03 PM
Phil - what did you search for on ebay to find those containers?

Philwd
07/17/2007, 12:08 PM
Fliger had given me a link. Let me see if I can find it.

Philwd
07/17/2007, 12:35 PM
TIff - here it is. He offering different sizes now but will custom order any size you want.

isolation chamber (http://cgi.ebay.com/ISOLATION-STATION-Live-Coral-FW-SW-Safe_W0QQitemZ4354103908QQihZ001QQcategoryZ46308QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem)

random_ryan
07/17/2007, 12:37 PM
i think i am going to order a couple.

kirstenk
07/17/2007, 12:41 PM
Those things are cool.

sardonicscorpio
07/17/2007, 02:41 PM
those are so pretty

dcall
07/17/2007, 04:39 PM
I have one of the chambers and have used it many times

Doglover_50
07/17/2007, 05:02 PM
Sounds like Phil crate trained his wrasses.

buffalobunch
07/17/2007, 06:55 PM
The girl made it to pets inc safely. I got there as they were acclimating the 2 super males. Wow were they beautiful. So hopefully if all goes well, there is a silver lining to this cloud and she gets a boyfriend.

bajabum
07/17/2007, 08:48 PM
I use a big net to acclimate new fish with my PB tang. The new fish will hide in the net until accepted. The others seem to know what to expect if they go in the net. They become the next new fish to be introduced.

senatormoe31
07/18/2007, 11:18 AM
FIRST!!!!!!!DON"T PUT YOUR FISH IN NETS!!!! SECOND, Take some responsibility for what is happening in your tank. Blaming a fish for being aggresive towards a new fish is a cop-out. He/she is the same fish you introduced, YOU changed the game by adding a new fish. THIRD, if you think your fish are coordinating attacks, you are projecting your personality to thiers. JUST ADMIT, you got impatient for something new and wanted to impose your "imagined harmony" into your tank and golly, it didn't work. FOURTH, if you're not happy with lfs policy's, just get yourself a half a million bucks or so ( $500,000.00 ) and start your own store, and then you can make all the policies you want. Bet someone at sometime won't like some of them.

AZReefDiva
07/18/2007, 11:53 AM
<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=10364156#post10364156 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by senatormoe31
FIRST!!!!!!!DON"T PUT YOUR FISH IN NETS!!!! SECOND, Take some responsibility for what is happening in your tank. Blaming a fish for being aggresive towards a new fish is a cop-out. He/she is the same fish you introduced, YOU changed the game by adding a new fish. THIRD, if you think your fish are coordinating attacks, you are projecting your personality to thiers. JUST ADMIT, you got impatient for something new and wanted to impose your "imagined harmony" into your tank and golly, it didn't work. FOURTH, if you're not happy with lfs policy's, just get yourself a half a million bucks or so ( $500,000.00 ) and start your own store, and then you can make all the policies you want. Bet someone at sometime won't like some of them.

WOW! It looks like someone has on a super-tight pair of crankypants today!

First, I believe she was taking responsibility for what was happening in her tank. The title of her post was "I made a mistake".

Secondly, I don't really think she thinks her fish are having meetings and coordinating attacks. She is using what's called "personification", which is projecting human qualities to non-human objects. Many people, including professional writers, use this to make a story more interesting, or to convey a particular idea. By reading some other posts written by this lady, you will find that her posts are not just lists of facts, but include a little of her witty and likeable personality.

Finally, LIGHTEN UP!:D

buffalobunch
07/18/2007, 11:56 AM
<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=10364156#post10364156 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by senatormoe31
FIRST!!!!!!!DON"T PUT YOUR FISH IN NETS!!!! SECOND, Take some responsibility for what is happening in your tank. Blaming a fish for being aggresive towards a new fish is a cop-out. He/she is the same fish you introduced, YOU changed the game by adding a new fish. THIRD, if you think your fish are coordinating attacks, you are projecting your personality to thiers. JUST ADMIT, you got impatient for something new and wanted to impose your "imagined harmony" into your tank and golly, it didn't work. FOURTH, if you're not happy with lfs policy's, just get yourself a half a million bucks or so ( $500,000.00 ) and start your own store, and then you can make all the policies you want. Bet someone at sometime won't like some of them.

Dude, you need to learn some rc etiquette if your going to be part of this site. Capitalizing words to make your point is, well just rude. This is your 2nd post. I can appreciate that you "work in the hobby." But that doesn't give you the right to come on here and start bashing someone you don't even know. I just your 3rd post in another thread that you did the same thing to that person. Coming into this forum with that attitude will not get you any respect or friends in this community. I have accepted responsibility for the situation. I corrected it as well. And just because I think a LFS is pretensious for wanting to give 30% of what a fish is worth versus 50% is well my humble opinion. I invite you to slow down with your accusations.

pupfish
07/18/2007, 10:26 PM
PM'ing you. Sorry to hear about the wrasse, lovely fish. Senatormoe ain't a Martin Moe, that's for sure. Lay off buffalobunch, your sig yammers about the importance of hobbyists' researching and trying to do something beneficial for this thing we do - well she is trying, which is a heck of a lot more than the average chump who builds their aquatic version of a Ken & Barbie playhouse - or just as useless - a living version of a Swarovoski display case.

Now after saying that, buffalobunch, let me "attack" you:D It totally sucks, but the old saying - "A third for you, a third for me and a third for the taxman" is pretty standard in the industry. I know it's poopy, wrong, etc. But not unusual. If Pet's Inc. is giving you more count yourself superlucky. I saw a guy bring in a group of stunning Bosemanni rainbows (easily worth $12 @) and he only got $2 for them a peice. I saw them in the 3 or 4 dollar tank a half-hour later.

senatormoe31
07/19/2007, 12:21 AM
Well, I wasn't trying to attack anyone in specific, or at all, in the first place. I didn't know that the simple use of CAPS would inspire such hate, but o.k. i won't use them anymore. And i don't know who pupfish is but you don't know me or my knowledge level (and by the way I know and have spent an hour or so talking with M. MOE) but I was just expressing an opinion with about 15 yrs of continuous salt experience. If you don't like it, meaning my advise, then write something helpful, not just pat people on the back and hand um a hanky and lollie. :> that's all I'm sayin. you and reef girl etc. are being the haters, I am trying to help. Just so ya know reef girl I am light hearted and easy going and don't need a literature lesson from you, but you are talking about fictional things/and your feelings in relation to living entities. that's all. sorry if i hurt any feelings. I'll tip-toe thru YOUR world so as not to offend.

Reef-o-Roni
07/19/2007, 12:38 AM
:lol:

Reef-o-Roni
07/19/2007, 12:40 AM
<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=10364156#post10364156 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by senatormoe31
FIRST!!!!!!!DON"T PUT YOUR FISH IN NETS!!!! SECOND, Take some responsibility for what is happening in your tank. Blaming a fish for being aggresive towards a new fish is a cop-out. He/she is the same fish you introduced, YOU changed the game by adding a new fish. THIRD, if you think your fish are coordinating attacks, you are projecting your personality to thiers. JUST ADMIT, you got impatient for something new and wanted to impose your "imagined harmony" into your tank and golly, it didn't work. FOURTH, if you're not happy with lfs policy's, just get yourself a half a million bucks or so ( $500,000.00 ) and start your own store, and then you can make all the policies you want. Bet someone at sometime won't like some of them.

Let's see a full tank shot!!!;)

Oh ya Welcome..

dream54ing
07/19/2007, 01:41 AM
yo senator, slow you roll.
we are all here to help each other. i dont think anyone cares if you have 15 or 150 years of experence if you come off blashing. i know your expressing you opinion, but there are ways to explain things so it wont come out so harsh. if you dont like what she doing, dont read her thread.

PhxPhish
07/19/2007, 02:00 AM
I think senator might be coming off a bit strong but it's definitely warranted; Just pointing all his angst and frustration towards one single individual. Considering the fact he's been in the business for 15 years he more than likely has seen his fair share of people who are just plain oblivious to what's going on in their tank.

I have 2 simple questions for you...
1. What size tank were these wrasses in?
2. If you really truly cared so much about the health of the fish and "just want her to be happy" then why would it really matter how much credit you received back for her? I would sooner give my fish away to someone who could take care of it then trade it into any store.

pc1blues
07/19/2007, 03:20 AM
Here is the rub guys..Problem with being fairly new to this forum is you have not quite got the feel for the individual personalities or subtleties of there posts. This takes a bit of time to get to know the person and their posts. Being fairly new here myself I am just beginning to learn about these folks. Seeing and reading many of buffalobunch's posts I believe that she is a very responsible individual and reefer. We all make many mistakes along this journey of keeping a small part of the ocean in our homes. If you claim never to have made a mistake or a wrong decision in either purchasing equipment or livestock during your years in the business.. well you know what. I believe that buffalobunch was just lamenting that her error was going to cost her. That she was only going to be able to recover 30% and was wishing it could have been a bit more. I believe that that was in itself a minor issue (though nobody likes to lose money) and that her concern for the fish was most paramount in her mind and push came to shove she would have most likely given the fish away if need be.
Having said that senatormoe31 your extensive experience in this hobby will greatly enhance many of our knowledge and will help to keep us from making other mistakes. Please continue to share your knowledge and experience but take a bit of time to get to know these fine folks on the forum. Thanks.

senatormoe31
07/19/2007, 08:36 AM
Thanks for the constructive crytisism. I here you all. O.K. all is good.
I just don't like to candy coat things, but i can adjust how I present myself.
Never said I was the foremost expert, just someone with Lots of practical info, lessons from mistakes made, ideas based on 3 years experience helping people in a retail/service setting.
THX

senatormoe31
07/19/2007, 08:51 AM
And, just to let Reef-a-roni know; I will be posting as many pics as I can as soon as I get a descent camera over here to record some shots.
I've got 3 pairs of gobies/dartfish spawning regularly and would love to share pics and info with others who have the same thing.
The three pairs are:
Ptereleotris grammica
Paragobiodon lacunicolus
gobiodon okinawae
I had a fourth pair --Priolepis nocturnus, but the female became gravid and then developed an internal parasite or something and dissappeared one day with no trace and with no outward signs of ill health. I think ( based on some research ) that she had an intestinal worm.
ANYWAY... I ramble
but look for the thread marked "Gobies"

Pics of my tanks are on the customer picture wall at AT if you really want to see.

buffalobunch
07/19/2007, 09:23 AM
<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=10369681#post10369681 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by PhxPhish
I think senator might be coming off a bit strong but it's definitely warranted; Just pointing all his angst and frustration towards one single individual. Considering the fact he's been in the business for 15 years he more than likely has seen his fair share of people who are just plain oblivious to what's going on in their tank.

I have 2 simple questions for you...
1. What size tank were these wrasses in?
2. If you really truly cared so much about the health of the fish and "just want her to be happy" then why would it really matter how much credit you received back for her? I would sooner give my fish away to someone who could take care of it then trade it into any store.
I have a 120g tank with a 4-5" hippo tang, a flame angel, a pair of true percs, a pink spotted goby and the lineatus pair. I felt she would be a good addition. I think if I would have added her when I added the pair last month I would have been fine. In response to the second question, I care deeply for all of my pets. It was lucky that pets inc was getting males in. I called AT first because I knew that they had 4 supermales last month. I would not of taken her to pets inc if they had not been getting males in. If it were about the money, I would have just sold her on here. To me it was about her mental wellbeing. Being in a 10 x10 cube since November was something that had been bothering me. I wanted to get her with a mate. I knew she'd have a better chance of getting a big tank if she had a supermale with her. I should not have bashed AT for what they offer. Bad buffalo!!

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=10369353#post10369353 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by senatormoe31
Well, I wasn't trying to attack anyone in specific, or at all, in the first place. I didn't know that the simple use of CAPS would inspire such hate, but o.k. i won't use them anymore. And i don't know who pupfish is but you don't know me or my knowledge level (and by the way I know and have spent an hour or so talking with M. MOE) but I was just expressing an opinion with about 15 yrs of continuous salt experience. If you don't like it, meaning my advise, then write something helpful, not just pat people on the back and hand um a hanky and lollie. :> that's all I'm sayin. you and reef girl etc. are being the haters, I am trying to help. Just so ya know reef girl I am light hearted and easy going and don't need a literature lesson from you, but you are talking about fictional things/and your feelings in relation to living entities. that's all. sorry if i hurt any feelings. I'll tip-toe thru YOUR world so as not to offend.
Is Conrad back in town?:lmao:
Sorry senator, if you frequent AT as much as I think you do you'll get that joke. Conrad's way of giving information sometimes was somewhat overbearing. I am not a hater. Nor do I call myself an expert. I am far from that. I named the thread I made a mistake, because I did. I did want to impose my "imagined harmony" into my tank and it didn't work. I was putting the thread out there though so maybe someone could reap my mistake. A lineatus pair is a great find. They are few and far between.
For everyone that said kind words about me, THANKS!! It means alot. I do try to make my posts funny. I like to make people laugh. So this thread to me is a little cruddy. Senator, lets put this behind us. I realize my mistake and hopefully you realize that presenting info in a nicer fashion would be better.

random_ryan
07/19/2007, 10:21 AM
senatormoe31 I more than anyone know here how people who do not know me or think they know me can reaspond. althou 95% of the time I have to read what I am posting before I post it. thing is if you post something offencive people get offencive. also if your gonna act like a jerk expect to be treated as if. My experiance here on the frag forum has not all been pleasant. althou once people get to know me they understand.

I will tell you that if you would have came off the way you did towards bufflobunch on me I would have become defencive too. sometimes you have to stop and think about how your wording things.

I strongly recomend you rereading her post. Her Thread starter clearly states I MADE A MISTAKE.

I feel that you owe her and appology for your stupidity of tring to make her feel like she did something wrong. Thats JMO.

kirstenk
07/19/2007, 11:09 AM
This thread is cracking me up!! It is such a great example of human nature and how we react when the shoe is on the other foot.

Buffalo...reference your post to scuba on 6/21.

sometimes you have to stop and think about how your wording things.

I feel that you owe her and appology for your stupidity of tring to make her feel like she did something wrong. Thats JMO.

You could have followed your advice if you had left out calling senator stupid. Don't cha think he may go defensive now?

slowradio
07/19/2007, 11:30 AM
<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=10371309#post10371309 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by kirstenk
You could have followed your advice if you had left out calling senator stupid. Don't cha think he may go defensive now?

yup.

buffalobunch
07/19/2007, 11:59 AM
Like I said previously, I was wrong for saying AT was pretencious. My bad. However, I have clearly stated I was wrong. I wanted someone to gain a beautiful pair of fish from my mistake. For every mistake made, there is a lesson to be learned. There is also the thought of always finding a positive in a situation that is at the time negative. I found a solution. I perhaps shared too much of what I thought. I never thought a thread about bad choice on my part would turn into this.
Kirsten if this is what you are talking about(post from 6/21 to scuba)
Seriously Dude, that's your mistake not theirs. IF you had done your research you would have known that clown gobies do that. They perch or host on corals. It is not the LFS responsiblility to educate you. Its ridiculous in this hobby to expect them to maintain a store, animals etc and tell YOU what to do. The next time you see something you like, go home, research it and THINK about all possiblilities. YOU are responsible for learning in this hobby. Educate yourself. Don't expect that a store is going to be able to tell you what an animal is going to do in your tank. Furthermore, did you ask them if the animal didn't work out would they give all of your money back or just partial credit? Or did you just ASSUME? All LFS stores have this policy. It is to ensure that the customer takes some responsibility in choosing the right animals. How do they know that your tank doesn't have ich? Or maybe this is an animal that is sensitive to transportation? These are the things from their end that makes them only give you partial credit. Ich takes 4 weeks to show up. Which means they have to put that fish back in their system and take the gamble. I hope you see my point and accept some responsibility for your own actions. Talk to some of the other LFS too. I bet you'll find that they all have the same policy, you take it home and want to bring it back = partial credit. Please make more educated buys and stop laying blame on the LFS. I NEVER buy something without weighing all of the possibilities. If you would have posted a thread or read about that fish, I bet with all of the other's experiences you wouldn't have bought it. End of rant

I did do some research. Lineatus are like Anthias, they like a harem. My male is not a super male. It is still juvenile. I thought by giving him another female he would color up better. I even was standing there talking to Phil and Skip about my choice. Neither of the 2 said "that's a bad idea". I believe it would have worked if the 2 females had been introduce at the same time. I have a soft heart. Seeing that fish down there for the last month, month and a half was really bothering me. Going from a 15g tank to a 120g...Wow, she could really swim and have a far better life. Unfortunately, I took a chance and it did not work out for me. Fortunately it did for her, because I called last night to see how she was doing and the pair is already gone. I had hoped it would be a fellow reefer from rc. That is why I posted my mistake. I wanted to be able to know where she went.

Philwd
07/19/2007, 12:20 PM
Yeah I didn't say it was a bad idea. I've seen lots of people add females. Sometimes it's just the fish. I would not have thought in a 120 there would be that much of a problem. I was looking to add the exact same one to my tank. I do wish I had remembered to mention how to introduce new wrasses to a tank with some already present. You don't always need to do this but for those cases where one goes psycho on you it really helps.

Obviously you really care about your fish. And you did more research than most. Don't beat yourself up. Sometimes you just have to let the fish sort it out for a couple days.

buffalobunch
07/19/2007, 12:22 PM
thanks Phil. I am just glad it worked out for the fish. I didn't think it was going to be a problem either.

kirstenk
07/19/2007, 02:02 PM
Kirsten if this is what you are talking about(post from 6/21 to scuba)

Yes...that was the post. :) My reference was not to the content of your response. It was all good advice as was senator's. But, ya both used caps and the overall tones elicited reactionary, defensive responses.

When I first read senator's post I thought....."OMG, Scuba has come back with an alias!!!" :lol:

Obviously you really care about your fish. And you did more research than most. Don't beat yourself up. Sometimes you just have to let the fish sort it out for a couple days.

I agree and I am glad she has a new beau and home. :D

buffalobunch
07/19/2007, 02:04 PM
Just got off of the phone with Holly from Pets inc. The guy that has been waiting for 2 years for a pair of Lineatus wrasses had also wanted a supermale. He bought all 3!! She and her new boyfriend have an awesome home Holly said. Lots of corals. I'm so happy I could just pee my pants!! :D :lmao:

Reef-o-Roni
07/19/2007, 03:26 PM
<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=10370453#post10370453 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by senatormoe31
And, just to let Reef-a-roni know; I will be posting as many pics as I can as soon as I get a descent camera over here to record some shots.
I've got 3 pairs of gobies/dartfish spawning regularly and would love to share pics and info with others who have the same thing.
The three pairs are:
Ptereleotris grammica
Paragobiodon lacunicolus
gobiodon okinawae
I had a fourth pair --Priolepis nocturnus, but the female became gravid and then developed an internal parasite or something and dissappeared one day with no trace and with no outward signs of ill health. I think ( based on some research ) that she had an intestinal worm.
ANYWAY... I ramble
but look for the thread marked "Gobies"

Pics of my tanks are on the customer picture wall at AT if you really want to see.

Definetly excited on seeing a mature sps tank.Mine is but alot of little hairy sticks.But they are nice little sticks..

senatormoe31
07/19/2007, 05:55 PM
I guess all is good.
Everybody seems ok
there was some chasing and nipping
but all seems good now.



Does this sound familiar to anyone???
HEHEHE

senatormoe31
07/19/2007, 05:56 PM
AND, i can say for certain that Konrad is NOT back in town.

senatormoe31
07/19/2007, 05:58 PM
Wanna know how I know?



Go fish.

Reef-o-Roni
07/19/2007, 06:50 PM
Shure has been alot of name calling around here lately,Must be the heat..
<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=10371460#post10371460 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by slowradio
yup.

widefx
07/20/2007, 01:39 AM
<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=10374131#post10374131 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by senatormoe31
Wanna know how I know?



Go fish.


Fishing